Core Issues With 4.x Dark Knight

[Chrono_Rising]

First, I personally didn't claim anything proving DRK to be superior, I was asking an information...that can't be provided.

Maybe you haven't directly said it yet but wait for it...

Besides, since PLD (And WAR) lose more DPS than DRK by staying in tank stance (keep in mind losing more doesn't equal being lower), it's understandable that a fight with tank swaps would also benefit them by spreading mitigation needs and allowing more DPS stance uptime, even at low percentile.

There it is. This is a claim not an established fact (even though it is said like one), and I figured it would be your claim from our earlier discussions in July. It is similar to the claim to which I originally responded in this thread.

Heres the thing, there is no evidence for this claim. Not from first hand testimonials, not in the volumes of savage stats collected on another site, and not the SSS dummies. There is evidence, though as you have pointed out it is not proof, that the opposite statement is correct. That Paladin and Warrior lose more going into tank stance is not supported by any observable metric, nor has anyone provided any evidence to the contrary. My point is that despite trying to poke holes in the evidence against dark knight, I still have evidence, though admittedly there are further questions surrounding it. The claim you have made has no support. Maybe your statement is correct, but I have as much evidence for this as I have evidence for a teapot in space orbiting the sun (Russel's Teapot if I'm specific).

More to the point, even if your claim were true, it does nothing except justify that dark knight would act in a "main tank" role for groups who do not tank swap and have a high uptime on tank stance. However, it still suffers from having no evidence, and for it to make sense as a point in this discussion it means that a significant amount of players at a lower percentile also have this awareness and actively use it to their advantage (there is no evidence of this either).

Without this point we have no reason to believe that Dark Knight is skewed in favor of MT at lower percentiles and with the number of paladins and warriors it is impossible that they are all OT all the time. It might skew the numbers slightly but remember we are playing in a time when for every 1 Dark Knight there are approximately 2 paladins and 1.5 warriors doing savage.

[SyzzleSpark]

snip

But in Defiance WAR's Fell Cleave turns into a 437.5 potency attack that heals them and cuts their incoming damage by 20% for 6 seconds, so obviously it has suffered the worst injustice here.

Poe's law, don't fail me now.

First, I personally didn't claim anything proving DRK to be superior, I was asking an information...that can't be provided. Besides, since PLD (And WAR) lose more DPS than DRK by staying in tank stance (keep in mind losing more doesn't equal being lower), it's understandable that a fight with tank swaps would also benefit them by spreading mitigation needs and allowing more DPS stance uptime, even at low percentile.

The primary point to make with regards to your posts is that they are muddying the discussion by diverting attention away from the matter at hand with ephemeral discrepancies in perceived performance based on varying uses of individual skills, or stance usage, across percentiles that statistically are inconsequential in the scope of job balance as a whole, and which can be measured regardless of statistical subsets with the data that we actually DO have.

You're basically red-herring-ing everyone away from the implications of data that actually exists to try and talk about the implications of data that doesn't exist or that measures variations that are a very small part of an already measurable whole (Plunge or Holy Spirit usage across percentiles, the number of full-time Grit DRKs vs. full-time Defiance/ShO tanks at one specific very low percentile), effectively distracting people from the fire burning down a house by calling attention to the flames from the neighbor's grill.

[Chrono_Rising]

But in Defiance WAR's Fell Cleave turns into a 437.5 potency attack that heals them and cuts their incoming damage by 20% for 6 seconds, so obviously it has suffered the worst injustice here.

Poe's law, don't fail me now.

Buff it to 600 dps in tank stance.

Poe's Law certified :^)

The primary point to make with regards to your posts is that they are muddying the discussion by diverting attention away from the matter at hand with ephemeral discrepancies in perceived performance based on varying uses of individual skills, or stance usage, across percentiles that statistically are inconsequential in the scope of job balance as a whole, and which can be measured regardless of statistical subsets with the data that we actually DO have.

You're basically red-herring-ing everyone away from the implications of data that actually exists to try and talk about the implications of data that doesn't exist or that measures variations that are a very small part of an already measurable whole (Plunge or Holy Spirit usage across percentiles, the number of full-time Grit DRKs vs. full-time Defiance/ShO tanks at one specific very low percentile), effectively distracting people from the fire burning down a house by calling attention to the flames from the neighbor's grill.

You took the words out of my mouth.