Stacking Crit Chance for Deep Meditation on MNK?

[mxllxr]

I've been mulling over multiple ideas in my head whilst leveling and I remembered a mechanic that Fire Mages had implemented for them in World of Warcraft during a period when they struggled with a similar issue of relying on Crit Chance.

The model was pretty simple and I think it might fit for the Monk:

For every weaponskill critical hit that doesn't proc Deep Meditation, it could add an additional 10% Crit Chance towards the next weaponskill (obviously capping out at a 100% chance) and then reset back to the baseline 50% once that stack/DM proc is acquired.

Would love someone else to chime in and theory-crunch some numbers/balance based on this idea.

[NintenPyjak64]

I feel as if they were to implement something like this, they would have to further nerf TFC. On top of that, Bootshine auto crits from rear, so that trait would always get used up on the auto crit attack, rather then any of the others

Overall with Deep Meditation and Brotherhood, it feels fine the way it is

[MauvaisOeil]

I'm pretty sure this would really lower the benefit of ciritical rating for monks, greatly imbalancing the benefits of secondary stats. Using theses sorts of formulas are risky overall.

[Fhyrr]

Not a bad idea, but yeah, it would wreck stat balancing. I'd rather see it applied to the actual chance to proc chakras by ourselves. Each crit that does not proc it, has a higher chance to proc on the next crit, and so on, until it happens. Then it returns to baseline.

That way, for every weaponskill that CRITS and does not proc Chakra, you get better chance on the next to proc it. The mechanic has merit (I remember it well from when I played mage! x) )

[mxllxr]

Not a bad idea, but yeah, it would wreck stat balancing. I'd rather see it applied to the actual chance to proc chakras by ourselves. Each crit that does not proc it, has a higher chance to proc on the next crit, and so on, until it happens. Then it returns to baseline.

That way, for every weaponskill that CRITS and does not proc Chakra, you get better chance on the next to proc it. The mechanic has merit (I remember it well from when I played mage! x) )

This is exactly the idea I was having, maybe I didn't articulate it completely for fear of waffling on but the Crit Chance I had in mind was purely an isolated boost for the Deep Meditation trait. The increase in Crit Chance would not be affecting other weaponskills/abilities chance to crit, that would run into many issues as mentioned above.

I'm looking at a baseline surety factor on time spent getting crits and not building Chakra stacks. At a bare minimum with the 10% increase formula, in a worse case scenario you're guaranteed an additional 10% crit chance towards Deep Med on every Bootshine, which happens every 6 GCDs. This is obviously extremely unlikely to happen but we take this premise as the foundation for balancing the numbers given BS has 100% chance to crit. In theory then, you get to use TFC guaranteed after 30 weaponskills (5th BS) to reach a 100% chance. In this worst case, is the TFC potency ok? Given a best case scenario in contrast, does it need adjusting?

10% increase can be changed to 5% and TFC potency could be adjusted respectively, but it seems pretty fine to me as long as it's only affecting Deep Meditation.

[Fhyrr]

People will misunderstand if you say "crit".

Leave crit alone... it would be great already if it was applied to the 50% proc chance for chakras. That way, no matter where the crit is, bootshine or any other weaponskill, you'd get it ramping up until it procced. This would ignore normal hits, and only work off any crit done. Imagine if demolish crits but does not generate 1 chakra, it would increase the chance to say, 60%. Next 4 hits aren't crits, so doesnt do anything, but the next is, and it doesn't generate... so it increases to 70%.

Once it generates, reset to base value.

Could work, just may need a chakra generation % lowering for baseline, as this in WoW was for low crit chances - 50% would not represent a 'low' chance

[mxllxr]

People will misunderstand if you say "crit".

Leave crit alone... it would be great already if it was applied to the 50% proc chance for chakras. That way, no matter where the crit is, bootshine or any other weaponskill, you'd get it ramping up until it procced. This would ignore normal hits, and only work off any crit done. Imagine if demolish crits but does not generate 1 chakra, it would increase the chance to say, 60%. Next 4 hits aren't crits, so doesnt do anything, but the next is, and it doesn't generate... so it increases to 70%.

Once it generates, reset to base value.

Could work, just may need a chakra generation % lowering for baseline, as this in WoW was for low crit chances - 50% would not represent a 'low' chance

Agreed, thanks for summarizing LOL

Re-adjusting the baseline for Deep Meditation and TFC potency with this idea would alleviate this absolute requirement to stack so much critical hit on gear as well.

[EbonySeraphim]

What you're trying to articulate is called psuedo-random distribution*. Here's an overview of it: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Pse...m_Distribution. The goal of this distribution is simple: eliminate streaks of non-procs that can frustrate players looking for it, and eliminate streaks of procs that can 'break' gameplay and frustrate players on the receiving end up someone's else RNG (supreme dedication to RNGesus).

It works by deciding you want an desired overall N% chance of something to proc. Keep a history of each roll and know how many rolls it has been since a successful proc and do the following:
1) At the very start, or if the proc happened the previous roll, the chance for the proc to is set to lower (much lower) than N%
2) After each roll where the proc doesn't happen, raise the % chance to get a proc.

Very simply, each time you don't get the proc after trying for it it increases the chance you'll get it the next time. Each time you get it, your chance to get it again lowers. It's still not deterministic when you'll successfully proc, but you'll get the procs more consistently spread out. It's great for competitive gaming that have probabilities because you don't want a mega tournament decided in a way that couldn't be foreseen and no one (other than a computer's random) had control over.

I think in FFXIV it would be great if crits become a bit more stable and predictable. This technique's interaction with Bootshine would be debatable as to whether or not it should reset the roll-event history since it is guaranteed. Deep Meditation needs this more than any other skill as it is true RNG stacked behind true RNG making it even more susceptible to long empty streaks. But even if Deep Meditation were in a streak, chakras couldn't come in any more frequently than crit weapon skill events. Effectively, you'd need both at the same time to observe chakra come in like candy on Halloween.

*If you're a software engineer, you call all computer generated random numbers psuedo-random, so this technique is really a more specific implementation of it.

[Fhyrr]

Just one of them would be enough. No one is asking for the chakra to flow like the spice of Arrakis... just for it to have a better chance at flowing more consistently

[Trespar]

Why have the two layers of RNG in the first place?

Throw out the 50% chance on crit, and just make it activate on crit.
Or eliminate the crit factor and make it a chance on any hit.

As long as it's not a chance on a chance.