~Poll~ Longer fights <Do you want it?>

[Alhanelem]

You say systems like enfeebling effects and combo system are not effected by fight length and you couldn't be anymore wrong

That's not what I said, but I'm not wrong, I'm right. Just as with buffs, this game has been favoring more potent but shorter duration effects. An enfeeble doesn't have to last a minute or two to have its effect. 15-20 seconds is plenty.

We're never going to see eye to eye here. You don't seem to understand. I'm not advocating for fights to be as short as humanly possible. I'm advocating for combat to be more polished- this means making combat better in its technical aspects, not saying "Fights must last at least X seconds or they are unfun." There is no set duration of time required to make a fight fun or interesting. <30 second fights can be fun, and >30 second fights can be unfun- How much fun a fight is does not necessarily depend on length. Period, end of story.

I feel like part of the reason you want an arbitrary minimum time for a fight is to slow down XPing- If they increased the average time a fight takes, I would demand more EXP per fight to compensate.

Endgame battles are already of reasonable length. Thus this really only concerns EXP grinding, and frankly, I'd rather my EXP grinding be over as quickly as possible, because that's not the part of the game I enjoy the most.

For every player's who doesnt want grind- Why don't you play Street fighter or mortal kombat C.c.. instead of MMO?

That's like saying if I like speed, why not play a racing game instead of a puzzle game? The answer is because it's the kind of game I like. Not every game in the same genre is the same. I hate tournament fighters. Your comment is probably one of the stupidest I've ever read in my life. Funny thing though, fighting games are an example of combat that is often fast yet intricate. But that alone doesn't make the game for me. I like the story, the epic bosses, the exploration, cooperating with others, etc. of MMOs- street fighter and mortal kombat don't have that. Grinding is the only thing I don't like.

As I've said before, making fights longer doesn't make them automatically more interesting. Good combat mechanics are what make a fight interesting. Forcing the fight to last a certain amount of time doesn't achieve that.

[Jynx]

Thus this really only concerns EXP grinding, and frankly, I'd rather my EXP grinding be over as quickly as possible, because that's not the part of the game I enjoy the most.

Good for you, some people here think that the exp is the part of the game they enjoy the most.

I've allready told you we will never see eye to eye on this subject, I'm not asking for a arbitrary time lengthening either but the fights are too damn short as it stands. Obviously a better polished system would have longer lasting battles with rewarding gameplay.

I'm not asking someone to auto-attack for 5 minutes and stare the monster in the eye for the whole duration. We both want a better combat system, we just don't agree on what that is.

[Rokien]

That's not what I said, but I'm not wrong, I'm right. Just as with buffs, this game has been favoring more potent but shorter duration effects. An enfeeble doesn't have to last a minute or two to have its effect. 15-20 seconds is plenty.

We're never going to see eye to eye here. You don't seem to understand. I'm not advocating for fights to be as short as humanly possible. I'm advocating for combat to be more polished- this means making combat better in its technical aspects, not saying "Fights must last at least X seconds or they are unfun." There is no set duration of time required to make a fight fun or interesting. <30 second fights can be fun, and >30 second fights can be unfun- How much fun a fight is does not necessarily depend on length. Period, end of story.

I feel like part of the reason you want an arbitrary minimum time for a fight is to slow down XPing- If they increased the average time a fight takes, I would demand more EXP per fight to compensate.

Endgame battles are already of reasonable length. Thus this really only concerns EXP grinding, and frankly, I'd rather my EXP grinding be over as quickly as possible, because that's not the part of the game I enjoy the most.

That's like saying if I like speed, why not play a racing game instead of a puzzle game? The answer is because it's the kind of game I like. Not every game in the same genre is the same. I hate tournament fighters. Your comment is probably one of the stupidest I've ever read in my life. Funny thing though, fighting games are an example of combat that is often fast yet intricate. But that alone doesn't make the game for me. I like the story, the epic bosses, the exploration, cooperating with others, etc. of MMOs- street fighter and mortal kombat don't have that. Grinding is the only thing I don't like.

