So...Can a SCH tell me how SCH's are right now relative to WHM and AST?

[Dregenfox]

Loool Sacred Soil. I'm guessing actual Scholars have stopped posting in this thread if this is what people are coming up with.

If your response to heavy incoming aoe damage is to spend AF for energy drain instead of something like indom/SS then you have bigger problems you need to deal with on your scholar...

I mean do you people even look at how much mana E-drain actually brings back compared to the mana cost of hard-casting succor/Adlo? I don't get why people love e-drain so much lol. Scholars are not vampires.

[Iveriad]

Loool Sacred Soil. I'm guessing actual Scholars have stopped posting in this thread if this is what people are coming up with.

Sacred Soil is useful during big pulls and major AoE damage like Ukehi.
And Sacred Soil might also give you a free Succor which is great.

[Deceptus]

Scholar simply doesn't synergize at all anymore, they have no identity.

Dissipation doesn't synergize with Fey Union.

Lots of their heals are abiliites, which aren't affected by Largesse. Or the Dissipation buff.

Their key spell, Adlo, is a mana hog now. AST shields for cheaper, faster, and for more shield.

Embrace was nerfed but the healing power wasn't compensated in Physic. Physic is still the lowest potency heal.

Currently there is no reason at all to take Selene, Eos outshines her in every way. The only thing she has is a worse version of the Arrow Card.

[Mirakumi]

After clearing Savage 2 on SCH its not as bad as they make it out to be. Our shields and AOE heal prove great help. The only problem is that we can't ADOL on s2 because the crit bug will cause the knockback not to go off and kill pt. lolol But yeah SCH can do just as good. o/ People tell me fuck SCH all the time, but I see SCH clearing SV3 so obviously if its so bad why is it able to clear content.

[Enla]

After clearing Savage 2 on SCH its not as bad as they make it out to be. Our shields and AOE heal prove great help. The only problem is that we can't ADOL on s2 because the crit bug will cause the knockback not to go off and kill pt. lolol But yeah SCH can do just as good. o/ People tell me fuck SCH all the time, but I see SCH clearing SV3 so obviously if its so bad why is it able to clear content.

It was pretty bad at the start of SB, even when taking into account the changes in playstyle we all needed to make. Now however? I think it's just fine. There are a few tweaks that need to be made, notably to Selene, but while it's always been viable it now no longer feels like a chore to play. Which is all I honestly wanted.

[RajaVamberaux]

Fey Union is gated by the Fairy Gauge, of which you need to build up by using your stacks. That alone means it cannot be used proactively until much later into an encounter, and even then it's going to be used as a more reactive.

Much later in the encounter? You mean after the 15s it takes to blow three stacks in the opener and hit Aetherflow? That's not a long time to me. In O3S, watch your fairy gauge and you'll realize it's already at 90/100 when the first Game is played. And that's only about 75s seconds in (meaning use it or it’ll soon be wasted).

Also, it's not a 'reactive ability'. Fey Union usage should be planned just like all of Scholar's other abilities: in tank-focused downtime between Whispering Dawns, and/or alternating it with Fey Covenant, especially for dungeon pulls. Its still-long (but cute) animation means it can't be used reactively. You should plan its use with your co-healer, or at the very least do it at the same time every time with a PUG.

As for Quickened Aetherflow, this is something that more proves my original point of SCH being made into a Reactive Healer than a Proactive healer, as by your own words, Lustrate is our "spammable" Cure 2, something that should be used to maximize our DPS and MP efficiency, and Quickened Aetherflow is actively rewarding us for doing so but since the majority of our Aetherflow abilities have CDs or ill suited to be spammed, we don't have much choice in the matter as to what we spam, leaving Lustrate as the only real option in the matter.

My point was that because Aetherflow is off cooldown faster now than ever, and also this calculation factors into Scholar’s MP capacity, players are punished now more significantly for unwisely using stacks. This reinforces the Scholar’s tactician playstyle, where you need to think carefully about which stacks are for healing, and how many you have in reserve for emergencies or Energy Drain.

