DRK Consolidated Feedback Thread

[Xenosan]

AST 3.x Spear 20second, 10% Ability cooldown reduction was weaker than Balance or Arrow, so they changed Spear to a Critical Rate up buff instead.

Maybe they should take that old Spear card out of the dumpster and let DRK have it.

If there were a 30% reduction that puts Salted Earth at 30s, C&S at 40s, Plunge/DP at 20s, Shadow Wall at 120s (or 80s if vanilla SW were reduced to 120s ^^), Sole Survivor at 90s. Those sound like good numbers to me...

[SyzzleSpark]

AST 3.x Spear 20second, 10% Ability cooldown reduction was weaker than Balance or Arrow, so they changed Spear to a Critical Rate up buff instead.

Maybe they should take that old Spear card out of the dumpster and let DRK have it.

If there were a 30% reduction that puts Salted Earth at 30s, C&S at 40s, Plunge/DP at 20s, Shadow Wall at 120s (or 80s if vanilla SW were reduced to 120s ^^), Sole Survivor at 90s. Those sound like good numbers to me...

Yeah. As a job that has (used to have) a lot of oGCDs, I knew the old Spear wasn't the optimal DPS card but if the AST had it and I/we got it I definitely took every possible advantage of it, and it was fun.

On the topic of an 80s recast Shadow Wall... does anyone else think that this actually wouldn't be that OP? :3 I mean they'd probably have to cut Sentinel to 120s to balance that out, but still.

[SyzzleSpark]

Yeah, so something like this would be neat:

First revert Dark Passenger, then -

Dark Arts:
Attune with the darkness within you, increasing the potency of several actions. Can only be executed when succumbing to the Darkside. Effect fades if Darkside is canceled.
Duration: 10s
Additional Effect: Reduces the recast timer of Carve and Spit and Dark Passenger by 1 second.

The Blackest Night: Creates a barrier around self that absorbs damage totaling 20% of your maximum HP, or around a party member that absorbs damage totaling 10% of your maximum HP.
Duration: 6s
Increases Blood Gauge by 50 when full 20% (10%) is absorbed.
Additional Effect: Reduces the recast timer of Delirium and Shadow Wall by 5 seconds when full 20% (10%) is absorbed.

[MauvaisOeil]

Yeah, so something like this would be neat:

First revert Dark Passenger, then -

Dark Arts:
Attune with the darkness within you, increasing the potency of several actions. Can only be executed when succumbing to the Darkside. Effect fades if Darkside is canceled.
Duration: 10s
Additional Effect: Reduces the recast timer of Carve and Spit and Dark Passenger by 1 second.

The Blackest Night: Creates a barrier around self that absorbs damage totaling 20% of your maximum HP, or around a party member that absorbs damage totaling 10% of your maximum HP.
Duration: 6s
Increases Blood Gauge by 50 when full 20% (10%) is absorbed.
Additional Effect: Reduces the recast timer of Delirium and Shadow Wall by 5 seconds when full 20% (10%) is absorbed.

I allways thought partial blood restore for TBN would encourage some use outside of other cooldowns. Let's be honest, in roulette runs, once you fight 3 ennemies or less TBN remains a no go as the shield might no break, and will surely not if you stack it with rampart or shadow wall. Convalescence remains a good cooldown to stack with it, even if the effect prevent no burst damage. In the end, all damage reduction cooldowns, blinds or avoidance of any sort, are fighting against TBN functionnalité.

Of course it won't make TBN a force to restore partial blood, but at least no such loss as it is now.

[Valdegarde]

Convalescence increases the shielding from Nocturnal Aspected Benefic or Adloquium, which takes priority over the Blackest Night shield.
This is one of my highest concerns about Dark Knight overall, the interaction with healers. Besides shields blocking Blackest Night, there is whole blood price vs. holy dynamic (albeit much more toned down from Heavensward...but only because blood price got worse!), and healers straining to use every last cooldown and GCD to keep you afloat once you use Living Dead...and it never turn into Walking Dead, so when Living Dead wears off you die for real right after because the healers ran out of steam.

There's other examples of course, but while the other tanks and healers work well together, Dark Knight feels like many of their mechanics actively conflict with healers doing their jobs.
Edit: the rest is still appropriate

[SyzzleSpark]

priority over the Blackest Night shield.

I'm pretty sure this tidbit actually isn't true, TBN takes priority. I've never had it not pop on a TB no matter how many shields I had, and while it might hold true for AAs if it goes in order of cast, shield healers rarely waste time shielding you for fluff damage, nor should they.

[Valdegarde]

Oh! My experiences differ, but that could be errors in perception. I'll test it out for myself and see, but I trust your knowledge on the issue.

Edit: Yep, absolutely at least with Adloquium, Blackest Night takes priority. I feel like this either wasn't always the case or acts differently with other skills since I remember other situations in early Stormblood, but it's good news. Sometimes it's good to be wrong!

