Why no Plex system?

[Snow_Princess]

Your reasoning: I cannot quote exact numbers to show the economy can support it so I'm wrong. Someone else said gil is worthless, so I'm wrong.
People have also said: Mogstation is bad. Royal Menagerie is too hard. Housing is fine how it is. Savage raids are too easy(and too hard). People say stuff a lot on this forum. All of these comments have likes and support.

You're saying that if PLEX is introduced, the piles of gil that people like you have hoarded will hit the economy and destroy it right? My stance is you cannot know that. We are a vocal minority here, almost every argument made here doesn't represent the majority of players.

What giant power do you think you'll have over the economy if PLEX is released? You'll buy a whole bunch of PLEX cheap when it comes out because the value wont be really known yet to players, then when it rises you'll sell them all for a huge profit and.. what? Now you have the lions share of the "worthless" gil to do what? Prices will inflate, people will sell items at these new "inflated" prices and things will have about the same value to everyone. New players will get their gear from quests and dungeons, Old players will have things to sell at new ridiculous prices and be able to afford the new ridiculous prices.
This is what I've always seen happen with currency infusions.

No, I am saying people go to crazier means for housing then now, and the plex system would enable that. I explained before how it can spiral out of control that you conveniently ignored. I feel like I am the only one that knows what lengths people go for to get a house now @_@

Fix the econ first, then they can worry about this.


My reasoning is this simply, You can't show understanding of the econ problems of this game, so you can't give a good argument in why it would be ok to release plex in this mess. I tried several times to explain the different problems, and you keep going off my points (I do not know if it is intentionally to red haring, or you truly misunderstanding)

You are missing a big factor, in theory yes it should balance, but the severe limit on housing average changes that completely and makes things more complex.

Housing shortage isn't relevant. Stop conflating the two issues.

*long laugh*
Deep breeth*
Housing is the only thing people spend gil on that is truly significant, and the only thing that has any kind of impact at attempt on a gil sink. The demand is crazy high for the supply, making the focus on that. I watch the novice channel talk about housing a lot how someone has some goal to save up for x house and some people put new comers down with such goals, so much so I have to send private tells how money is made and it does not matter if they just started.

[Krotoan]

No, I am saying people go to crazier means for housing then now, and the plex system would enable that. I explained before how it can spiral out of control that you conveniently ignored. I feel like I am the only one that knows what lengths people go for to get a house now @_@

Fix the econ first, then they can worry about this.


My reasoning is this simply, You can't show understanding of the econ problems of this game, so you can't give a good argument in why it would be ok to release plex in this mess. I tried several times to explain the different problems, and you keep going off my points (I do not know if it is intentionally to red haring, or you truly misunderstanding)

Fix the economy how?
Lets go with your housing fixation here, which I'm at least partially thinking is your own obsession coloring your take on what money is worth considering how much you bring it up in all your responses.
Solutions: Make more wards. Make instanced housing. Make the gameplay features like gardening and/or FC airship workshops instanced and available to all.
Lets say these ALL happen. Everyone buys a house for 50 million gil (hey they can all be large if they're instanced!) and or gets what they want out of housing.
You personally buy a 50 million gil house for you, all your alts and FC houses as well.
800 million gil, out of the system for you. Max per character is 999,999,999 X 3 (free retainers maxxed out) X 8 characters alts is 23.9 Billion Gil, now 23.1 Billion Gil.
.. I'm not seeing a huge impact for the gil hoarders if the problem is as bad as you imply.

Lets go with ONE character who managed to make it to 1 Billion Gil. which was a world first maybe.. 2 years ago :http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/228916-Who-wants-to-be-a-Gillionaire
Now they have 200 Million gil. I've never seen ANYTHING near this price. From Raids clears to guaranteeing a full set of Primal Savage gear. House flipping is no longer an issue since we've solved housing with the servers (using who knows what money to buy the bandwidth and servers to host the extra load). We have solved very little about the economy. Now everyone has a house, they aren't going to buy another one anytime soon and are welcome to stockpile Gil again. Yet the illegal RMT is still pouring gil into our economy causing the same inflation.

[Naunet]

Do any of those have a housing shortage?

The housing in this game has nothing to do with it. It's not like people are magically going to be able to buy houses once they buy gil from SE.

