When dps dont aoe should they just get kicked from the start?

[bswpayton]

[QUOTE=bswpayton;4409422]That's y tanks have df cool downs in many situations those big adds with lots of up don't have to be taken out first. U can take out the small adds first then burst the larger one's down. For example in the level 69 dungeon I pull all the adds prior to the pack before u go outside, if u don't aoe there either the healer will be low on mana or the tank will be out of cool downs. U can't just pic one to burst down [ /QUOTE]

[TouchandFeel]

To me it all comes down to whether or not people are trying.

If you are new, learning, etc. and are struggling a bit but are trying, then I will stick with you the whole way and run out the timer doing my best to help you succeed both in the content and in learning and improving.

If you just don't want to bother even trying, well then I don't want you in my group. Expecting to just have the other members of the group accept dragging your dead weight through content is incredibly disrespectful to the other players and their time. I am not your dungeon chauffeur. You know what I do when I don't really feel up to running something and I know I would just half-ass it if I did? I don't queue for it.

Also, slacking off in this manner makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to me. You end up making things more difficult for yourself, and everyone else, by causing more screw-ups and making things take longer by actively not trying than just putting in a modicum of effort and making things go so much faster and smoother. It just results in more overall effort spread out over a greater period of time because you wanted to try to force putting in less effort at any one moment.

As to the initial question posed at the beginning of the thread.
I would say mention it in a polite and respectful manner. If they respond rudely or state that they just don't care to bother trying, then go ahead and initiate a vote kick.

Taking advantage of AoE attacks for large groups of enemies should be DPS 101 as well as the conclusion of basic arithmetic and common sense, rare special case scenarios being the exception.

[Sorciechan]

Well, you're entitled to do what you want within the TOS, but, my advice is that you take a walk in another's shoes and play some other classes before you go and start picking of dps because you expect them ALL to aoe ALL of the time. Especially, if you're the type to pull more than you may be able to tank or the type that pull everything, including mobs that should be handled separately. Those situations aren't too rare that you can just bulldoze through any dungeon.

[Hruodig]

I usually ask them to aoe if I see that I pulled 8 mobs and they're sitting there using single target abilities. Most comply, some don't, I kick the latter. It's pretty simple. It's not an "opinion" that aoe is more effective and efficient, and if you're using single target abilities when I've pulled more than 4 mobs, you're either new (at level 70? really?), lazy, or you don't respect other people's time. If your "personal playstyle" is to single target burn big trash mobs, maybe XIV isn't the game for you.

[SendohJin]

my advice is that you take a walk in another's shoes and play some other classes before you go and start picking of dps because you expect them ALL to aoe ALL of the time.

i've played every job to at least 61, nobody says ALL of the time but they can all do it just fine (except SMN pre-70 but that's cause SE broke them).

[Andevom]

The LB thing is annoying but not noticing it seems to be a weird debuff that affects the most appropriate LB user from time to time. I play in a group of friends and the same people always manage the LB yet I'm forever reminding them about it (and occasionally passive aggressively using it as healer just to demonstrate its existence) because of this strange selective blindness

My problem is when I'm in a group with a caster, who I can just tell is waiting for that LB bar to fill so they can use it. If there's a melee DPS in the group, there's no reason to immediately fire off a Caster LB on a single target boss. Ever. But it happens all the time.

[bswpayton]

Well, you're entitled to do what you want within the TOS, but, my advice is that you take a walk in another's shoes and play some other classes before you go and start picking of dps because you expect them ALL to aoe ALL of the time. Especially, if you're the type to pull more

I have almost all my jobs 70 , I don't expect raid dps. Simply literally saying just using the right skills at the right time. Like I said early if ur a dps, and ur hitting one target then who is hitting the others ? So if u know it's not u then obviously ur not trying as much as u could

[Snow_Princess]

Personally I would just ask them, but I'm old fashioned like that. A lot of people level up solo or by playing very suboptimally because the game isn't very hard and even playing terribly works fine for 99% of dungeonsituations. They might genuinely not know, or have forgotten about the useless AoE abilities they shoved on a secondary hotbar months ago. Or be traumatised by terrible tanks who lose AoE hate the moment someone throws out a Fire2.

