The Healer Problem in PVP

[Krolja]

But I do outperform my opponent's melee role. I do more damage than them, I focus heavy medal targets, but I don't win. Because I can't kill anything without the support of my ranged DPS and the help of a tank to interrupt the...wait for it...healer! DPS roles just can't climb unless the entire team outperforms, not just the single role. Other people can hit their 3 buttons just as much as I can, the game doesn't show me that I'm hitting mine better unless "Victory" is on my screen.

The only two roles I see that can climb easily by outperforming are tanks and healers. That's kinda why the top 100 are nearly all tanks and healers. You're right on the money about the lack of skillful execution, and the overall PvP design. I agree with you there 100%.

[Krolja]

• Without medal system the whole match will be just a "farm the noob";
• Without gear system, the match outcome is determined by the better geared. Someone can say it was ok because all the time and dedication made for the gear, but gear has been removed from the equation (making everyone able to join pvp from day 1) and we need deal with it;
• Much more people came to pvp after the changes;

1) It's already farm the noob even with medals.

2) Normalization of stats is fine, making gear a nonissue is fine, removing all aspects of skillful play and dumbing down roles this heavily, however, is not.

3) Again, I feel the changes just arrived during a prime time since they added Experience to all forms of PvP, the Garo event with unique mounts and minions to earn, and when the servers were crapping themselves PvP was our only option for viable Exp.

[Mantrus]

Healers have a large majority of the 70%+ win rates, while even some of the best players from past seasons struggle to get close to that in other roles. If that's not indicative of something being broken, I don't know what is. It also doesn't make sense that 2-3 good players are required to overcome 1 good healer when matchmaking pairs skill 1 to 1.

Maybe healers aren't broken, but then DPS really need a higher skill ceiling and more power with some CCs or smarter skills or something; no, ninja doesn't count because the CC sacrifices their burst and their damage is lower overall to compensate.

I'm not advocating going back to the previous systems with broken melee DPS because that was also broken. But the win rates for the past seasons seem more balanced than the ones now. I'm also not advocating just nerfing healing because that'd just turn feast into death match with the better healers still coming on top. And I'm not complaining because I'm in trash ELO if you look at the ladder.

If I were to recommend a change, I'd say make tanks play a larger role in keeping people alive, weaken healing to compensate, and move some damage from tanks to DPS. That way damage vs healing isn't just 3v1.5. Healers have less individual responsibility to keep everyone alive and DPS don't need 3 competent team members to take down one.

[Cynric]

snip

I think I can agree with these. It would be nice for us to have at least one CC, with the new CC system we can't lock down a player forever anyway. Though I think a part of the issue doesn't seem to be as harsh (heal/dps wise) until you're up against The Blackest Night + healing/other shielding.

I feel like each tank could have a skill like TBN and healing be reduced just fine. But I also feel the CD on that kind of skill is too short.

While I would like to see some damage be moved, I feel like its very doubtful it will happen. The changes they make seem to be heavily influenced by JP feedback, and they've only recently realized the issue involving healing.

[Krolja]

The bigger issue is, now that they've realized the issue it's going to be months before they implement anything to help fix it.

[Mirch]

Is it really that hard to understand that when a game mode depends 100% on ONE class there is a huge balance problem?

100% depends on healer? Wait what?

[Daiwii]

100% depends on healer? Wait what?

Anybody who says that definitely never hit Platinum. As main Heal it is true that I easily carried myself into Platinum. But ever since I hit Platinum the matches against other healers were so even that u could tell who will win from the start by looking at the names of the dps. I know at least 2 monk mains who destroy everything they touch. Having them in your team is an easy win and healing on against them feels impossible. So there is obviously a way to carry as Dps otherwise those players wouldnt be in the top 100 with 66% win.

[Krolja]

I know at least 2 monk mains who destroy everything they touch. Having them in your team is an easy win and healing on against them feels impossible. So there is obviously a way to carry as Dps otherwise those players wouldnt be in the top 100 with 66% win.

Living that sub 90 ping life. I can't play any melees with my 150+ ping, stuff just moonwalks through me during animations and cancels them all . At least Bard is faceroll, I guess.

[Mantrus]

snip.

I disagree that matches 100% rely on healers. That's a dumb claim, but I do think that percent reliance is higher than any other role. Other roles can carry to some degree, but none carry harder than healer. 66% win rate on a DPS here or there doesn't compare to the numerous healers with the same or higher win rate.

If you think healers are even at the platinum level that's a misunderstanding. Healers aren't even at even the top 10 level, at least for Aether. Even if both healers keep teams alive, the more skilled healer can overwhelm the lesser by inducing Culling until the lesser cannot handle it.

[Giglamesh]

Healers are the most important for winning, but having the best healer doesn\\'t always result in a win.

Had a great match yesterday with 2 evenly matched groups. We finished with 2 deaths and lost, the other team finished with 1 death. Our dps was slightly behind the other team and thats why we lost.

I've seen plenty of times where poor dps is the reason for losing, especially with casters.

Its not always the healers fault and when you get into higher ranked matches, it seems to come down to individual matchups.

The lack of communication is the biggest killer of ranked play and is what leads most groups to losing. The teams that win more often seem to be on the same page with everyone else. For example, dps not bursting at proper times. Tanks stunning or silencing healers too early when dps aren\\'t even half health yet.

The higher tier players communicate a lot more and mark targets/ yell out and mark players to pick up medals, etc.