[Aylis]

This has been a problem since 2.0 (1.0 had different problems but at least it had a more active econ)

1.0 honestly added to the problem as well in the end. Once it was know we would be able to carry our gil over with a small reduction in the end. Most of us just stopped spending money all together to hoard for 2.0, I remember personally doing max level leve quest burns with a friend, for 44k per leve base a pop. Even with the reduction we still wound up bringing around 10 million gil to 2.0 each. The economy might have been a much different place now if they did a full gil/character wipe on the 1.0 to 2.0 transition.

[Snow_Princess]

Fix the economy how?
Lets go with your housing fixation here, which I'm at least partially thinking is your own obsession coloring your take on what money is worth considering how much you bring it up in all your responses.Solutions: Make more wards. Make instanced housing. Make the gameplay features like gardening and/or FC airship workshops instanced and available to all.
Lets say these ALL happen. Everyone buys a house for 50 million gil (hey they can all be large if they're instanced!) and or gets what they want out of housing.
You personally buy a 50 million gil house for you, all your alts and FC houses as well.
800 million gil, out of the system for you. Max per character is 999,999,999 X 3 (free retainers maxxed out) X 8 characters alts is 23.9 Billion Gil, now 23.1 Billion Gil.
.. I'm not seeing a huge impact for the gil hoarders if the problem is as bad as you imply.

Lets go with ONE character who managed to make it to 1 Billion Gil. which was a world first maybe.. 2 years ago :http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-a-Gillionaire
Now they have 200 Million gil. I've never seen ANYTHING near this price. From Raids clears to guaranteeing a full set of Primal Savage gear. House flipping is no longer an issue since we've solved housing with the servers (using who knows what money to buy the bandwidth and servers to host the extra load). We have solved very little about the economy. Now everyone has a house, they aren't going to buy another one anytime soon and are welcome to stockpile Gil again. Yet the illegal RMT is still pouring gil into our economy causing the same inflation.

I know the the solutions of fixing them, people bought them up all the time, the thing is though if SE will not DO THEM then they cannot do the plex system.

You underestimate RMT gil, again the cost and the fact it is illegal is a deterrent, people will not buy enough or look for ways to buy second hand housing off RMT gil. RMT gil is a small impact and does nothing to housing. Plus you do not need gil for this game, in 1.0 they where mocked to heck during BETA! RMT attempted sell gil during beta>.> so you can't assume they are making much just because they are "in business" or making a lot of sales. The only thing BoTs do that is a significant impact of any sort is making high end gathering not worth doing after a week of release. (or in the case of love kiss sands, shut down for a weekend for some reason causing the prices to double, I had fun that weekend, was shocking since it was months old that point) Also how do you know how much this person has now?

The housing in this game has nothing to do with it. It's not like people are magically going to be able to buy houses once they buy gil from SE.

You think people buying houses or asking 100M-400M is a fairy tale???? This happens because of the housing shortage. People will go nuts trying to barter these tokens for housing or mass gil though them, in either event it would make the housing situation worse, make the second hand costs higher (by use of outside communication methods because more people will have enough buying power for them , making them cost more though second hand and now causing insane prices with real money. That is the other thing, since it is done off game because it is "illegal" to begin with, how in the heck you expect SE do anything about it when they can't even fix housing problems in the first place? If they can't a healthy econ now, how would they manage after plex is released? They need to fix the econ and the housing before releasing this. Why people debating me on this fact I got no clue.

But if you insist these are non-issues despite my explanations and warnings, fine. convince SE to release this so I can be swimming in gil and sub tokens. I give up trying to explain something with refusal of being understood.

1.0 honestly added to the problem as well in the end. Once it was know we would be able to carry our gil over with a small reduction in the end. Most of us just stopped spending money all together to hoard for 2.0, I remember personally doing max level leve quest burns with a friend, for 44k per leve base a pop. Even with the reduction we still wound up bringing around 10 million gil to 2.0 each. The economy might have been a much different place now if they did a full gil/character wipe on the 1.0 to 2.0 transition.

I disagree because of the first housings, people could not afford them. They really need to increase supply or cost. Maybe they can release premium wards with bigger housings for 100-500 M each? 999 M? i doono

[Aylis]

I disagree because of the first housings, people could not afford them. They really need to increase supply or cost. Maybe they can release premium wards with bigger housings for 100-500 M each? 999 M? i doono

People couldn't afford the first housing batch thanks largely to 1.0 players like me. My friend and I are just two people and we had 20 million gil together at the start of 2.0. Enough for a small house. Couple us with the other players that did the same, the players that did this and were also the super 1.0 crafters who raked in millions selling the base weapons for the 1.0 relic quest. Then mix us in with the sleeper RMT bots that raked in more money. At day one launch of 2.0 there were already billions of gil floating around. Non legacy servers got wrapped into this to keep prices "fair" across the servers. Then came server transfers off legacy worlds.

