How can you continue to ignore monk completely?

[SpeckledBurd]

At this point Monk is in a good place damage wise (I main Monk and can consistently score 90%+ on both Susano EX and Lakshmi, pretty much no one beats me in damage unless they're getting fed cards or I get screwed by mechanics), but it being in a good place in terms of damage doesn't actually mean it's good. Using Riddle of Fire just feels terrible. Going slow is the feeling of losing GL3 and that's the feeling of failure. Riddle of Earth and Brotherhood meanwhile both swing wildly in terms of how useful they are. Brotherhood basically does nothing in 4-mans unless you have both a Warrior for a tank and another Physical DPS (Which doesn't happen since the DF tries to pair you with a ranged, of which 3/5 are magical), while Riddle of Earth will basically just not work if it's been too long since you've refreshed it.

[Kahnom]

New skills doesn't help MNK evolves into the right direction.(only deep meditation trait is useful)
Hell,even Goon's dps are bad right now but I believe mirage's dive is the evolution DRG need.Mirage's dive makes DRG more fun to play and keep them busy since Goon have a lot of downtime.Nastround's mechanics is not bad but eye stacks should be permanent.

[LunaFaye]

to be honest it doesn't surprise me. With every new expansion, jobs are getting either hit with the extreme nerf bat, or buffed to the sky without adjusting other jobs or balancing them correctly. I can't count how many times I did have to switch my mains, and mostly always a week or two weeks before actual content that matters is released. First it was PLD, then it was Astro, BRD now with SB I don't even know were to begin listing the problems that occurred throughout many of the jobs in general.

While I do like the expansion in general, I was very excited at the take of changing the whole combat system, even that gauge is a cute cosmetic addition, but one thing I wasn't very hyped about were the role skills. Now that they are released, I see that I wasn't very wrong with that, lots of the "uniqueness" of prior jobs have been stripped and their actions made role actions, some are so bad, that nobody would even take these roles since they don't do anything for them.

Not even 5 weeks into the expansion, we start nerfing cast times from pld as example, where was the warrior nerf the last 3 years as PLD was pretty much useless? I don't mind making adjustments, but nerfing classes and then re buffing them should all been happen during beta and not during expansions itself or 3 days before release of savage. And it's not just the pld so, anyways before I keep on my ramble, let me finish with this....

It doesn't come as an surprise to me, that MNK is being ignored, since their counterpart is the samurai and well we all know that the marketing department, did a pretty good job with hyping SAM and RDM up and that lead to a lot of sales, that without these new jobs probably wouldn't have happen. Good Business decision, sadly to say, it comes with a price, and that does effect the player base. Maybe not so much the new players, since all they know are the changes made in SB, but people that played much longer than that, don't find it much of enjoyment. Let's hope that can be changed into positive instead of making players have to switch their jobs. Just to find out that they get nerfed/buffed a month later, or find no "love" thrown their way lol.

[YitharV2]

Not even 5 weeks into the expansion, we start nerfing cast times from pld as example

Yeah, I'm personally of the opinion that we should not nerf unless it's truly necessary but it seems SE doesn't think so. I do feel for PLDs as it's sort of how we felt when they made stance dancing clunky for Warrior.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bsC8...utu.be&t=4m55s

And I also don't really like hopping onto FoTM but it seems that's what MMOs like to do, so I don't blame those who do switch. Samurai just feels like a better Monk in a few ways. The DPS disparity in personal DPS, that was what Monk should have had. The fact that it has really awesome AoE (I mean Monk's AoE is still decent). And the fact that with Samurai there's no worry about losing GL3 (and their weaponskill speed boost lasts a lot longer).