[TouchandFeel]

I decided to make an update pass on my previously suggested changes.
Major updates are highlighted in red.

1A) Problem: DRK is lacking in lower-end mitigation to be used for basic incoming damage such as auto-attacks when compared to the other tanks.
1B) Solution: Add an additional effect to Blood Price where the % of damage returned as HP from Soul Eater is increased. Also Blood Price MP and Blood return could use a boost.
2B) See suggestion 3B.

2A) Problem: Shadow Wall is discernibly worse than it's equivalents on the other tanks, Vengeance and Sentinel.
2B) Solution: Reduce Shadow Wall's CD from 180 seconds to 120 seconds.

3A) Problem: Dark Passenger no longer seems to be useful due to low damage and a steep resource (MP) cost.
3B) Solution: Increase recast time to 60s. Remove base MP cost. Remove Blind effect from DA version. Add the additional effect of reducing target's damage dealt by X% (5%?) for the DAed version for 15s.

4A) Problem: Carve & Spit needs to provide more of a decision to DA or not since the non-DA version lacks value compared to the DA version.
4B) Solution: Increase non-DAed version's potency to 140 and increase it's MP return to equal the cost of a DA.

5A) Problem: The Blackest Night's duration feels a bit short, especially with a slight delay in activation (hope I'm not the only one that notices this).
5B) Solution: Increase duration from 5 seconds to 6 seconds, same duration as Inner Beast.

6A) Problem: Sole Survivor has little to no use in boss fights.
6B) Solution: Reduce recast to 90s. Additional effect of placing the buff Soul Tap on the player, doubles the MP returned from Syphon Strike for a duration of 15s.

7A) Problem: Living Dead is a way more cumbersome ability compared to it's equivalents on the other tanks, Hallowed Ground and Holmgang.
7B) Solution: First off it NEEDS better visual messaging for the activation of the Walking Dead status so that healers can easily see when this goes active and they need to react, this should at least include a much larger/noticeable visual fx on the DRK. Make self-healing count towards the needed incoming heals with maybe a buff to self-heals. Change the potential of dying if not healed to receiving a weakness/brink of death debuff for X seconds (30 seconds?).

8A) Problem: As of 4.05 Bloodspiller is not enough of a gain when used.
8B) Solution: Additional effect of reducing Delerium CD by X seconds (20s?) when used without DA. Decrease potency of non-DAed Bloodspiller by 20 to 380, 455 in Grit. Increase potency of DAed Bloodspiller by 20 to 560, 670 in Grit.

9A) Problem: Dark Mind is too reliant on the content being designed to cater to the ability.
9B) Solution: Change Dark Mind to Shadow Skin. Use the Shadow Skin icon and animation/fx from 3.X. Recast 60s. Reduces damage taken by 10%. DAed version reduces damage by 20%. Duration 15s.

10A) Problem: Delerium feels a bit underwhelming for a high level ability that costs half your gauge.
10B) Solution: Add the additional effects of providing a 1200 potency heal on use when in Grit and increase the MP gained on use by 50% (3600mp) out of Grit. Also just change the name to something that fits better like "Blood Frenzy".

[SyzzleSpark]

Some thoughts on these:

1A) Problem: DRK is lacking in lower-end mitigation to be used for basic incoming damage such as auto-attacks when compared to the other tanks.
1B) Solution: Add an additional effect to Blood Price where the % of damage returned as HP from Soul Eater is increased. Also Blood Price MP and Blood return could use a boost.
2B) See suggestion 3B.

I believe Souleater's HP gain return should be doubled or at least set at 150% of the damage dealt, as a baseline. When you look at things like PLD's ability to block, Clemency, WAR's passive Defiance Parry boost and Equilibrium/IB, its pretty clear that these are intended to be bonuses at the expense of DPS, while tanking, or while in tank stance. If Souleater's heal is the equivalent to these aspects of those jobs, its incredibly weak, and provides poor defensive incentive to use Grit beyond the baselines -20% DR. While I used to think attaching a % DR to Blood Price or an idea such as yours would be good for the job, I don't think its what it needs at this point. Souleater just needs its healing buffed altogether. The fact that the healing component is tied to an attack that doesn't even ignore the Grit penalty, in spite of being tied to Grit, is really stupid as well.

2A) Problem: Shadow Wall is discernibly worse than it's equivalents on the other tanks, Vengeance and Sentinel.
2B) Solution: Reduce Shadow Wall's CD from 180 seconds to 120 seconds.

This is good for the job and a good idea, but I don't even think we should stop there. Shadow Wall would still be kinda meh even at 120s and still be 100% inferior to Vengeance. I think a good solution to this would be to have DA shorten its recast time by 1-2s per cast.

3A) Problem: Dark Passenger no longer seems to be useful due to low damage and a steep resource (MP) cost.
3B) Solution: Increase recast time to 60s. Remove base MP cost. Remove Blind effect from DA version. Add the additional effect of reducing target's damage dealt by X% (5%?) for the DAed version for 15s.