As I've said before, making fights longer doesn't make them automatically more interesting. Good combat mechanics are what make a fight interesting. Forcing the fight to last a certain amount of time doesn't achieve that.

maaan, must really suck to be you. Every other rpg game I play consists of fights that are longer than 10 seconds. Heck even FPS have longer fights.

Also, not going to go back and quote other things but seems like your main focus of your argument is "I feel like part of the reason you want an arbitrary minimum time for a fight is to slow down XPing- If they increased the average time a fight takes, I would demand more EXP per fight to compensate."

As I stated and others have stated throughout this thread, exp would be adjusted. I said "The longer fights would have adjusted exp for em as well. So, the whole "Get less exp" argument is out of the window as well."

So don't even bring that up, EVER!

"An enfeeble doesn't have to last a minute or two to have its effect. 15-20 seconds is plenty."

What mob even lasts for 15-20 seconds, you sir are crazy. Any debuff(enfeeble) spells are pointless in this current build.

[Hyrist]

maaan, must really suck to be you. Every other rpg game I play consists of fights that are longer than 10 seconds. Heck even FPS have longer fights.

Yet it only takes one good bullet to the head in an FPS to kill someone.

I think you're misunderstanding the concept here. The idea is that fodder mobs should remain fodder mobs. That means SOME monsters should be dead inside 10 seconds. Not all of them, which is the problem the game is really suffering. Your policy is the opposite extreme to the problem, which you are saying "NO" monsters should be dead inside 10 seconds, which would cause the same problem on the opposite vien.

There should be balance between weaker and stronger monsters. The end result is longer fights, sure, but the emphasis is that the fights have more depth to them rather than just being harder for the sake of higher HP pools across the board.

Roiken, you suffer from not having any depth in your conversation. You will flood the boards with haphazard ideas without substance and therefore even if the intended meaning you convey is one that's agreeable, because you leave yourself so ambiguous, people disagree with your expression, and that becomes the focus of the conversation, rather than the goal.

As a word of advice, really sit down and take the time to think your complaints and ideas through before you express them. I'm not sure you understand that your meaning isn't getting across and you become so focused on the way you say things that you become inflexible in how to achieve your goals, and the same goes for the opponents of your threads.

[Rokien]

Yet it only takes one good bullet to the head in an FPS to kill someone.

I think you're misunderstanding the concept here. The idea is that fodder mobs should remain fodder mobs. That means SOME monsters should be dead inside 10 seconds. Not all of them, which is the problem the game is really suffering. Your policy is the opposite extreme to the problem, which you are saying "NO" monsters should be dead inside 10 seconds, which would cause the same problem on the opposite vien.

There should be balance between weaker and stronger monsters. The end result is longer fights, sure, but the emphasis is that the fights have more depth to them rather than just being harder for the sake of higher HP pools across the board.

Roiken, you suffer from not having any depth in your conversation. You will flood the boards with haphazard ideas without substance and therefore even if the intended meaning you convey is one that's agreeable, because you leave yourself so ambiguous, people disagree with your expression, and that becomes the focus of the conversation, rather than the goal.

As a word of advice, really sit down and take the time to think your complaints and ideas through before you express them. I'm not sure you understand that your meaning isn't getting across and you become so focused on the way you say things that you become inflexible in how to achieve your goals, and the same goes for the opponents of your threads.

Weaker mob takes a few minutes to kill, stronger mob takes 20 mins to kill, I still don't see the point you are trying to make. Ya, mobs should take a few seconds to kill when they are level 1~

Also babe, people agree with me all the time.

Just look how many people are not agreeing with you. LOL

[Hyrist]

Weaker mob takes a few minutes to kill, stronger mob takes 20 mins to kill, I still don't see the point you are trying to make. Ya, mobs should take a few seconds to kill when they are level 1~

Also babe, people agree with me all the time.

Just look how many people are not agreeing with you. LOL

Don't call me babe. I'm older than you and way out of your league.

I'm also male.

And people disagree with me all the time because I play the devil's advocate all the time. Disagreeing with people is intentional as it tests the integrity of their argument.

