Did you know not performing as you think another player should in a group

[missybee]

I've said it several times and so have a fair few others in this thread - we aren't referring to new players or people who are still learning.

I think a big problem is that everyone is too focused on their delicate covfeefees. If a suggestion is made as to how to optimize your play, it isn't necessarily an attack. From what I have seen both in-game and on the forums, however, a lot of people seem to take critiques of their play really personally.

I will not kick someone who is trying. I will, however, kick someone who is spamming a single attack and being petulant when asked to optimize. This isn't a difficult concept to grasp. I don't appreciate having my time wasted.

[akaneakki]

I will not kick someone who is trying. I will, however, kick someone who is spamming a single attack and being petulant when asked to optimize. This isn't a difficult concept to grasp. I don't appreciate having my time wasted.

This. I don't know why people take things as ''you need to improve'' as personal attacks. I know there are some people who will flat out say they are shit, but that's a whole different story. Many times I've tried to make people improve being nice about it, all I get is that they wanna play they way they play and I can't do anything about it. Or the old excuse most people use ''elitist prick'' etc. Many and I say many players like yourself and myself included wants people to improve and we want to be a good source for a group, while on the other hand many don't want to be, they rather just sit back and let people do their shit for them. Selfish, ignorant, greedy etc etc. That's what I usually call these players tbh.

[Snow_Princess]

Sorry if its seems like a personal attack I apoligiize. Maybe it was to harsh. But you guys are all attacking me for saying I am not going to kick somebody just because they are not performing with perfect efficiency. If the group is not wiping and completing the dungeon then its not even an issue regardless of what they are doing. You guys seem to be saying that if they are making the dungeon run any longer than it needsto be there going to get kicked. That shows the game is more important that the person to me. I just pointed it out to you is all. Nothing personal.

You are over exaggerating on your interpretation on what people are saying. No one is asking for perfect performance, what people do not want is a 1 button hitting bot. I was in a place called Aetherochemical Research Facility. 3 people where new, one was lv 69 who commented they never did it before. So I asked how they got 69 with out clearing the place (I wanted some information to see how well they will take advice) once they told me they bought a leveling potion and new to the game I simply said use spreadshot with 3+ enemies. I guided the run, told them the moves, they tried and we did fine. It was subpar performance from an elitist view and slow but they where trying, no argumentative comebacks when giving advice. I also told the tank not to use NQ weapons because they are sub par ( I really wish SE do something about NQ vs HQ weapons, it is a noob trap people use to bypass ilevel requirements)

Unlike my situation, if I was in the very same situation as that thundermage story you are trying to defend, I would kick them too. Not because of the playstyle, but because of the reply they got. You are a very new player, talking to people that ran thousands of DFs, so much so some of us can spot weak DPS just off the speed things die and seeing attack animations/ buffs and debuffs. Vote kick also has a 4 hour CD, so it prevents people being ultra picky, it is usually reserved for outright trolling, and other things that violate the ToS directly. In your case of SMN, if all you do is cast ruin I over and over, you ignore the rotation advice I give, and you promptly reply with something on the lines of "You do not pay for my sub" then expect a kick.

Did you use auto translate for it? I've found that sometimes it's not that they are ignoring, it's that they don't understand because of language barriers. Even people who have English selected doesn't mean they are able to speak/read English the same as anyone else. Not saying it's the case, but sometimes it does help.

Not an excuse, the person could of flashed an auto translate message that they do not understand, it is what I do.

[ArcanoJones]

Sorry ..But I don't tell people how to play there character. If they ask for advice thats another story. But unsolicited comments on what they should be doing are usually going to be taken with a mind your own business attitude. That is human nature . And most people will react in that way. Thats just the way people are. If you think about it you would act the same. Especially now when you think you know what you are doing.

I don't know why people are suprised that people react this way.

[Paladinleeds]

Sorry ..But I don't tell people how to play there character. If they ask for advice thats another story. But unsolicited comments on what they should be doing are usually going to be taken with a mind your own business attitude. That is human nature . And most people will react in that way. Thats just the way people are. If you think about it you would act the same. Especially now when you think you know what you are doing.

I don't know why people are suprised that people react this way.

Maybe because I've done it so many times and 9 times out of 10 I've received a positive response? Perhaps it has something to do with how I'm phrasing it. I do it as a "Have you considered this?" type approach. Pointing them out to something new that may be worth them trying. I phrase it in a way that is taken as a suggestion, and most people will at least try it I find.

[missybee]

But unsolicited comments on what they should be doing are usually going to be taken with a mind your own business attitude. That is human nature.

I don't know why people are suprised that people react this way.

I have a suspicion that it might have something to do with the fact that this is an MMO and these are group activities. As a result, having a 'mind your own business' mindset, when you are in group content, seems just a tad silly.

BUT THAT'S JUST A THEORY.

