How can you continue to ignore monk completely?

[Exiled_Tonberry]

I think what people need to understand is that Monk as a job is fine. But useless skills like Tackle Mastery, and incredibly counterintuitive skills like RoF is what has us upset.

RoF honestly makes no sense to me. It goes against what a Monk is. Out of all the things they could have done to us, why nerf our speed?!

[Zohnax]

I think what people need to understand is that Monk as a job is fine. But useless skills like Tackle Mastery, and incredibly counterintuitive skills like RoF is what has us upset.

RoF honestly makes no sense to me. It goes against what a Monk is. Out of all the things they could have done to us, why nerf our speed?!

MNK's speed at GL3 is [virtually] the same as NIN's Huton actually. (Actually, GL is like 0.01~0.02 slower, which is strange because the weaponskill recast reduction are both 15% but a NIN with 1139 Skill Speed vs a MNK with 1234 Skill Speed still has that slightly shorter recast, so I guess that's chalked up to stat weights per job.) It's also not a nerf considering it's not a full time thing. 20 seconds every 90seconds after we lost Blood for Blood, other jobs have higher skill potency, and the developers basically said, going into GL4 would probably make MNK too strong compared to other DPS.

I won't defend the other skills much though.

[Shurrikhan]

Again, if your argument is that MNK didn't see many gameplay improvements over the years since ARR, I would agree. However I can't agree that the loss of a few skills and a rather slight adjustment to their very static, short rotation is really a huge enough change to baby rage about (which I notice you're not doing, and can respect).

This is the crux of the issue to me. When we still had our stanceless skills, especially at high Attack Speed (e.g. sub-2s GCDs), Monk rotation wasn't fixed. it came down to priority systems and 4-6 windows. (Did I already stanceless this DK/Twin? Twice this Demolish? What stance will BFB hit in if I maintain current rotation? Can I DK-drop (on True Strike, before Demolish) given my upcoming oGCDs?) You'd actually even have two different optimal rotations depending on whether Fey Wind was active. Because you had fine rotational control (modular values by the GCD, rather than only sets of 3). Granted, most Monks did not take advantage of this, preferring to simply clip their (de)buffs and rotation as usual and/or being unwilling to put down enough Skill Speed to reach the next plateau (mostly due to crippling TP issues, which left these strategies mostly subject to fights with reduced continuous uptime, usually via speedkills). Oddly enough, now that the TP issues have finally been more or less fixed, we no longer have any opportunity to make use of the extra-fine control and accelerated rotations (e.g. DK/Twin per 8-9 GCDs) that we once needed that TP fix for.

I hope you can see from this, though, why those who did experiment with this level of play would feel cheated, having hoped that we would see more, not less, opportunity, to escape a fixed rotation.

The rest hinges highly on definition. Personally, I would say Heavensward granted immense capability improvement. Its only contribution to gameplay itself (noticeable, but less than often touted), however—mostly by virtue of Tornado Kick being too weak to be used rotationally except at the tail of both IR and BFB with PB ready to restore GL3 and Meditation not scaling with Attack Speed or otherwise too weak to warrant its use as a half-GCD clip-fixer—was its increase to Demolish duration, from 18s to 21s. This is what made the Skill Speed plateaus so much more noticeable, and made ToD and Fracture yet more pivotal in rotation. The rest was simple fight-checking, wherein we now had technically the strongest ranged filler in the game, could make use of up to 21s of downtime (Meditation x5, Purification, Meditation x5, Form Shift x3), and bonus potency before inevitable GL loss via Tornado Kick. Personally, apart from the downtime usage (i.e. our ranged attack filler), The Forbidden Chakra was irrelevant to gameplay. It just padded our opening burst a little.

My hopes for Stormblood were less bloat, which Touch of Death and Fracture were not, and more variety of rotation, stance (Fists of Wind/Fire), and pace. Instead we got more bloat, and less variation. This is, though not by a huge margin, the most "braindead" form Monk has yet seen. And its certainly the most contradictory.

