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  1. #11
    Player
    Wyssahtyn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
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    870
    Character
    Saika Kinoshita
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Rogue Lv 53
    Quote Originally Posted by Enkidoh View Post
    Don't be so quick to discount Eorzean military technology and the apparent 'superiority' of Garlean machina - we ourselves after all shoot down a fully armed and armoured Garlean dreadnought airship during CM with a single ground-based anti-aircraft cannon (granted the cannon was also Garlean made, but that's beside the point) and the ship quickly becomes scrap metal after only a couple of hits.

    The various wrecks seen in the Fringes are still on fire so their destruction was fairly recent, and was probably caused by Alliance cannons mounted on the Wall (which is very tall), so problems with range would have been reduced or eliminated.

    To say nothing of research guilds like the Garlond Ironworks and the Skysteel Manufactory utilizing Garlean magitek concepts and adapting them for their own use, thus allowing the Alliance to effectively turn Garlemald's might against them.
    It wasn't a dreadnought, it was an assault craft. Far smaller and presumably less armed/armored. Nor was it only the one cannon or "a couple of hits". There are three or four cannons in the area, and while I don't remember the exact amount, it takes somewhere around 5-7 shots before the assault craft's hull integrity is compromised, with another two after that to ground it.

    Also the fact that it was a Garlean cannon is a point. The design between Eorzean and Garlean cannons is completely different, and the ones used by Eorzean ones, outside of possibly Ishgardian artillery, are for the most part incapable of handling anti-air duties in any suitable manner unless the Garlean aircraft takes to the ground (for some reason. I'll never claim to know why they do) or if they're otherwise already level with the target, the chances of which are negligible since the point of air to ground attacks is to take advantage of the high angle of attack available. Ishgardian dragonkillers are relegated to a possibility due to their uncertain usage. If they only fire harpoons as in Bismarck and Steps of Faith, then they're incredibly inefficient due to a low rate of fire and accuracy (since there's apparently no way to aim outside of a sense of good timing; Bismarck is too big to miss). For Bertha cannons, it's unknown if the Ishgardians made some modification to allow them to adjust their angle of fire high enough to be of use, otherwise the highest angle of fire would be somewhere around like, 30 to 40 degrees. All instances of Berthas being used involve firing at a target that they're either level with or slightly below of, so I doubt they did. Garlean cannons (more like mortars with their design) on the other hand have a high angle of fire, are apparently simple to load and fire since the WoL and members of his posse can handle them with ease and no training, and are presumably far more mobile than Eorzean cannons.

    Additionally, the destruction in the Fringes is far more likely to have been a result of Shinryu and Omega's conflict, which occurred on the Ala Mhigan side of Baelsar's Wall if I recall correctly. Particularly since Raubahn informs you when you initally join him at Castrum Oriens that the only conflict up to that point had only been light skirmishes when Alliance and Garlean patrols encountered each other. I think he would have mentioned if Alliance forces had destroyed a noticeable amount of Garlean armor/air.

    Furthermore, the only contribution to Eorzea that we've been told Garlond Ironworks provided was the introduction of magitek. Which from all appearances appears to be limited to unarmed cargo/passenger airships and various appliances. Of their adventuring gear, Rowena has the sole rights to supplying it. On to the Skysteel Manufactory, outside of their already available artillery, munitions, and manpower, I fail to see how they might have come up with any significant innovations for the Alliance in the absurdly short time between the end of the Dragonsong War and Operation Rhalgr's Beacon.

    On top of all this, there's the matter of Garlean armor plating. A quest in Mor Dhona shows that the Garleans use armor plating made of cermet in their airship hulls. Cermet in the real world is a composite material composed of ceramic and metallic materials. In more relevant terms, it's basically used for ceramic armor, provided that SE intended the parallel. Ceramic armor's used for things like tanks, other armored vehicles, and personal armor, and its effectiveness as vehicle armor is such that "not a single British Army Challenger tank was lost to enemy tank fire during Desert Storm". So it's unlikely that Eorzean artillery would do anything more than dent the hull unless their munitions are far more advanced than they have any right to be.

    Well, Drest's situation in Eastern La Noscea pretty much showed that the Alliance actively shoots down Garlean fighters such as Juggernauts with cannons (his Juggernaut he specifically stated was shot down by Maelstrom cannons), which would also explain the various wrecked airships and machina lying around the Fringes as well.
    You stated this in an earlier post, but combing over quests that Drest is involved in with Garland Tools Database shows no evidence to support your statement. Drest was part of a Garlean scout unit which was ambushed by Maelstrom forces in heavy rain, but at no point does he state that "his" juggernaut was shot down by Maelstrom cannons.

    Also End of an Era showed BLMs and THMs easily destroying magitek armour with mere fire and thunder spells, so for all their blustering, Garlean machina isn't quite as indestructible as they make it out to be.
    Another earlier post from you, but aside from it being a CGI cutscene with Cutscene Power to the Max, the spells used don't look in any way to be "mere" fire and thunder spells. The spells used are very obviously powerful with lengthy cast times (15 seconds for the BLM's second fire spell).
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    Last edited by Wyssahtyn; 08-26-2017 at 10:25 PM. Reason: needed to get past the character limit

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