[HyoMinPark]

Sorry ..But I don't tell people how to play there character. If they ask for advice thats another story. But unsolicited comments on what they should be doing are usually going to be taken with a mind your own business attitude. That is human nature . And most people will react in that way. Thats just the way people are. If you think about it you would act the same. Especially now when you think you know what you are doing.

I don't know why people are suprised that people react this way.

This is a Massively Multiplayer Online game, though. By design, this game promotes group play, and said group play includes this "unsolicited" advice people can give one another to improve performance and make the overall experience smoother and more enjoyable. Take a sports team for instance: different players can offer other players advice on how to better handle their assigned positions on the team: how to better score goals, block opponents, or what have you. Group play promotes this sort of constructive criticism, and all team members should accept the advice gracefully. Very rarely have I seen people just outright say to others that they are terrible players, and/or refuse to offer advice to help the player better themselves. I know that's anecdotal, but it's what I've seen, and I've been playing this game for quite a while.

I'm a god-awful MNK. Sure, the job is level 60 and was level 60 way before the conclusion of Heavensward, but I definitely do not play the job as optimally as I know it can be played. If an individual were to offer me advice on how to better my MNK gameplay, provided the advice is offered in a respectful and constructive way, I would accept the advice with grace and appreciation. Now, if a person were to try and tell me how to play BRD (my main), I would probably be less inclined to accept the advice because I know this job inside and out, but I would not act with hostility towards them.

If players do not want to deal with constructive criticisms and would prefer a more "everyone mind your own business" sort of play, perhaps an MMO is not the right genre for them.

[Snow_Princess]

Sorry ..But I don't tell people how to play there character. If they ask for advice thats another story. But unsolicited comments on what they should be doing are usually going to be taken with a mind your ownbusiness attitude. That is human nature . And most people will react in that way. Thats just the way people are. If you think about it you would act the same. Especially now when you think you know what you are doing.

I don't know why people are suprised that people react this way.

Because you can't, you do not have enough experience to be able to. your post is a bit off the point though. If you see a BLM casting thunder spells like that, it is more likely a troll:

3.2 Disruption. You may not in any way disrupt or interfere with the Game experience of other players, including the disruption of Square Enix's computers and servers.

And this post does not even fit the personal story I just did .. like yesterday? or day before.. was fairly recent, where I was guiding people and giving advice.

If people are playing subpar and give a hostile reply to advice or whatever, they will get kicked 9 out of 10. (the 1/10 is prob being protected by premade and likely all 3 are trolling) People here, are just trying to explain how the game is and why people act the way they do. the reason for this thread was basically kick abuse, and it is likely your case you saw was not kick abuse.

I am trying to help you understand things but this will be my last post on this manner today, this forum has a post limit and I got more important things to post on then a never ending argument.

I take it you think you know your class perfectly Paldinleeds. Your telling me if someone told you your doing it wrong . You should be doing this instead. You would not say your wrong and if they pursued the matter further you would tell them to mind their own business. To that person there advice was ignored and they have done exactly what you guys are talking about and been answered in exactly the same way.

This thing you guys have going is what is called an elitist attitude. This is a problem that a lot of online games have. I probably won't even go to the end game dungeons actually myself if there is that much pressure on people. I just play the game to have fun. Its an adventure for me.

If you can play your job perfectly, then you are able to explain in detail why it is wrong, people that are new are unable to do this. I know the basics of all jobs, and advance ideas of several, I can tell if something is BS or not. The thing is, people are referring to basic ideas that are never wrong, and some people try to troll this... so they get kicked.

[Shihen]

When the advice is given in a friendly tone and it is clear that it is just that, advice, I don't think I have ever seen someone react negatively to it. They may go back to doing what they're used to ten seconds later, but that's understandable as forming a new habit takes time.

There's also a big difference between telling someone how they should play, shoving an unasked-for opinion in their face, and telling them which form of play is better, giving them advice based on objective fact. If it's the latter and the recipient's refusal to adapt causes the group to suffer, then their removal seems reasonable to me. If it was a single player game then certainly, I'm not going to follow you around Eorzea critiquing your Heavy Thrust uptime as you fight Spriggans, but if your success and mine are interlinked and you're tossing away both of our time then I'm going to ask you to find another group that wants to play as you do, while I find someone who wants to play as I do.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Sorry ..But I don't tell people how to play there character. If they ask for advice thats another story. But unsolicited comments on what they should be doing are usually going to be taken with a mind your own business attitude. That is human nature . And most people will react in that way. Thats just the way people are. If you think about it you would act the same. Especially now when you think you know what you are doing.

I don't know why people are suprised that people react this way.

And we are under no obligation to carry people through content. You've essentially said once I queue into a roulettle, I am beholden to the party and must accept their playstyle whatever it may be. DPS who refuse to aoe, thus prolonging the dungeon? Tanks not using cooldowns? Healers standing around idle? Doesn't matter. I should be forced to say because it's rude otherwise? Call me rude then because I'm not interested in carrying people who can't put forth an effort themselves. If they aren't willing to listen to advice, they can requeue or wait for someone else.