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  1. #1
    Player
    Len's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    626
    Character
    Len Orlan
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 100

    Developers Poor Attitude to Summoner

    Exhibit A:
    One example of this was the Summoner. That was highly demanded, but once it was in, there were more and more requests. "You should be able to summon all the Summons and Eidolons!" That can push a person to think, "Oh, I shouldn't have included a Summoner in there." - LINK
    The developers failed to meet even the lowest expectations with what they conceived of Summoner since its inception. That was your own failure, not the playerbase for rightfully expecting a better delivery. (Don't take this as me saying that having a pantheon of full-sized Summons is a reasonable request. It's not.)

    The intent of this thread was to highlight the fact that often the concerns of Summoners are often met with apathy, or left entirely unaddressed. Here we are in Stormblood with a mighty stack of issues piled high and the only thing that's been relayed to us so far is that they're working to resolve Demi-Bahamut causing visibility issues.

    It just doesn't bode well for Summoner that the director of this game, who has enough pull with the battle system designers to keep esuna in the game, approaches Summoner with a sense of disdain.
    (35)
    Last edited by Len; 07-19-2017 at 07:14 AM.

  2. #2
    Player
    Len's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    626
    Character
    Len Orlan
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 100
    Exhibit B:
    "Next question. Red Mage heals scale off INT. Can Summoner heals also scale off INT instead of MND?"
    "Huh?"
    "You're talking about Summoner, yeah?"
    "Yes, Summoner."
    "Red Mage. Born from both white magic and black magic..."
    "Yes, we know."
    "Summoner..."
    (audience laughs)
    "I'm sorry, I'm not sure what you're talking about."
    "Yes, that's exactly what we're talking about."
    "Yeah, I understand the argument. With Dual Cast and the kind of healing they can do. When both healers are down and the Red Mage waltz in and saves the day. But, listen, Summoner players, listen okay? Red Mage can raise, okay? And Black Mage, nothing, okay? That's why we have jobs, okay?"
    "Okay, yes."
    "So go play a Red Mage (if you want to do what Red Mages do)."
    - LINK
    Naoki Yoshida's comments on SMN from the last Live Letter.
    (29)

  3. #3
    Player
    JumperX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Posts
    503
    Character
    Sam West
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 36
    Does any of the dev tem members play as a SMN? It really feels as if they can associate with the class at all. I dint really think the SE Executive department is preventing them for creating and design a decent SMN.
    (5)

  4. #4
    Player
    Niraves's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Posts
    373
    Character
    Niraves Lunas
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 80
    "So go play a Red Mage (if you want to do what Red Mages do)."
    Aka go play Red Mage if you want to do competitive DPS.
    (15)

  5. #5
    Player
    JunseiKei's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    The Mist, Ward 9, Plot 2
    Posts
    1,800
    Character
    Xoria Tepes
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 90
    I'm guessing this is yet another complaint thread that players don't like FFXIV's iteration of summoner. It's been said time and time again, each version of Final Fantasy has its own iterations of the jobs. Some are more liked than others, but it doesn't change the fact that it was design choice that the team was going for.

    Just be more truthful and say you don't like Yoshida's version of summoner and don't play the class.
    (12)
    9.23.2019 [11:15 p.m.]Total Play Time: 1552 days, 0 hours, 0 minutes - You'll be hard-pressed to find a more cynical person than me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Odstarva View Post
    You people are never happy.
    [...] You complain and complain and complain.

  6. #6
    Player
    vio_p's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Posts
    76
    Character
    Shizuno Urushibaa
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Blacksmith Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Len View Post
    Exhibit B:


    Naoki Yoshida's comments on SMN from the last Live Letter.
    that was a rough mock of what was actually said. you should watch the live letter instead of taking what others write as fact.
    (5)

  7. #7
    Player
    Chalbee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    286
    Character
    Chalbeaux Maxime
    World
    Ultros
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 80
    I am increasingly convinced that none of the devs play SMN. I have heard nothing good about 4.x summoner and it's so disappointing! 3.x Summoner was my darling, my favorite job! I did everything as that job and now it's not even fun to play. I expected to have to learn a few new tricks, but they made it so I need to unlearn everything and start over. But hey, Bahamut right?!
    (24)
    "Hello, I'm auditioning for the role of Ser Aymeric de Borel, and I'll be singing Electric Chapel by Lady Gaga"

  8. #8
    Player
    AbelArchaniEA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    138
    Character
    Abel Archani
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 80
    Very telling
    (0)

  9. #9
    Player
    Eloah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    2,843
    Character
    Toki Tsuchimi
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by JunseiKei View Post
    I'm guessing this is yet another complaint thread that players don't like FFXIV's iteration of summoner. It's been said time and time again, each version of Final Fantasy has its own iterations of the jobs. Some are more liked than others, but it doesn't change the fact that it was design choice that the team was going for.

    Just be more truthful and say you don't like Yoshida's version of summoner and don't play the class.
    I'm not sure what the OPs intent was, but I don't think its entirely that they hate this iteration. It seems more like they are questioning why certain changes are made and not being made to line up with what a SMN should do and what this version is "promising" or "missing". We should have more summons, yes, since the 3 we've had for 4+ years is kinda insulting. Each summon should be viable, but they are not, Titan being the main issue,and we need a heal for our pet more so than oursleves, so the answer to the Physick question was a little insulting, since it basically said "if you want a DPS who can heal play RDM". There are many people who will go ham over the whole, "It's not a traditional SMN" which doesn't exist. But there are an equal amount of people who love the job, me included, and just want to see the issues it has fixed.
    (11)
    I like helping people with their Job ideas, it's fun to help them visuallize and create the job they'd like to play most. Plus I make my own too, I'll post them eventually.

  10. #10
    Player
    ToasterMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    465
    Character
    Yui Oshima
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Blacksmith Lv 60
    Quote Originally Posted by JunseiKei View Post
    I love it when people go ad homenim~ You call me stupid, yet I'm not the one wasting my time playing a game while complaining about it.

    The second comment is literally Yoshida's equivalent of facepalming. It's not the "poor attitude toward summoner" so much as "guys, come on, this really doesn't make sense for how we want the job to work." For some reason, people want all the classes to be able to do all the same things and that's the developer [politely] saying they are silly.
    That isn't what people want. Players want the jobs to be competitive. Right now RDM completely outclasses SMN in every aspect. There is no reason to bring a SMN over a RDM in a raid. For example, healers want it so that they aren't forced in to switching to AST if they wanted to raid or farm because (understandably) lots of groups only wanted AST because AST could do everything WHM could on top of bringing the best utility in the game.

    Here's another example. Discord has gotten so popular because it does everything that older chat clients did and more. It outclasses them in every aspect. I haven't even heard of clients like vent or teamspeak mentioned in ages. They could've stepped up their game or get snuffed out. They got snuffed out. Same thing with Netflix and blockbuster. It's the same thing that will happen if SMN doesn't get addressed. RDM is the netflix and SMN is blockbuster that's still trying to keep up. Sadly, it seems like Yoshi P is perfectly okay with SMN getting snuffed out. That might be okay in our free market economy but not in this game.

    RDM brings better DPS along with far greater Utility than SMN ever has. You don't see that as a problem?
    (33)
    Last edited by ToasterMan; 07-19-2017 at 01:51 AM.

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