[BucklesTrespen]

My only complaints with how Monk unfolded are:
-Why wasn't Fists of Fire turned into a trait like Ninja's Dripping Blades.
-Why do we still have Fists of Wind.
-Why didn't we get any new abilities, like a combo chain that guarantees a Chakra or something.
-Why do we have Steel Peek? It's such a random ability and hardly fits the Monk aesthetics. With the removal of the stun I'm shocked that we didn't get a new animation / skill name to replace this cling-on with.
-Why did we get Tackle Mastery? It's a complete joke. A 30 potency Fire Tackle isn't mastery, it's just a number buff. Earth Tackle - why do we knock a mob back and out of melee range when we just used a gap closer to get into melee with it? Wind Tackle / Riddle of Wind - Why do we get a 5 second window to Tackle again? Nothing dies in 5 seconds. What super niche situation was envisioned for this complete joke of a skill. The whole Tackle Mastery is a complete letdown.
-Why doesn't Riddle of Earth reset the GL timer on activation and again when hit. The value of this skill swings massively because we can have anywhere between 10 and 16 seconds left on GL at any given time (less when in RoF).
-Why was Tornado Kick left unchanged. This was our GL dump but now we have RoE - a skill that (sometimes) maintains GL in transitions so Tornado Kick, which already saw next to no use is now even less used.
-Why was Deep Meditation made a trait of 50% on a crit. Double rng for a core mechanic.

Actually I'm getting carried away. I must be more upset with Monk than I originally thought...

[silentwindfr]

...snips....

No! all your question are legitimate... when we look at the combat revamp that was done, we can't simply accept it without ask ourself...why?
i can add more why to your list:
- why didn't we get back simian strike back from the V1?
- why are we the only jobs that when mess up get punished? (gl stack lost is a heavy punishement and can happend easily)
- why are we the only jobs that don't have a ranged attack? (yes every jobs outside monk have a ranged attack, to add to the insult, the boss of the monk quest level 60 have a freaking ranged attack)
- why are we the only jobs that feel like out the place each time? (we don't get a clear role, even more now in SB, are we truely a dps? when we see that we do get a survival skill of tank i'm wondering)
- why we was left in this states after the combat revamp?
- why aren't we listened since we are technically the people that know the best the monk... since we play it a lot?
- why add utility to the monk when you add samurai that have no utility? (don't it will have been better to the monk to be the counter part of the sam, while making his damage resistance reduction apply for magic making the jobs be what the magical class need)

it's possible to continue... the trouble is, we don't have a clear discution with the dev team, it seems they get the feedback, but don't understand it... what is leading to that situation. i feel before do anything, they need to talk to us, to listen to us, since in the end...we will be the monk, we will be the one playing it. if it don't appeal us, it's pointless, if it feel bad for us to play it.... it's pointless.

i hope a community manager will pass this message to yoshida and his team, we are not appealing by the monk anymore, the jobs do his role, but is not fun. it's not appealing, it's not challenging, it's not evoluting anymore. we feel like the black sheep of the familly that don't deserve a decent treatment. like because we are top dps we don't need to be look at correctly... when it's not like this... if the other jobs evolve and we don't, you can't expect us to continue to stick to the job when every one evolve, change, get a feeling of progression.

please tell them we want to talk, we need to talk to have a clear discution between them and us. we feel disconnected, we feel abandonned, we feel left out. i'm not english then i can't even express correctly what i feel. exept i'm heartbroken to see the monk in this sorry states. i know that change can't be made in one week or 1 month... i'm not stupid i know it will take time, but at least... communicate with us, we are the community that can endure if you talk to us, if you show that you understand what we try desperatly to say to you.

monk need a serious rework... is not a balance patch, it's really a rework that it's needed... the rework we was deserving to receive with SB. and i doubt any monk will wait until the next expansion for see any change, you did reach a critical breaking point. after what was the situation of the end of hw.... we didn't get out of it, it's even worst... monk don't bring anything worth that justify his presence in group. he don't have a role definite, he don't have a clear identity anymore. it's time to work with us... than against us. please, pretty please.... don't leave u anymore in this mess.

You find MNK boring and unrewarding...

