Monk

[Hyleman]

As for MNK, the only other job I've ever seen using hand-to-hand in some reliable way in the history of Final Fantasy is... Puppetmaster. :P So that's why it's the only other job that comes to my mind to associate with the Pugilist class.

Would love to see Puppetmaster in XIV! Although a "Pet" system is probably a whole other topic in itself for this game...

[yukikaze_yanagi]

Sure, who need buffers in a game ?
Or a tank
Or an healer <_< all this classes exist so dd can do their job. Saying you don't want to rely on an another class it's..shortsighted

[Vackashken]

Sure, who need buffers in a game ?
Or a tank
Or an healer <_< all this classes exist so dd can do their job. Saying you don't want to rely on an another class it's..shortsighted

Are you brain dead or just deliberately being thick? A DD who is not a mage should not need constant MP supply from another source. Mages and Tanks are different because they aren't a dime a dozen while we can be replaced for less "hands on care" class by several other DD types.

The shortsightedness is based on a DD needing a MP supplier when so many others don't. Sorry, no I don't want to be passed up instantly because I am higher maintenance if a brd isn't around.

[yukikaze_yanagi]

Are you brain dead or just deliberately being thick? A DD who is not a mage should not need constant MP supply from another source. Mages and Tanks are different because they aren't a dime a dozen while we can be replaced for less "hands on care" class by several other DD types.

The shortsightedness is based on a DD needing a MP supplier when so many others don't. Sorry, no I don't want to be passed up instantly because I am higher maintenance if a brd isn't around.

Late on the party, but...step aside the attitude you showed in previuses posts, in a lot of games a lot of physical DD use mana as a resource. Your statement is invalid.

[Wicka]

OK, I am not even close to the endgame stuff (just started xiv about a month ago). But I have played my share of games, and even designed a few. Any class that uses it's fists to beat the tar out of it's opponents is always my favorite. And I have to say that the mechanics behind PUG combat are very sound.

As a simple example:

PUG maintains consistent damage output through AA mostly, with considerable complimentary damage through nice weapon-skills. Overall, keeping pace with other DD classes.

Through the use of MP, the PUG's AutoAttack becomes better, even surpassing the damage output of similar classes. And as a counter-weight to the delicate high-wire act that is multi-player gaming, the MP must be managed by the player because it is a limited resource. This creates balance, and calls for the player to be actively monitoring his resources.

I believe (didn't feel like going and finding that post) that Vack likened the PUG/MONK's viability in party play to an ebb/flow, tide-like mechanic that is undesirable. And this is true in part. It is true that the PUG/MONK has an ebb/flow mechanic. But this works, because of the way the class is designed.

Combat works like this for PUG:
Straight AA > Modified AA > Straight AA (because MP is gone) with a sprinkling of ability bursting mixed throughout.

And because the PUG has MP regenerating abilities built in, it is obvious that it was DESIGNED to ebb and flow. So you go from very high damage output, to an output that is still comparable to other classes while you regain MP through feather-foot and sucker-punch, back to high damage as you begin to toggle your stances back on.

Also, I think I should point out that the above IS your 'optimum' state. NEEDING a bard in order to be at your optimal state is a fallacy. The bard's job as a buffer class is to push others 'beyond' their optimum. Does buffing not enhance the defense of the tank, which in turn allows him to tank more? Same with healing. If anything, bard is the class that requires others to be efficient. Having a bard on board will allow the PUG/MONK to not even have to take a breather.

In summation:

[silverdragontyr]

Considering Yoshi said Jobs are made for party play, and having a job that literally every party will have assist is not that big a deal. Furthermore if your complaining you can't manage MP, or that you suck when you don't have MP, well then you are just a bad Pgl/Mnk sorry. It's not that hard to watch your MP, and Pgl does good damage even without MP, that's just an added effect. So whine all you want, but if you don't like it find a new class then.

[Vackashken]

Considering Yoshi said Jobs are made for party play, and having a job that literally every party will have assist is not that big a deal. Furthermore if your complaining you can't manage MP, or that you suck when you don't have MP, well then you are just a bad Pgl/Mnk sorry. It's not that hard to watch your MP, and Pgl does good damage even without MP, that's just an added effect. So whine all you want, but if you don't like it find a new class then.

......... uh huh.

I can't your asinine post serious either. Talk about talking out your arse.

[NoctisUmbra]

.......... uh huh

......... uh huh.

I can't your asinine post serious either. Talk about talking out your arse.

After those 2 posts I wouldn't expect anyone to really take you seriously Vack. I mean it's fine to not be aware of a design purpose, or simply not know something - but to behave as if you know what you're talking about while you clearly don't just comes off as ignorant, and perhaps slightly amusing even lol.

I like how I talk about MNK, a job, being supported by BRD in party play - being that jobs are being designed primarily for Full Party scenarios - and your response is:

I do not wish to rely on another class to be optimized.

I rest my case.

[Vackashken]

Are you having trouble keeping up with me or something? Reading comprehension not your thing? Listen, you can try and cut it anyway you want - or come up with some ridiculous presumption of "blah blah blah, you don't know what you're talking about" crap but it doesn't change my point.

Pug/Mnk will need a brd more then any other making instantly weaker (in the selection process of making a party) more so then any other DD job. There are no BS ornamental words, retarded diatribe or what I am sure you think it witty retorts that will change that. Nothing you say can or will change that. It is a crutch in comparison to other DD jobs.

Feel free to puke up some more of your bloviating if you want though. I love a good work of laughable fiction.

[Evaddaragon]

While I understand that Vack's attitude is questionable, I do not think there's any official word about the exact design function of a job.

While it's true that Yohsi-P himself mentionned something of the sort, it would be wise to be reminded that it was in interviews that predated even the LIVE letters, and patch 1.20. At that moment, the job system was still, and I emphasize it : "under development". Which, with due respects to another's opinion, means that it can change.

Therefore, while your opinion is phrased in a much better way, Noctis, it isn't anything more than speculation and conjecture at the moment, be it as well-thought as it is.

As for you Vack, you may not wish to rely on another class to be optimized, but it would be wise that you remember that this is a MMORPG, which stands for Massively MULTIPLAYER Online Role-Playing Game. You'll never be as powerful on your own as you are with people. Sure enough, a feature that I like so far with FFXIV is that while there are things that require party play to be done, quite a fair bit of it is also done solo. However, even the solo content gets much easier with people. As the game itself says when you get a full party, there is "Strength in Numbers".