WHM/ Plenary Indulgence?

[Ghishlain]

...I do feel like this conversation was pretty similar to Asylum just after Heavensward hit. I think, in general, if you're doing content where you only need 1, 2, 3... a number of the more advanced and/or nuanced skills will seem superfluous.

I remember there being a discussion that Asylum wasn't worth the oGCD use because "it didn't do enough", there were "better things to oGCD with", and "tanks never stay in Asylum" at one point early in the Heavensward expansion.

I feel the game at a basic level is really straight forward that quite a few players don't really appreciate the thought process necessary to optimize at the highest of levels.

[Kabooa]

I feel the game at a basic level is really straight forward that quite a few players don't really appreciate the thought process necessary to optimize at the highest of levels.

This is basically every game.

[Tridus]

...I do feel like this conversation was pretty similar to Asylum just after Heavensward hit. I think, in general, if you're doing content where you only need 1, 2, 3... a number of the more advanced and/or nuanced skills will seem superfluous.

Except that PI is effectively an inferior, more difficult to use version of Assize. There's times when it can be useful, sure, but that doesn't make it a good skill.

[Silver-Strider]

Its a raid skill. If you are not raiding you wont see it.

Let's correct this.

It's a STATIC raid skill because if you are in a PF group, 9/10 times your co-healer will screw you before you can use it, even with Discord.

[IhzaMhaskova]

First, let's start off with it not even being close to Cure III.

Plenary Indulgence goes from a Potency of 150 -> 300 -> 450.

Cure III is a 550 Potency.
Cure I is a 450 Potency.

(Two stacks are 66% of a Cure I, one stack is 33% of a Cure I.)

So, I have to use three aoe heals for it to even be worth my time pressing the button. Which, of course, they'd be healed from.

Outside of Savage PROGRESSION there's no need to ever use it.

It's hardly more powerful than the Medica I aoe heal with a 300 Potency and no need to cast three aoes beforehand.

[Deceptus]

It's not used because it's not dependable / reliable.

The Stack acquisition is random.

The Stack duration is short.

So when you really need it, it might not be up at all or the stacks aren't up enough to justify using it vs Cure 3.

[Risvertasashi]

Except that PI is effectively an inferior, more difficult to use version of Assize. There's times when it can be useful, sure, but that doesn't make it a good skill.

On this, I must respectfully disagree.

The only thing I wish about PI is that the stacks lasted more than 10s... sometimes it just barely falls off before that follow up AoE. But the heal itself is grand.

The Stack acquisition is random.

The RNG is gone. It is dependable and reliable. Though I do agree the timer is short.

I remember there being a discussion that Asylum wasn't worth the oGCD use because "it didn't do enough", there were "better things to oGCD with", and "tanks never stay in Asylum" at one point early in the Heavensward expansion.

I feel the game at a basic level is really straight forward that quite a few players don't really appreciate the thought process necessary to optimize at the highest of levels.

Deja vu, isn't it? We got another oGCD AoE heal... with the potential to approach cure 3 in potency, but even if it doesn't, it's still an instant oGCD... and people are, well, you've read the comments.

[Tridus]

On this, I must respectfully disagree.

The only thing I wish about PI is that the stacks lasted more than 10s... sometimes it just barely falls off before that follow up AoE. But the heal itself is grand.

Except that it takes doing two other heals to make it heal the same amount as Assize, doesn't work at all without setup (unlike Assize), has the same/longer (with lillies) cooldown than Assize, and doesn't do anything else that Assize does.

Assize is awesome all the time. PI is good in certain edge high end cases and totally useless in a lot of other cases. These highly niche skills don't fit my definition of "good", although they're nice to have when you're in their niche. A stack timer extension would help a ton by increasing the cases where the stacks stay up long enough to be used. It's definitely too fast right now, and that contributes a lot to it having all these cases where it's not particularly useful.

[Sebazy]

I honestly think that PI with a substantially longer confession duration would be too powerful. Whilst it's kind of meh in casual gameplay, it's a great ability in Savage pretty much anytime the AoEs start coming in. It's massive reach is also something that's frequently overlooked.

15 seconds might work ok, but 20 or 30 seconds runs the risk of us being able to keep stacks rolling indefinitely in more challenging content which will just break it.

[Tridus]

I honestly think that PI with a substantially longer confession duration would be too powerful. Whilst it's kind of meh in casual gameplay, it's a great ability in Savage pretty much anytime the AoEs start coming in. It's massive reach is also something that's frequently overlooked.

15 seconds might work ok, but 20 or 30 seconds runs the risk of us being able to keep stacks rolling indefinitely in more challenging content which will just break it.

15 would be a pretty nice QoL improvement. I'd be cool with them going to that and seeing how it goes, rather than overshooting.