Perhaps don't play it?.....Simple solutions to a simple problem.

i'm one of the people that did stick to monk for age and i'm not the only one in this case, when people like us feel that something is really wrong, not because the class did change, no because the class didn't change... it's extremely bad. say to that sort of people if you don't like don't play it... will only have one effect, less and less and less monk, until, it's too late and the jobs is not played anymore.

our population is slowly reducing with every patch now, to the point that it's not even a bother to say we don't need monk, that monk can be deleted... that it's the point we are.
we don't ask to be the top dps, we don't ask to be cheated or get the most attention because we don't like the change... but because sb didn't change anything, honestly speaking most of the add was... meh or even here for compensate of some loose from the combat system revamp.

then no your way to say it is only insulting to us... because right now, we are not simply saying: "warning what you plan to do is bad" no we are passed this time... it's: "it's critical, if you don't react, we will disappear"
yes a few new player will try monk, until they try another jobs and we will feel more rewarded for appealed to play.

because monk is not the only fast jobs anymore, ninja do it too and fairly well with that.

because monk is not the top dps anymore, sam it is and it deserve it.

because monk combo is not the top edge anymore, dragoon have a more evolued combo system than us.

because monk have nothing more than it defining him... because monk is now in a situation where utility will not help... we need a rework. we need to have a clear identity, what we don't have anymore!

[Paladinleeds]

snip

You're right. All the points are legitimate, but one thing that confuses the heck outta me is the way that physical damage is broken up by type:
Slashing: PLD, WAR, DRK, NIN, SAM
Piercing: DRG, BRD, MCH (I think BRD/MCH use piercing, since they use arrows and gunshots. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here!)
Blunt: MNK

This creates a huge problem, because the piercing debuff of DRG will benefit your BRD/MCH (assuming BRD/MCH are piercing damage), creating some synergy, your slashing debuff of NIN (and WAR I think), synergises with the other tanks, and the SAM. MNK's blunt resistance down affects whom now... just them. SAM is the selfish DPS and gets boosted further by the synergy of a NIN or a WAR's slashing debuff. Which makes them even more powerful compared to MNK. Especially in higher tier play, synergy is a big factor. We need a good party makeup that works well with each other. I know you said we shouldn't wait until next expansion but here's what I would do, but it would have to be next expansion.
New healer: Dancer. Off-healer type role, their magic would be healing only, all attacks would be physical blunt damage and would be used to channel their healing power (thus giving them a reason to DPS!)
New tank: Not sure what tank you'd think of, but something that uses blunt weapons. Maybe make it defensive based like PLD?

This would then give the MNK some synergy with other jobs, and help give them a reason to exist. They would have other jobs that can match up with. I think this would go a long way to helping bridge the gap. There's many other issues here, but I feel this is one I can see the need addressing.

[Xau]

because monk have nothing more than it defining him...

actually we have something what define us, something what... well, repels most people actually

positionals, tons of them, something what for some reason a lot of people(except us monk mains) dislikes like hot lava

[silentwindfr]

the solution for this is quite simple, make the blunt debuff affect to resistance to magic, saying that monk toss chi in his attack for reduce the resistance to magical damage behind... it don't solve all, but until more blunt jobs is added it the best solution.
it will open up more the team setup possibility.

i envision a rework, where we do loose our utility for become the counter part of the sam, when you team is more physical you go with sam, when you team is more magical you go with mnk. even if it don't make a lot of sense, it's the best way to solve a lot of actual trouble. while giving back a role to the monk.

because right now, please give me one reason valid to bring a monk in a group.... mantra? brotherhood? they are not strong enough for justify his presence.
ninja will bring more damage every minute, red mage buff is more interesting. in end everyone is better than us in everything we do... we don't shine in anything anymore. that why we are in this situation. we are not the top dps, we are not the most fast around, we are not the most usefull to the team...we are good in nothing. that the whole trouble.

before we did let it pass, because monk was decent in dps, but with the end of hw it was not the case anymore... and with the apparition of the sam, we did loose all purpose... and it's not utility we need, what we need it's to be a destroyer, what we need it's to be a powerhouse, what we was means to be from the start.

[silentwindfr]

actually...dragoon have more than us now, with them skill they need to change 2 time of position in the same combo
they change for the 4th and the 5th skill of them combo. means if you start on the side, the 4th will ask to go back and the 5th will ask to be on the side.

ok meaculpa they did change this, but they change as much than us now :x