Tank role action complaint time

[Tanathya]

DRK did INT debuff combo which was WAY better than any silence due to magic damage and intruppting enemy abilities/spells was more PLDs thing than DRKs thing... also you need to have a really good eye to notice the animations or serious OCD to even notice the the animations on some role actions were originally from DRK abilities that got removed outright...

That's debatable, but that's not what was being discussed; DRK never had a silence move in FFXIV, and so Interject wasn't taken out of its toolkit.

[Donjo]

Let's not pretend Rampart wasn't taken out of DRK the same way it was taken from PLD. The difference is that Rampart is much more generic than something called Shadowskin and they went with that, and Anticipation is obviously Dark Dance's cross-role equivalent. I don't know why they mentioned Interject since DRK never had a Silence move, but yeah, 4 skills were taken from DRK.

The two skills I was referring to as direct thefts were Reprisal and Anticipation. As for Rampart, I personally would have named it something distinct from anything the Tanks had in 3.X but that's neither here nor there. If we put suspiciously similar skills in the running, then we can say that role skills stole these from each job...

PLD: Rampart, Conva, Awareness, Provoke, Interject(replaces Spirits Within silence)
DRK: Shadowskin(replaced by Rampart), Reprisal, Anticipation(replaces Dark Dance), Low Blow(replaces DRK's identically named oGCD stun)
WAR: Brutal Swing(replaced by Low Blow).

Of course, this doesn't count the skills that are missing without role skill equivalents. So yeah, we could say DRK lost 4 but the same logic says PLD lost 5.

As for why mention Interject, I wonder if OP was referring to the ability using Weaponskill Delirium's old animation?

[Freyyy]

That's debatable, but that's not what was being discussed; DRK never had a silence move in FFXIV, and so Interject wasn't taken out of its toolkit.

I think he's talking solely about the animation (which is silly).

Quote from the same person on another thread :

Interject is a glaringly obvious eyesore which DRK won't unless they decided to experiment and realize it uses 3.xx Delirum animation

Edit: For the post above, I'll just add that, role skills stole Reprisal and Low Blow, indeed, but they also butchered them. We can't really recover the Reprisal and the Low Blow we lost in 4.0. They share the name, the animation, and the basic function, but the mechanics tied to it and the DPS gain that they represented for DRK were completely annihilated. They're just mere shadows of what they were. So I'd say that we lost Reprisal and Low Blow, without being able to recover them. We lost them the same way we lost Scourge. Reprisal used to have 66% uptime and deal 210 potency of damage, and Low Blow used to be a 100 potency oGCD with a chance to reset its CD everytime you got a parry, which had an incredibly good synegy with Dark Dance, which we also lost. And you can't DA anticipation to get %evasion either btw, so it's also not Dark Dance. We've been completely robbed.

[NovaLevossida]

Edit: For the post above, I'll just add that, role skills stole Reprisal and Low Blow, indeed, but they also butchered them. We can't really recover the Reprisal and the Low Blow we lost in 4.0. They share the name, the animation, and the basic function, but the mechanics tied to it and the DPS gain that they represented for DRK were completely annihilated. They're just mere shadows of what they were. So I'd say that we lost Reprisal and Low Blow, without being able to recover them. We lost them the same way we lost Scourge. Reprisal used to have 66% uptime and deal 210 potency of damage, and Low Blow used to be a 100 potency oGCD with a chance to reset its CD everytime you got a parry, which had an incredibly good synegy with Dark Dance, which we also lost. And you can't DA anticipation to get %evasion either btw, so it's also not Dark Dance. We've been completely robbed.

Would have been nice to have them reduce the animation lock on plunge and have it reset its cooldown like Low Blow used to.

I feel the new role actions are more limiting than anything, especially when things are taken from what you used to have. Or, with healers, having basic core mechanics like esuna rolled into the role skill. They should have pruned things like Protect when they were reducing button bloat. It doesn't feel good having to slot Rampart when you used to get Shadowskin for free with a cooler animation, etc.

[Felorr]

Does anyone here have an argument that isn't rooted in "it used to be this way"?

[MauvaisOeil]

Does anyone here have an argument that isn't rooted in "it used to be this way"?

Does "It's shitty design" work ?

[Nhisso]

The self importance in your post is so beyond sad. Wow.

[VenKitsune]

The role skills system is honestly very slapdash.

One example is Healers Protect. i mean why does it even exist? just remove it from the game and increase everyones defensive/M defense by how much protect would have and bam nothing has changed other than decluttering the role action window. they set out to "declutter" skills in SB and some places they've done it well and other places not so well, as stated in my example.

For tanks? its the same problem really. They should of kept rampart on PLD, Shadowskin on DRK and simply added a new ability that does the exact same thing on WAR. this way all jobs still have thematic animations while also only needing to make one animation for the WAR instead of trying to make one animation and making it kind of make sense on all 3 tanks. That and Awareness/Anticipation could of been baked in to all of the tanks kits. There is nothing wrong with one job having 2 abilities more than the other aslong as they're balanced.

I do very much appreciate however that this system has brought us Stuns and Silences universally across tanks, it just makes it so that content can use those mechanics and that a tank can deal with them without having to be a PLD. its also great that voke is on there as you dont have to go and lvl GLD to 22 just to get an essential skill. Shirk is also amazing.

Overall though i think its a very janky system and should of honestly just baked a lot of the abilities in to the jobs themselves with the ability to swap one effect out for another much like how NIN could with their poisons changing jugulate between a stun and a silence.

[Mycow8me]

I still take the stance that the role system for tanks should be the defining difference in what a main tank and an off tank bring to the fight beyond a classes regular skills and abilities. A main tank would want some mitigation and maybe a certain utility for situations. An Off tank would want some DPS role powerups, party utility, and a main tank support skill like a HP transfer or something maybe?

[Felorr]

Does "It's shitty design" work ?

No because you've done nothing more than share your opinion. Which, no offense, isn't worth anything to anyone.