If they're jerks about it, kick away.

The LB thing is annoying but not noticing it seems to be a weird debuff that affects the most appropriate LB user from time to time. I play in a group of friends and the same people always manage the LB yet I'm forever reminding them about it (and occasionally passive aggressively using it as healer just to demonstrate its existence) because of this strange selective blindness

This, even with the healer lb thing I do that because of it too.

Ask them and if not aoeing is causing problems (like things not dying fast enough, stressing your healing or even wipe from it, you are in full right to kick them

I usually ask them to aoe if I see that I pulled 8 mobs and they're sitting there using single target abilities. Most comply, some don't, I kick the latter. It's pretty simple. It's not an "opinion" that aoe is more effective and efficient, and if you're using single target abilities when I've pulled more than 4 mobs, you're either new (at level 70? really?), lazy, or you don't respect other people's time. If your "personal playstyle" is to single target burn big trash mobs, maybe XIV isn't the game for you.

also this

[HyoMinPark]

Well, you're entitled to do what you want within the TOS, but, my advice is that you take a walk in another's shoes and play some other classes before you go and start picking of dps because you expect them ALL to aoe ALL of the time.

I just want to point out, that it's also not fair to expect a tank and/or healer to deal with DPS single-targeting larger pulls of 3+ mobs (since 3+ is generally the "rule" for all DPS when it comes to AOE, although there are exceptions--for example, BRD actually benefits more from multi-dotting and using Rain of Death on any packs that are 2 or more mobs: 100 potency per mob versus 130 potency of Bloodletter; a MNK's Arm of the Destroyer is actually not a DPS gain until there are 5+ mobs; etc.).

Healers do not have infinite resources, nor do tanks. The longer trash stays alive, the more likely it is one or the other will use all their resources. Tank runs out of cooldowns? Well, now the healer has to spam heal them and cannot contribute to DPS. This is made worse if the tank's gear is poor or the healer's gear is poor. And that just makes runs last longer--and I do mean longer than "a couple minutes"--try 10-15 minutes if things are really bad.

I've also been in situations where I am the only one AOEing large pulls (on BRD). I also do not have infinite resources, and Invigorate/Tactician both have cooldowns. There is no reason to not AOE larger packs. And even some of the "single packs" in SB dungeons are 5-6 mobs, so there's no way for a tank to "pull less" with regards to those (before someone says this can be rectified by just pulling smaller).

Also, want to point out the hypocrisy in the idea of refusing to adjust to the group, because why should one do that, but expecting the group to adjust to a single player (i.e., the DPS not AOEing). It's one thing to adjust for a poorly geared tank or healer that cannot handle larger pulls. It's another to adjust because a DPS can't be bothered to use their AOE rotation, something they should all know by the time they're level 50 at the latest, since most AOE rotations do not change much from 50 to 70 (there are some exceptions, but majority of them are not).

Especially, if you're the type to pull more than you may be able to tank or the type that pull everything, including mobs that should be handled separately. Those situations aren't too rare that you can just bulldoze through any dungeon.

As said above, it's a different scenario if the tank or healer cannot actually handle a large pull due to poor gear or whatnot versus a DPS that just refuses to AOE because they're lazy.



With regards to the topic, I suggest kindly bringing it to the DPS' attention that "Hey AOE rotation is actually higher potency in this situation than single-target" and provide numbers and or a sequence if you are knowledgeable enough to. If the DPS refuses to cooperate and/or gets unnecessarily hostile, then the party can decide if they want to carry a lazy and/or hostile player or not. I would not just outright kick without a polite word first.

[Snow_Princess]

With regards to the topic, I suggest kindly bringing it to the DPS' attention that "Hey AOE rotation is actually higher potency in this situation than single-target" and provide numbers and or a sequence if you are knowledgeable enough to. If the DPS refuses to cooperate and/or gets unnecessarily hostile, then the party can decide if they want to carry a lazy and/or hostile player or not. I would not just outright kick without a polite word first.

That or comment on how single targeting in a large pack is causing hate control problems. I seen that before and you really need to comment it on it, esp as a healer, dealing with "2 tanks" is really stressful. But ya, in the end of the day say/ask and if they are hostile kick, all there is too it.