[Shurrikhan]

MNK's speed at GL3 is [virtually] the same as NIN's Huton actually. (Actually, GL is like 0.01~0.02 slower, which is strange because the weaponskill recast reduction are both 15% but a NIN with 1139 Skill Speed vs a MNK with 1234 Skill Speed still has that slightly shorter recast, so I guess that's chalked up to stat weights per job.)

I figure it compounds?

If GL1 shaves 5% recast time, so from 2.5 to 2.375, GL2 would reduces it to 2.256, and GL3 it to 2.143.

Huton shaves off a straight 15%, granting an immediate 2.125.

Their flat contribution is reduced at lower base GCDs. (The percentile, of course, remains unchanged, as does their actual contribution.)

EDIT: Or apparently they're both identical, as GL's reductions work additively, rather than compounding. Both still reduce the GCD by a true percentage, though, so the seconds reduced will be less if the original GCD is less (due to Skill Speed).

[Gleipni]

I totaly agree that monk is just boring as hell,i played it since 2.0,when i saw he had no new offensive skill,only buff,i just went on the RDM,

Every other class had new gameplay new skill,and monk, "take your 2 buff and shhhhh" seriously there is so much thing youc ould do with monk to make it fun,change the effect of his fist,becausemost of teh time time it will be fist of fire for fight,wind for city,and earth for when you take damamge and youc ant hit the boss

The Monk is so basic that its not fun at all to play it,And that riddle of fire OMG,everyone who play monk play it for the speed,what do they give us ? a slow down,do they even play the game or listen to people playing it ?

[Tigerlilley]

My hopes for Stormblood were less bloat, which Touch of Death and Fracture were not, and more variety of rotation, stance (Fists of Wind/Fire), and pace. Instead we got more bloat, and less variation. This is, though not by a huge margin, the most "braindead" form Monk has yet seen. And its certainly the most contradictory.

It's really hard to understand why we lost Touch of Death / Fracture and retained the still useless One Ilm Punch and Arm of the Destroyer. They might as well have kept Haymaker in for a laugh. Like I said in my OP, it's just an insult at this point. And I hear you on contradiction, Greased Lightning is for speed, nope RoF takes that away. Riddle of Earth and Perfect Balance is to keep stacks - but you gotta get hit and Perfect Balance CD is very long / Tornado kick <- what?

[wereotter]

It's really hard to understand why we lost Touch of Death / Fracture and retained the still useless One Ilm Punch and Arm of the Destroyer. They might as well have kept Haymaker in for a laugh. Like I said in my OP, it's just an insult at this point. And I hear you on contradiction, Greased Lightning is for speed, nope RoF takes that away. Riddle of Earth and Perfect Balance is to keep stacks - but you gotta get hit and Perfect Balance CD is very long / Tornado kick <- what?

They seem to be pruning DOTs in general. ninja lost mutilate, dragoon lost phlebotomize, all classes lost fracture, summoner had bio and bio 2 combined, and I'm sure there are others I'm missing.

As far as ignoring the issues with monk generally speaking.... didn't anyone else catch that this was going to happen in the trailer? Warrior of Light starts as a monk, sees the crap SE did with his job, and then takes all the gear he already had and becomes a samurai before he even gets off the boat in Kugane. Pretty sure that was their way of telling us to forget about our old job and change to the new one instead :P

[stanrir]

I still love how they kept talking about getting rid of useless abilities and they left monk with a bunch of useless abilities, and even added a few new ones

[Leonus]

It's really hard to understand why we lost Touch of Death / Fracture and retained the still useless One Ilm Punch and Arm of the Destroyer. Though they did give Mnks a replacement for B4B.

Well, truthfully fracture was not Mnks. It was warriors's. I see what people mean though.

[Tigerlilley]

Well, truthfully fracture was not Mnks. It was warriors's. I see what people mean though.

Did you ... add something on to my quote there. Cuz RoF isn't a B4B replacement. B4B was actually nice to use. I hate Riddle of Fire.