1.20a tomorrow :D

[Rowyne]

So sit down and play a while. Level a class to 50 then come back and tell us how you feel.

First off, thank you for a well-presented point instead of jumping in with insults.

I do understand what you're saying, that you believe I haven't given the combat system a chance. Trust me, I want to love this game. Otherwise, I wouldn't still be here. I'm providing feedback in the hopes that this game will improve. Your assessment is correct, I have taken some breaks from the game. You pretty much have to, lest the frustration get the better of you.

But what you're saying is that you may have to possibly wait until cap until combat makes sense? Those who enjoy it seem to be level 50 players, which tells me that it's highly tuned to cap and endgame. Yes, that may be the eventual goal, but I have serious reservations about how new players will receive this game if that's how combat will remain into 2.0. How long must new players wait to have fun? 30? 40? 50? That's simply too long.

No, I don't know how melee combat feels at level 50. But I do know that, at least until mid-range, you feel like your hands are tied.

[AdvancedWind]

No, I don't know how melee combat feels at level 50. But I do know that, at least until mid-range, you feel like your hands are tied.

Sorry, you don't.. You may have some idea about low-mid level mage play, but you haven't even equipped a melee weapon at all. You cannot have any idea how melees are doing after the patch without actually playing with them.

Please, buy a lv1 marauder weapon (first combo needs no positioning at all), get it AT LEAST to level 10, start using the damn combo system and your first positional weaponskill, try getting into a duo or something (light party would be ideal, but I know how hard it is to get a low level party), THEN come back and say melee is broken. Before that point, your opnion can be safely ignored.

[Rowyne]

Sorry, you don't.. You may have some idea about low-mid level mage play, but you haven't even equipped a melee weapon at all. You cannot have any idea how melees are doing after the patch without actually playing with them.

Guess you missed the part where I said this:

Stood over my husband's shoulder and watched him, then jumped in and tried it myself. Both of us were sorely disappointed.

So, yes, I have actually tried it out first hand.

[AdvancedWind]

Guess you missed the part where I said this:



So, yes, I have actually tried it out first hand.

Kay, questions:

How many minutes did you spend before proclaiming melee is broken? What's the level of the class you played? Did you try to combo at all? Did you get into a party? Or did you play for 15 minutes, your husband said "See, it's broken!" and you agreed with him and never touched a melee again?

Because my experience with melee classes after the patch has been very enjoyable thus far. I've played solo, light parties, guildleves, tanking and shooting arrows at Ifrit, with levels ranging from 1 to 35, plus archer 50. No offense here, but I'm sure I have far more experience with those classes than you, and I'm still a complete noob when it comes to melee classes. In my humble opnion, they are far from broken.

I'm sure you may have different opnions and that's completely fine and pretty possible, but please tell me you have actually experienced at least some time with a melee class at all. And while we are at it, care to point what feels so bad about them and what you would change? You know, some feedback for our dear developers trying to satisfy yet another consumer?

[criosist]

Pretty sure this update is implementing the Achievements tracker also

[KenJammin]

This thread is terrible, and people wonder why people double post the same topic...

-I hope 1.20a fixes the silly moogle bug.
Maybe they'll throw in a little something to shoot down PLing?

Ah i can dream...

[Big-Beach]

They're probably adding more trees on the way to Turning Leaf.

[Firon]

i think the point your missing is the current battle is heavily tuned to being max level. It is really bad mid level, or early leveling if you want to call it that. You simply dont have the tools to do your job well early, you probably have 1 combo, and on certain jobs its a not that useful combo, you most likely do not have any of the moves that give you synergy, and you probably dont have all the cross class abilities that might prove useful, but even if you did, you can only equip like2 of them.

One of the reasons you think combat is great and makes sense is because you have everything 50, and you get to see a total package of how its all tuned.
This is one of teh reasons most games give you skills early and power them up as you go, because for the total picture of the job to make sense, you may need some skills earlier, even if they are weakened, like pug needs mp management abilities, blm needs convert etc.

Also having nothing you can do besides wait for teh beginning of teh fight for every melee class is a bad design, people like to initiate combat, possibly at an advantage, they need to abandon the do nothing until you build up power for 4/5 battle jobs (and the only one who can take initiative is archer, and it doesnt get barrage till like, what 34?), its boring, and even though once you get going its ok, its not ok early, and while invig is great, the only person who will have invigorate starting off is lancer.

The abilities and combat is poorly tuned for the ride up, and it needs more starting abilities even if they arent tp earning/based.

the system has some real strengths, and at 50 when you see the full picture of jobs, its generally pretty good, but why does the game actually start at cap? where is the fun before you get to cap? how fun will it be when they have jobs and you cant use bloodbath, invigorate, cure etc? (sure you could level them, but if you want to main monk, you are only really going to want to invest in whatever will actually be useful from level 30 onwards)

In all honesty i feel like the combat designs blindspot is being balanced for having all skills and levels already done.

That quote is so untrue, Also quoting the guy that has been piss poor about the battle system since the stamina system was removed is the wrong person to quote cause he has been hating all changes since then. The melee classes are fine low~mid lvl cause i levled my mrd 10~14 in less than 30 mins combos work fine for all low lvl classes. Even when solo you can still hit combo's to the side of the mob w/o stunning them.

[Murugan]

That quote is so untrue, Also quoting the guy that has been piss poor about the battle system since the stamina system was removed is the wrong person to quote cause he has been hating all changes since then. The melee classes are fine low~mid lvl cause i levled my mrd 10~14 in less than 30 mins combos work fine for all low lvl classes. Even when solo you can still hit combo's to the side of the mob w/o stunning them.

I think playing a melee class solo or tanking and using the directional combo attacks is the most fun I've had in game to date. Finally a chance to use SE's own animation lock against their mobs!

[Bahn]

That quote is so untrue, Also quoting the guy that has been piss poor about the battle system since the stamina system was removed is the wrong person to quote cause he has been hating all changes since then. The melee classes are fine low~mid lvl cause i levled my mrd 10~14 in less than 30 mins combos work fine for all low lvl classes. Even when solo you can still hit combo's to the side of the mob w/o stunning them.

An ad hominem attack doesn't invalidate his current opinion about the combo system.

I actually have the same opinion about the current system myself. The system at rank 50 works perfectly with my Gladiator, but it feels totally incomplete in the low-midlevel range with my other characters. Before the skill streamlining of 1.20, early access to "weaker" versions of the tier 2/3 stuff made me feel like I could get a taste of the complete package around level 20-30. Subsequent levels gave me access to really cool skills, but even before then the tier 1 skills were sufficient to let you get a chance at how the classes should play like.

With the new skill streamlining, now I'm leveling simply waiting for the next skill that I can use to complete this incomplete combo. It feels like a core component of my character is completely missing until I hit the necessary levels to get my combo finishers.

I have the same opinion as Rowyne about the current combat system. To me, the current combat system feels a little less interactive (unless I'm fighting something stupid hard that requires me to watch my HP). It definitely feels more streamlined with the combo mechanics dictating what you should do, but the positional requirements really screw me up because of Square's current client server architecture where the client fails to properly update the server often enough on positional changes.

The "additional" affects from hitting from the proper side should be bonuses you should still get, but it should not be a requirement to keep a combo going. If the client was properly updating the server on position changes, I would be for it, but I've had too many instances where on my screen I hit with a WS that requires a backstab, but the game tells me I hit from the left/right.

To anyone who wants to keep it civilized and add their two cents about the combo system, there's a couple great threads in the Battle Mechanics forum about this.