Something you lack, by the way.

20 minutes is a Boss Fight. 1 Minute is an Encounter. An encounter can range between one moderately tough monster to several fodder mobs that each die in 10 seconds or any variance in-between.

Point being, even some level 50 monsters should die in short order.

[Rannie]

So, I'm wondering if people would like longer fights. The reason why I bring this up is, the fights are REALLY short in this game. I'm leveling up thm and the only spells I use are; Thunder, Thundara, which makes the mobs go down. There really isn't any reason for me to use the other spells/abilities or combos(can you even get combos off?). Which will bring me to my next point, longer fights will teach you how to use those other abilities. If things go wrong, you will also learn what to do in a panic situation for ifrit,moogle, and other big fights. The longer fights would have adjusted exp for em as well. So, the whole "Get less exp" argument is out of the window as well.

So, would you guys like longer fights that are more engaging?

Vote NO here!

Question is is this in a party setting or non party setting. are you soloing or not and also if it's solo the ifrit and moogle thing is voided because with certain classes/jobs are played a different way. when I solo on lnc/drg i can't get behind my oppenent like i could if i were in a party so i can only use certain combos that are available. aka leg sweep and a couple of others. In the end with one mob around my lvl it takes me a few minutes or so to fight or even longer if I'm going after a mob that's at most 2 levels higher than I am. Using thm wasn't the best example and now most people have no aoe attacks anymore either unless they're tp moves

[Hyrist]

I'll put it this way, if they inflate the lenght of the battle simply by expanding Mobs' HP pools, I'm going to be ticked.

If they make the fights more interesting by giving them beter behavior patterns and resistances, I should be ok with it.

But we honestly need a better party XP system than simply killing monsters out on the field, it's trite and boring no matter how long the individual fights are. And it teaches players nothing of endgame tactics they need to learn. I want real training runs for players.

[Hyrist]

Alright Jynx then let's clear the air.

No smoke and mirrors, no complaints about what is. I want to hear your ideal system for leveling up in parties. Start to finish.

Warning: Just so you know, I'm going to pick it apart when you're done.

[Jynx]

I want to hear your ideal system for leveling up in parties. Start to finish.

By no means is this a perfect example of how exp party battles should be but I'll give it a go at saying how I feel a proper battle should pan out for exp parties looking for optimal experience.

1. Have a full party with the basics Tank/Healer/DD
2. Look for monsters 5-7 levels higher than you are for optimal experience.
3. Linking monsters of the same race/alliance is a real danger so avoiding sight/sound/scent links is crucial.

10-15 seconds
One of the DD's can be designated as puller who will tag the monster that the party will be fighting in a safer location than in the middle of the monsters spawn area (If you are fighting weaker monsters closer to your level you may be comfortable handling links and pops)

-5 seconds
The designated tank will then draw agro towards themselves with a nice enough hate spike to keep hate through the application of debuffs that should start as soon as the tank establishes hate.

-10 Seconds
Meele engage while debuffs are landing all the while holding back a bit to avoid drawing hate from the monster, positioning themselves in proper defensive/offensive positions for their attack/defensive skills to proc.

*Something like this but more focus on positioning depending on what type of monster you face*

AOE moves wont always just target the tank and can sometimes exist just to keep DPS on their toes to avoid a tail lash if any member is behind the monster it adds that attack to it's selection when using a TP move.

-30 seconds
Meele and magic DPS focus down the monster while using abillities to regain HP and MP so the next fight wont have them missing many resources to allow for continual pulling.

-10 seconds
Puller runs out to get next mob while support classes place buffs on allies and prepare for the next battle.

Without proper debuffs monsters will be much more dangerous than if crippled beforehand but sometimes the risk to save MP may pay off if your party knows how to avoid taking alot of damage and the tank can mitigate enough to allow the support classes to spend/recover mp instead.

So yeah about a minute per battle allowing Meele to feel usefull, mages to do more than just toss out AOE cures, and the tank to actually be able to hold hate and feel like it was usefull.