Can Summoners Get Some Of These Combat Changes?

[Magic-Mal]

It's pretty funny how they gave scholar misasma II to improve their aoe dps but not summoner.

In a 1v1 Single-target damage race, with no stacks allowed, SCH would win because Broil II xD. That's not good!

[Sayora]

In a 1v1 Single-target damage race, with no stacks allowed, SCH would win because Broil II xD. That's not good!

Is this relevant for some reason? You're supposed to use your stacks as a Summoner and unlike a Scholar you'll always want to put your stacks into something that'll boost your damage.

[Magic-Mal]

Is this relevant for some reason? You're supposed to use your stacks as a Summoner and unlike a Scholar you'll always want to put your stacks into something that'll boost your damage.

It is relevant because very often you have no stacks and no aetherflow ready. Especially if you just blew stacks on AoE. So at that point you're just using Ruin with Bio III + Miasma III. Remember you only get 3 stacks and Fester/Painflare/Energy Drain is only a 5sec cooldown. So there's a 45sec gap.

But the actual point of the comment was to point out how SCH has a spammable Broil III at like 250 potency and SMN only has Ruin, 100 potency and a 15% chance to use Ruin IV which is only 200 potency...

[Sayora]

It is relevant because very often you have no stacks and no aetherflow ready. Especially if you just blew stacks on AoE. So at that point you're just using Ruin with Bio III + Miasma III. Remember you only get 3 stacks and Fester/Painflare/Energy Drain is only a 5sec cooldown. So there's a 45sec gap.

But the actual point of the comment was to point out how SCH has a spammable Broil III at like 250 potency and SMN only has Ruin, 100 potency and a 15% chance to use Ruin IV which is only 200 potency...

But the dots hit harder, Fester has double the potency of Energy Drain, and you have a pet that's attacking too. Not to mention Tri Disaster buffs Ruin potency by 20 for 15 seconds.

Broil II may have 80 potency over Ruin III and 30 potency over Ruin IV, and that might feel bad, but there are other factors to take into consideration.

[Magic-Mal]

.

I was actually doing some noobie math after I responded to your first response lol.

I made it a 30sec damage test starting with DoTs in Single-target with a 2.5 GCD

Scholar:
+ Miasma(230 potency)
+ Bio II(350 potency)
+ 10 Broil IIs (2,300 potency)
_____________________________
2,880


Summoner:
+ Bio III(400 potency)
+ Miasma III(450 potency)
+ 10 Ruins(1,000 potency)
___________________________
1,850 potency

Even with Tri-Disaster ruins would only end up as 1,200 potency. You would have no choice but to use all 3 Festers. If you use just Festers and no Disaster you'll only end up at 2,750 >.<

Of course this only face value math but for a whole 30secs SMNs aren't doing damage. And that's just 30 not 45. But in the end there's no reason why the downtime should be that hard...

EDIT: Also did simple math on DRG Full Thrust combo with Heavy Thrust and 2 combos makes 1,909! Not including auto-attack

[Angry_Evil]

Of course this only face value math but for a whole 30secs SMNs aren't doing damage. And that's just 30 not 45. But in the end there's no reason why the downtime should be that hard...

Add garuda to this.
Tho I am kinda agree with this. There are times when I don't have stacks, and very little mp for r3 spam... and kinda DPS doesn't rly show it but at this times my contribution to raid damage is pretty meh. Especially if there's adds or dps checks or smthn. Obviously this should be countered with planning etc. but eh. Planning is good and all but with 4.0 smn it's just not fun at all.
Also literally fake summoner dps...

[Viridiana_Sovari]

Of course this only face value math but for a whole 30secs SMNs aren't doing damage. And that's just 30 not 45. But in the end there's no reason why the downtime should be that hard...

You are also negating most of their kit.

-pet does damage constantly
-you barely ever cast ruin I now. Normal group had BRD or MCH. Between their refresh and your own Lucid Dreaming you have waaaaay too much mana. You spend most of your time casting ruin III now even outside DWT.
-shadowflare (yes I know sch has it also)
-Fester has to be factored in...that is 3 casts during that 30s
-DWT will happen once per minute filling the other "30s window" if you choose to break it down this way.
- 3D if cast correctly gives you more than 25% uptime on ruination buff since DWT resets CD.
-Rouse Enkindle...
-Unlikely to get 0 Ruin IV procs in that time.
-Bahamut twice a minute
-Raid utility and mobility have to be factored in.
-Point is you can't just pull out what skills you want and say oh hey SMN damage is too low. Job has to be looked at as a whole or not at all.