If your tank is getting chunked, you should plan on using an Excog/Lustrate there every time, knowing that leaves you with two other stacks. Those stacks should be saved for a weaving opportunity or until ~7s on Aetherflow’s CD. In other words, you should know how many (Energy Drain or Lustrate) you have to “spam”.

factual settings

We can use your example. The problem with it is the Scholar in your setting isn’t playing very well. Refer back to the Aetherflow Stack hierarchy. Why are you placing Sacred Soil down when the only incoming damage is on the tank? So now I’m up one stack on you. Additionally, if this is the first pull, we should have 3 stacks in the bank and Aetherflow off cooldown. So now I’m up four. If it’s a later pull (perhaps between packs, or between Aetherflows in a raid), Aetherflow should be on CD, and I need to use these stacks anyways or MP is wasted.

You also neglect (when mentioning Asylum/Earthly Star), that in the same situations Scholar has fairy which is Roused 33% of the time.

In the boss setting you said ‘Double Lustrate or Indom + Lustrate’ but we have three stacks. There wouldn’t be bane in those situations. So I’m up one.

In both cases, Scholar still has stacks to play with (since I found some to use more optimally), but WHM/AST have none and now have to readjust their planned usage of the ED/Tetra. So if any crap hits the fan for the next 40s, and a strong, instant single target or group heal could save it, Scholar will usually be best positioned to do so.

It's not a detriment, it's just that SCH is more limited in this department BECAUSE it doesn't have a stronger GCD than Physick and had no choice in the matter and unlike WHM/AST, are at the mercy of Aetherflow to grant them a heal WHM/AST have naturally, on top of their oGCD to heal more effectively. It's not a matter of using oGCD as a detriment, it's that SCH has to use their oGCD to make up for their lack of a Cure 2/Benefic 2 whereas WHM/AST do not.

Personally, I believe the three healers are more balanced now than they ever have been. I’m also not trying to say Scholar doesn’t have to “push more buttons to do the same thing” - it does. I just want to encourage people to see the advantages of the planning & micromanagement, and the way in which the current toolkit reinforces this archetype more than “shield healing” ever did.

[Silver-Strider]

Much later in the encounter? You mean after the 15s it takes to blow three stacks in the opener and hit Aetherflow? That's not a long time to me. In O3S, watch your fairy gauge and you'll realize it's already at 90/100 when the first Game is played. And that's only about 75s seconds in (meaning use it or it’ll soon be wasted).

Also, it's not a 'reactive ability'. Fey Union usage should be planned just like all of Scholar's other abilities: in tank-focused downtime between Whispering Dawns, and/or alternating it with Fey Covenant, especially for dungeon pulls. Its still-long (but cute) animation means it can't be used reactively. You should plan its use with your co-healer, or at the very least do it at the same time every time with a PUG.

Let's me put it another way. Fey Union is a very potent regen effect but comes at several disadvantages. Too early, and you end up wasting a tick or 2, too late and the person dies. I try not to classify regen effects as proactive or reactive but my opinion on Fey Union is that, since it requires some sort of build it, it's more reactive as a result, since I can't just put it up at the start and forget about like a WHM or AST regen ability. The cost involved with doing so would be wasting a fairly potent heal tick that would be better suited after a bit of damage has occurred, like when the tank is at the 75% range as opposed to the 90+ range.

My point was that because Aetherflow is off cooldown faster now than ever, and also this calculation factors into Scholar’s MP capacity, players are punished now more significantly for unwisely using stacks. This reinforces the Scholar’s tactician playstyle, where you need to think carefully about which stacks are for healing, and how many you have in reserve for emergencies or Energy Drain.

If your tank is getting chunked, you should plan on using an Excog/Lustrate there every time, knowing that leaves you with two other stacks. Those stacks should be saved for a weaving opportunity or until ~7s on Aetherflow’s CD. In other words, you should know how many (Energy Drain or Lustrate) you have to “spam”.