I would rather its MP cost stay, but simply be lowered. They already did this ability right once (in 3.x) they should simply put it back where it was. Simplest solution is often the best.

4A) Problem: Carve & Spit needs to provide more of a decision to DA or not since the non-DA version lacks value compared to the DA version.
4B) Solution: Increase non-DAed version's potency to 140 and increase it's MP return to equal the cost of a DA.

I actually don't think this is a problem at all. DA effects should rightfully be superior in a majority of cases to their non-DA'ed versions. Carve and Spit is a goalpost mechanic. It comes up once per minute to ensure that you are managing your mana properly, and if you aren't, you suffer a considerable DPS loss by either delaying its use or using the un-DA'ed version. Buffing the non-DA'ed version raises the skill floor, which is already stupidly high on this job, and makes getting off a DA-C&S less rewarding/less of a gain, which is the precise same problem as you have outlined with Bloodspiller in #8.

5A) Problem: The Blackest Night's duration feels a bit short, especially with a slight delay in activation (hope I'm not the only one that notices this).
5B) Solution: Increase duration from 5 seconds to 6 seconds, same duration as Inner Beast.

I was a pretty brutalized victim of the DC relocation, and I frequently am saddled with 150-200 ping, and yet I rarely have the delay issue with TBN even when using it with a macro. However, the duration increase I have no argument with, it can and should happen.

6A) Problem: Sole Survivor has little to no use in boss fights.
6B) Solution: Reduce recast to 90s. Additional effect of placing the buff Soul Tap on the player, doubles the MP returned from Syphon Strike for a duration of 15s.

I find buffs that give DRK more mana a bit extraneous, because the job is already drowning in it since SB; overflow is a very real danger and preventing it is a proper mechanic of the job. I think a very simple way to give this ability value would be to have it restore 20% of your HP immediately, and give you the mana if the mob dies. This way it has value regardless of the situation.

7A) Problem: Living Dead is a way more cumbersome ability compared to it's equivalents on the other tanks, Hallowed Ground and Holmgang.
7B) Solution: First off it NEEDS better visual messaging for the activation of the Walking Dead status so that healers can easily see when this goes active and they need to react, this should at least include a much larger/noticeable visual fx on the DRK. Make self-healing count towards the needed incoming heals with maybe a buff to self-heals. Change the potential of dying if not healed to receiving a weakness/brink of death debuff for X seconds (30 seconds?).

Self healing already counts towards cleansing Walking Dead actually, its just that ours is so paltry and healers so readily burst it off of you when they notice it that you barely see any effect. Honestly this ability should just be scrapped altogether and made into something else, its annoying as hell. I used to think this ability was great, because I had a static, then I took a break from the game and I've been living the pug life ever since, and even when I sub for organized groups, its as though healers don't even know this ability exists, its insane. I've mentioned elsewhere on the forums that 90% of the buffs that people suggest to LD actually make it worse in some ways. This is no exception, as I guarantee you this idea will just give healers an excuse to ignore it further if they don't care about your DPS.

8A) Problem: As of 4.05 Bloodspiller is not enough of a gain when used.
8B) Solution: Additional effect of reducing Delerium CD by X seconds (20s?) when used without DA. Decrease potency of non-DAed Bloodspiller by 20 to 380, 455 in Grit. Increase potency of DAed Bloodspiller by 20 to 560, 670 in Grit.

Natural Bloodspillers are a significant potency gain. Its only when the blood to use them is proc'ed with TBN that the situation becomes dubious. I think the simplest solution here, and one that has been suggested many times, is to have TBN, if it pops, proc a free DA effect on your next Blood ability.

9A) Problem: Dark Mind is too reliant on the content being designed to cater to the ability.
9B) Solution: Change Dark Mind to Shadow Skin. Use the Shadow Skin icon and animation/fx from 3.X. Recast 60s. Reduces damage taken by 10%. DAed version reduces damage by 20%. Duration 15s.

Perfect, no argument here. I don't even think it would be OP at 20s duration.

10A) Problem: Delerium feels a bit underwhelming for a high level ability that costs half your gauge.
10B) Solution: Add the additional effects of providing a 1200 potency heal on use when in Grit and increase the MP gained on use by 50% (3600mp) out of Grit. Also just change the name to something that fits better like "Blood Frenzy".

Between the MP and the increased duration on BP/BW, Delirium is actually the best use of your blood gauge at all times. In fact, using it in Grit on BP even is a gain over using Bloodspiller, the only reason this is looked down upon is that you then cannot use it on BW for 2 minutes, which is of course bad. Again I think a recast reduction mechanic tied to DA would work well here, such as reducing its recast by 2-5s per DA, or perhaps extend the BW/BP buff to 10/20s respectively from 8/16s.