[Krotoan]

I know the the solutions of fixing them, people bought them up all the time, the thing is though if SE will not DO THEM then they cannot do the plex system.

You underestimate RMT gil, again the cost and the fact it is illegal is a deterrent, people will not buy enough or look for ways to buy second hand housing off RMT gil. RMT gil is a small impact and does nothing to housing.

.. so wait.. RMT gil is a small impact and does nothing to housing.. but plex will ruin the economy with RMT... and the economy needs housing reforms to fix? Sounds like RMT affects housing through the economy.
(you may be confused by my use of RMT. RMT to me means Real Money Transaction. IE: paying real money for something ingame. Paying for PLEX is an RMT. Mogstation purchases are RMT. Paying a Gil seller for Gil with cash is an ILLEGAL RMT. If this is not what you think it is I apologize for using it incorrectly. )
I'm going to assume you mean overestimate, since underestimate doesn't make contextual sense so:

RMT spammers and bots are a big problem and people are using them:

Time Period: Aug. 17, 2017 to Aug. 23, 2017

・Participation in RMT/illicit activity
　・Accounts receiving permanent ban: 29,456
　・Accounts receiving temporary ban: 40
・RMT Advertising
　・Accounts receiving permanent ban: 162

Time Period: Aug. 10, 2017 to Aug. 16, 2017

・Participation in RMT/illicit activity
　・Accounts receiving permanent ban: 30,839
　・Accounts receiving temporary ban: 36
・RMT Advertising
　・Accounts receiving permanent ban: 40
Time Period: Aug. 3, 2017 to Aug. 9, 2017

・Participation in RMT/illicit activity
　・Accounts receiving permanent ban: 30,679
　・Accounts receiving temporary ban: 33
・RMT Advertising
　・Accounts receiving permanent ban: 84

Other ways BOTS are affecting your playing experience: a bot is on your server all day, everyday. They are making your login queue go up just by being there. They are also using server resources for their weird spammy requests (most bot's aren't really using the game client, they're just sending commands and sometimes it acts like a DDOS on whatever map server you're on. Gilfarmer bot client sends "Do farm action" 100 times , then instantly sends "teleport to X,Y coordinates" and repeat. They are using server resources in worse ways than actual people. Not to mention when a server restarts they're sending their relogin request within milliseconds of the login server being available , over and over again until they get in.

Plus you do not need gil for this game, in 1.0 they where mocked to heck during BETA! RMT attempted sell gil during beta>.> so you can't assume they are making much just because they are "in business" or making a lot of sales. The only thing BoTs do that is a significant impact of any sort is making high end gathering not worth doing after a week of release. (or in the case of love kiss sands, shut down for a weekend for some reason causing the prices to double, I had fun that weekend, was shocking since it was months old that point) Also how do you know how much this person has now?

I remember the gil spammers in 1. They show up for every game that has currency. Mocking them didn't mean people weren't using them. People don't spend resources on things that don't work for very long. The fact that people made fun of them doesn't mean they weren't making money.

I was using a billion gil as an example amount. 1 billion gil -800million gil for private and FC houses for your main and every alt = 200 million gil left. I can see how i made that sound weird, sorry. That was oddly written.

Why people debating me on this fact I got no clue.
But if you insist these are non-issues despite my explanations and warnings, fine. convince SE to release this so I can be swimming in gil and sub tokens. I give up trying to explain something with refusal of being understood.
I disagree because of the first housings, people could not afford them. They really need to increase supply or cost. Maybe they can release premium wards with bigger housings for 100-500 M each? 999 M? i doono

Because you argued with us and are opposing something we think would improve the game we play.
I would have figured you already were swimming in gil they way you say it's devalued.
If I refused to understand you I wouldn't be replying with explanations and reason.
Houses that expensive would cause an outcry from so many players. Your average player in this game has only seen maybe 2 Million Gil in their bank at the most. How would they react if the cost of a house went up to 50 Times that?
Having a "premium ward" would be insanely divisive as well, sounds like it would benefit mostly players like you.