The problem here is that Lustrate is SCH's big heal. If the tank is taking that level of damage that would require us to "spam" Lustrate, if by the end the tank is still taking that level of damage, we're essentially stuck spamming Physick to make up for that loss. We can't view it as a spammable because it has that limit and a situation can go south at any moment. I love Excogitation because it's a safety net proactive heal that suits SCH but since it only procs at the 50% threshold and since I'm not always sure how much damage the tank will be taking after that point, I'm given a choice to either stop what I was doing (most likely DPSing) and be a precautionary healer, or keep DPSing and use Lustrate when it's too low again. There is a lot of factors to consider as well, such as Tank's gear, CD usage by the tank, how long the pull is taking due to poor DPS,etc. that make relying on a skill such as Lustrate very problematic.

We can use your example. The problem with it is the Scholar in your setting isn’t playing very well. Refer back to the Aetherflow Stack hierarchy. Why are you placing Sacred Soil down when the only incoming damage is on the tank? So now I’m up one stack on you. Additionally, if this is the first pull, we should have 3 stacks in the bank and Aetherflow off cooldown. So now I’m up four. If it’s a later pull (perhaps between packs, or between Aetherflows in a raid), Aetherflow should be on CD, and I need to use these stacks anyways or MP is wasted.

You also neglect (when mentioning Asylum/Earthly Star), that in the same situations Scholar has fairy which is Roused 33% of the time.

In the boss setting you said ‘Double Lustrate or Indom + Lustrate’ but we have three stacks. There wouldn’t be bane in those situations. So I’m up one.

In both cases, Scholar still has stacks to play with (since I found some to use more optimally), but WHM/AST have none and now have to readjust their planned usage of the ED/Tetra. So if any crap hits the fan for the next 40s, and a strong, instant single target or group heal could save it, Scholar will usually be best positioned to do so.

I purposefully neglected the Roused Fairy because it's not much different from WHM/AST Regen effects with the main difference being that Eos is on a much longer CD and lasts slightly less than its competitors. As for the Sacred Soil, I was going by your own flow chart of Lustrate/Exco = Indom -> Energy Drain -> Sacred Soil. You can replace Sacred Soil with Energy Drain/Bane/whatever but the stack is still gone regardless.

The boss scenario was not intended to dictate Aetherflow usage but to demonstrate the flaw in your own example that a WHM/AST would be harder pressed in your supposed scenario than a SCH, which just isn't true at all. You're forgetting that the majority of your Aetherflow abilities have CDs, with only Lustrate and Energy Drain being "spammable" so even if you DID have a stack to spare, you're only healing option would be Lustrate at that point since everything else is on CD for at least 30 seconds. Another thing to consider is WHM and their Lily mechanics that reduce the CD on several of their oGCD. Asylum can be back in a minute, Assize and Tetra can be back within 45 seconds depending on how many Lilies were used and while unreliable, Secret of the Lilies 2 does help as well in CD management on WHM. I've gotten Assize within 30 seconds of each other and while that is uncommon, it's still something that can realistically happen.

Personally, I believe the three healers are more balanced now than they ever have been. I’m also not trying to say Scholar doesn’t have to “push more buttons to do the same thing” - it does. I just want to encourage people to see the advantages of the planning & micromanagement, and the way in which the current toolkit reinforces this archetype more than “shield healing” ever did.

I won't argue that the healers aren't more balanced (despite AST still being over tuned AF) nor am I'm saying that SCH is terrible either but I am saying that the skill ceiling for SCH has been risen tremendously after SB and that it might not be the ideal healer for someone that isn't prepared for the amount of micromanaging or planning it requires. I mean, we've gone back and forth about this for several pages now that anyone looking at it with no idea how to play SCH would immediately avoid it just because it sounds like a chore and a half to play it even remotely effectively, which is an indisputable truth now more than ever.