SMN 4.06 Changes

**Airget** · 08-10-2017 01:28 PM

First, you can't just have Ruin under one umbrella, they all do different things. Ruin is designed as SMN's go to DPS, Ruin II is an instant spell, Ruin III is designed to be used during Dreadwrym Trance and Ruin IV which does share a slot with Ruin/RuinIII has a chance to proc. Combining them to one skill would only serve to nerf SMN greatly since they would no longer have access to their instant cast Ruin Spell.

If you want to know why SMN is hurting so much, read the abilities that BLM and RDM use, ask yourself, how do they synergize with the job, then look at SMN and ask yourself, how do they synergize with the job. When you notice the huge flaw in SMN's current Abilities, you'll understand why they have a hard time compared to BLM and RDM which have great abilities that flow well into their playstyle.

**dinnertime** · 08-10-2017 01:35 PM

SMN doesn't need to be rebuilt and it's not something that will happen anyway. They just need to improve on what it was built on.

I only expect adjustments to SMN's existing skills in 4.x so I just hope they actually fix its problems in the coming patch, which is the clunkiness, how limited the AoE is and how punishing it is to die compared to other jobs.

In the future expansion they should improve on the Demi-summoning aspect of the job and actually give them new (and useful) skills.

**Xie_Belvoule** · 08-10-2017 02:19 PM

Originally Posted by dinnertime

SMN doesn't need to be rebuilt and it's not something that will happen anyway. They just need to improve on what it was built on.

FFXIV 1.0 doesn't need to be rebuilt and it's not something that will happen anyway. Yoshida just needs to improve on what it was built on.

A Realm Reborn says hi.

**dinnertime** · 08-10-2017 01:51 PM

Originally Posted by Airget

First, you can't just have Ruin under one umbrella, they all do different things. Ruin is designed as SMN's go to DPS, Ruin II is an instant spell, Ruin III is designed to be used during Dreadwrym Trance and Ruin IV which does share a slot with Ruin/RuinIII has a chance to proc.

I'd rather have Ruin gone and replace it with Ruin III with the same low MP cost being your go-to spell, while replacing it with Ruin IV only during DWT. Ruin II can stay the same.

They should just get rid of Ruin already. It does pathetic damage. How Ruin III is designed is really nothing special to me either.

**Xie_Belvoule** · 08-10-2017 02:10 PM

Originally Posted by dinnertime

I'd rather have Ruin gone and replace it with Ruin III with the same low MP cost being your go-to spell, while replacing it with Ruin IV only during DWT. Ruin II can stay the same.

They should just get rid of Ruin already. It does pathetic damage. How Ruin III is designed is really nothing special to me either.

This %100, combine Ruin and Ruin 3. Make ruin 4 always proc during DWT just like in pvp.

**Dyvid** · 08-11-2017 01:20 AM

Originally Posted by Airget

Ruin

Originally Posted by dinnertime

Ruin

Mentioned this in another thread:
Ruin I : 100 Potency instant cast
~~Ruin II~~ : Change to Ruinga, 40 or 50 Potency AoE attack
Ruin III : Lower MP cost to be used outside of DWT then change it to higher potency in DWT
Ruin IV : Instant Cast

Another thing I would like to see and mentioned in my Demi-Bahamut makeover is ruin causing pet skills proc. Basically a __% chance that ruin would proc a pet"s basic attack (Burning Strike, Wind Blade, Wyrmwave) into a strong attack (Meteor Strike, Slipstream, Mega-Flare).

Another thought would be to rework Titan Egi from a tank to a defensive buff/debuff pet and replace Garuda Egi's stupid Shock wave with razor plume; a DoT attack.

**Komaku** · 08-15-2017 03:50 AM

Originally Posted by dinnertime

I'd rather have Ruin gone and replace it with Ruin III with the same low MP cost being your go-to spell while replacing it with Ruin IV only during DWT. Ruin II can stay the same.

They should just get rid of Ruin already. It does pathetic damage. How Ruin III is designed is really nothing special to me either.

I agree if they are going to make it so abilities change depending on what stance you're in for other classes. They could easily make it so by default when you're in Dreadwyrm trance that Ruin III replaces Ruin or as you suggested just have Ruin III by default replace Ruin and Ruin 4 only show up during Dreadwyrm trance.

In my honest opinion though the ruin shuffle isn't the biggest problem it is the Aertherflow issue being locked out of using it till after you have exhausted Dreadwyrm trance really slows down a summoners rotation.

**Teraluna** · 08-10-2017 02:36 PM

The problem is:.....ok, it's not just one thing.
Abilities work in series, in rotation, so adjustments need to be considered in light of the whole.
Otherwise you move further away from a synergistic play style.

For me, the mass introduction of 3 gauge systems hasn't been the brightest idea that's happened to classes.
Once that was done, several abilities had to be bent toward accommodating it - not just for SMN. Lily system for whm just feels like a forced mechanic for example.

The problem with smn then is the subsequent attempt to marry this 'we all got to have a gauge' approach with the previous flow of dots, ability rotations etc.
It hasn't worked. On the basis that you don't change for change sake - you change to improve.
This has been the opposite, introducing frustration and dissatisfaction among the class players.

When will mmo developers learn the lesson that you adjust things on an incremental level - gradually.
To do otherwise is to risk damaging a class, which then takes an extended period to fix, as they refuse to admit serious initial errors of judgement. Forcing new fixes on the class which only result in moving it further away from the good position it was in.

**dinnertime** · 08-10-2017 02:41 PM

Originally Posted by Xie_Belvoule

FFXIV 1.0 doesn't need to be rebuilt and it's not something that will happen anyway. Yoshida just needs to improve on what it was built on.

A Realm Reborn says hi.

Give me a job in 2.0 and onwards that got rebuilt so much that it's entirely not the same as it was before. The closest you can get from this is how BRD's songs work now but at large the job still plays the same as it used to before.
Don't expect such special treatment for SMN, especially when they make half-baked attempts on giving what people have been asking for, like the Egi Glamour.

**waifugenerator** · 08-10-2017 04:50 PM

The funny thing is that SMN plays a lot better with it's PvP kit than it's PvE kit

Thread: SMN 4.06 Changes

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