Did Samurai replace Monk?

[Morzy]

Like, I have been busy with life since the start of 2017. When I realized we got a expansion that seemed to be tailored to Monk (kind of like HW was for DRG) I was really excited but I didn't want to be too excited because frankly with what Monk was, being top DPS, it felt like the class was getting spoiled.

A week before SB came I logged on. I visited my forest house on the lakefront and smashed my training dummy, seeing if I'm up to snuff with my inactivity due to college and work. I didn't nail fracture perfectly which was fine with me, muscle memory got the rest down quite well and I was satisfied.

So SB came out. I didn't buy it right away let alone pre-order because frankly finances were tight and well I had other things to do at the time. A week went by and my old buddies were yelling at me to get SB, like the excited friends I'm happy to still have in my own little linkshell, even after my inactivity.

I lost b4b, featherfoot, enhanced mantra, steel peak stun, ToD, fracture, and they nerfed (from what I could tell) demo back to 18 seconds and a potency drop in FC. I knew right away that TP management was better without my dots but then it might've made purification useless... Which is a shame, as we got that skill when we needed it the most, and lost it when we lost the abilities that needed it.

But hey I stuck to it. At around 62 as I was watching the forums and the feedback from SB, I heard word about the distaste with Monk and how people felt. THen I realized I didn't look close enough to my skill riddle of fire. I then heard that it was a mearly 3% more DPS than b4b... So really it didn't feel like a new ability, more like a compensation for nerfing my favorite class..


And let me be clear. I started playing Monk just before 2.3 was released. The only time I played it was outside light grinding for my WHM relic because well I was sick of WHM! Haha. However I began to enjoy Monk. It was fast paced and truly made me feel immersed in the game. It reminds me of my favored character from Smash Bros; Fox. It's not that I only played it to escape wHM, I was simply working my hardest on my relic. It turns out the only time I remember playing Monk was when I raided. As I raided more and learned the skill (after you know, saying eff you to the true rotation with positions, at least at first. Once I accepted it and took up the positional rotations, it was so fun, it felt like dancing. As I raided more and more and got better and better, I played WHM less and less and before I knew it, my WHM relic felt useless and my main shifted to Monk.

Back to the top DPS thing. This was actually a problem for me. You see, I happeend to be a friend of a very insecure bard. And as you might remember, Bard had the absolute lowest DPS. It was so bad that when MCH came out, bard was ignored by everyone. Anyway. It was even worse in final coil because while we raided, I got my BiS gear after our first T12 clear. I didn't even need T13. The bard, unfortunately, could never get the treasured bracelet from T11 no matter how many clears we got.


So after hearing more and more about Monk, I was seriously considering leveling SCH who was only 2 levels behind me (little did I know at the time that you guys screwed over SCH too.. yeah... since i touched on it, thanks also for dropping SCH down the status of "possible main healer"). However, I love Monk and it deserved the benefit of the doubt, so here I stand at 68.. I've tried riddle of fire a few times.. And don't really like it.. It basically takes our GL speed away, something we've had to get use to since level 40, 28 levels ago.. It ruins my flow and.. yeah. I'd rather have b4b even if it meant taking 25% more damage, or whatever it was.


So let's talk about SAM. I like SAM. It's awesome, it uses the same gear as Monk and considering I don't exactly like DRG and NIN all that much, I was excited to level it, and still am.

Only... today I learned something interesting. Apparently SAM was advertised as the top DPS..? Or at least in one of the articles I found talking about its announcement back in february, it claimed the job "will focus on dealing "massive damage"" (source which is fine, but...

Pre SB, Monk was top DPS. There wasn't much reason this would change. It didn't have many raid utility that could otherwise contribute in the place for DPS (think Bard/MCH).

Did SAM replace Monk? Did you (SE) do this because you didn't know what to do with Monk? Or were you seriously trying to make the job more appealing to new players and... Yeah. Because I get that maybe you wanted SAM to be the best, but you didn't have to go against the basic playstyle that this job has had from the start and just.. give us crappy excuses for new abilities...

Thanks for reading.

[Gokuhan]

You think it hurts for MNK? I main DRG and raid utility or not it blows to have our dps knocked down as far as it was.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Despite Tackle Mastery being downright awful, Monk is actually in a fairly strong spot. They do crazy amounts of damage, and could easily be shifted into a comp without losing too much. Dragoon is the job looking like it may suffer, especially if they buff Machinist a fair bit.

[Morzy]

Monk is actually in a fairly strong spot. They do crazy amounts of damage

It's not the damage I have a problem with. I'm not mad because of the loss in damage. It's what SE did to the job that resulted in not just the state of its DPS but also its playstyle that I don't like.

You think it hurts for MNK? I main DRG and raid utility or not it blows to have our DPS knocked down as far as it was.

I would switch places with your job in terms of DPS if I could get the playstyle I had in HW back. Forget my new abilities. I would be fine if they buffed my pre-SB abilities to match what your job does right now in terms of DPS and raid contribution. I don't know what SE did to your job with this patch but considering what I saw and herd throughout HW, you have my sympathy.

[Mysticdraggon]

yes, a lot of what monk had was cut in half and compensated with SB content, but that does not mean sam is replacing the class. however, i do have my own suspicious when sam was featured as the best DPS and that it was convenient that such a powerful class was available in SB. basically, as soon as they get a lot of people playing SB, they will either nerf SAM and take away the class's spotlight or (i hope) buff other DPS classes to have the same potential.

so if i have to say anything, keep SAM as is. its probably the only class that feels like your not just the party's "extra" damage output. instead, the SAM IS the DPS of the party and i wish that other DPS classes were roughly the same.

the only similarity between pre-4.0 monk and 4.0 SAM is the amount of de-buffs you can place on each enemy. in which most of these abilities, I.E ToD, was removed from Monk's utility.

....i miss ToD...

[Morzy]

yes, a lot of what monk had was cut in half and compensated with SB content, but that does not mean sam is replacing the class.


....i miss ToD...

And I don't get that. It would have been nice if SAM and Monk were neck and neck, competition is good and it would be kool to have more variety as which melee a raid team would prioritize. Which I suppose they still do now because monk is second best DPS (?) but not a lot of people like it anymore so... Yeah..

And ya.. I miss ToD too =_=. It feels really bland without dots. I always remember either needing to refresh DoTs or needing to use an ability that just got off cooldown but now... i'm just moving on with the same rotation. It's.. Boring.

[Morzy]

You realize MNK has brotherhood and mantra right. If MNK did the same DPS as samurai, samurai then would have no place.

You really don't understand how SE balances jobs DPS, do you...

It would have been nice if SAM and Monk were neck and neck

I might throw "DPS" around lightly but I don't necessarily mean Monk doing the same damage as SAM. I talked about competition between the two and that's what I want but there is no competition because Monk is a complete mess and got the worst abilities in this patch out of all of the jobs (my adopted opinion, argue it if you wish)

So no, you are correct. Monk can't be as independent as SAM in terms of it's raw DPS in relation to it's raid utility (or lack thereof) So please pull your head out of your butt and stop reponding for my plea of "moar DPS for monk" when all I freaking want is for SE to fix this mess they made and make the job fun again AND generate actual competition between two jobs that same similar lack of raid utility and use the same freaking gear. Geez.

[Sokutaban]

Monk right now, for me, feels like being given an "ice cream cake" that turns out to be filled with mud. I leveled it to about 64 before I gave up on it to level (the soon to be nerfed) pally. Came back and leveled it to 70. Haven't touched it since.

After reading the patch notes for 4.0, with every ability taking a potency hit, it felt to me that they wanted SAM to take the top spot for melee.

The addition of riddle of fire as an ability also felt like an insult, if anything they should have temporarily increased monk's speed with an ability. This would have let you get greased lightning back faster after loosing it.

Overall they would have to change the job significantly to make me excited to play it again like in 3.0.

[Vanitas]

Tldr: mad cuz monk isn't top dps anymore.

[Daralii]

Tldr: mad cuz monk isn't top dps anymore.

When was it ever?