Thread: 4.05 DPS Ranking Expectations

Originally Posted by Chronons

You would need to measure across every fight in the game the uptime between BLM and SAM to definitively say one had greater uptime over the other. You dont have that data, I dont have that data. Until then its purely speculation.

Uptime tells us nothing. And we don't need any data to know that BLM is much more punished by mechanics purely because of how BLM works. Seriously tho, just stop. It becomes very silly.

Originally Posted by Chronons

You would need to measure across every fight in the game the uptime between BLM and SAM to definitively say one had greater uptime over the other. You dont have that data, I dont have that data. Until then its purely speculation.

For BLM to have the same uptime as SAM, the BLM would need to stand in the same exact spot for the entire fight and never move. Sure, on dummy targets they're about the same, but in actual real content, there's no contest. SAM easily has more uptime because they are a melee instant cast job. So what if you get targeted by a mechanic? Just move and continue dpsing while you move. Stay near the boss, perform the mechanic, and continue doing what you do.

BLM has to do things like move out of their leylines, cancel casts to perform mechanics, move their asses into stack mechanics and such. SAM gets 100% uptime on both their damage up and haste buffs, our weaponskills activate instantly, not to mention how on every single encounter that has a stack mechanic, the party (usually) places it on the boss, the Samurai doesn't even need to move. They're really not comparable at all especially at a high level of play.

So yes, you are, in fact, wrong.

Originally Posted by Chronons

They shouldn't. Typically casters have greater uptime than melee due to mechanics which is why they have lower dps. Barring certain fights of course.

Lets take Susy Ex for example - The puddles it casts. Melee has to move the radius of the puddle to get out of it and then the radius to get back in to do damage. Caster only has to move the radius to get out and can continue to damage.

What the hell? Any melee worth their salt abuses the puddles by stacking. If you need to move out of puddles, wait for them to detonate, then move back in, you're doing it wrong. There are plenty of ways to keep attacking while avoiding the puddles, even during my melee phase for RDM I've never had to flat out stop doing damage because of puddles appearing.

If BRD is this low because of the "utility" Clause than NIN need to be down here with RDM and MCH and DRG needs to be higher. But that's not what's going to happen. 4.05 is going to roll around and absolutely nothing is going to change.

They really need to put BLM at the top of the totem pole when it comes to damage. That's all it really has, and it's punished more by mechanics than SAM. They also need to reassess the 4.0 rotation situation because doing a 3.0 rotation without Blizzard IV shouldn't be nearly identical in DPS but also afford tons of extra leeway for mechanics.

And of course MCH needs help badly. I'm also interested to see what they're going to do with DRK. I wouldn't be surprised about a blood price change.

Originally Posted by Elnidfse

If BRD is this low because of the "utility" Clause than NIN need to be down here with RDM and MCH and DRG needs to be higher. But that's not what's going to happen. 4.05 is going to roll around and absolutely nothing is going to change.

I'm starting to see a lot of comments about bard and utlilty. Bard has not to be low because of it, but because he can non stop dps for the whole fight no matter which mechanic is ocurring.
EDIT: I mean, he has to be low, and moreover lower than machinist

Honestly, I don't see why people would have issue with BLM>SAM in optimal setting. Because in truth, optimal situation will be very rare. There are very few attempts where nothing will affect your BLM. I can't think of many time I did Lakshmi or susano where I havnt been targeted by a single flower, lightning rock or dice. if such a thing were to happen, I don't think it would be too far fetched to have the BLM>SAM . but since these situation are as rare as a 8 planets alignment, having the BLM DPS slightly above the SAM to ensure they are roughly equal due to the BLM loosing DPS during mechanics would be ideal.
I mean, SAM bring the slashing debuff, what does BLM bring? I give mana to a healer during transition. That's about it.

Originally Posted by NovaLevossida

They also need to reassess the 4.0 rotation situation because doing a 3.0 rotation without Blizzard IV shouldn't be nearly identical in DPS but also afford tons of extra leeway for mechanics.

It's not just nearly identical, it's better than using the '4.0 rotation.' I'm doing a whole 500 DPS more only using blizzard IV when convert is or about to be ready.

Originally Posted by CapricaLangley

I'm starting to see a lot of comments about bard and utlilty. Bard has not to be low because of it, but because he can non stop dps for the whole fight no matter which mechanic is occurring.
EDIT: I mean, he has to be low, and moreover lower than machinist

No matter what mechanic? What about jails? How about mandatory stuns. Face aways. DPS stops. Jumps. Add burn phases. Melee have for years been using tricks in order to maximize their uptime through mechanics. And yet BRD should be the lower than even the worst case scenario of melee uptime because...?

Originally Posted by Elnidfse

No matter what mechanic? What about jails? How about mandatory stuns. Face aways. DPS stops. Jumps. Add burn phases. Melee have for years been using tricks in order to maximize their uptime through mechanics. And yet BRD should be the lower than even the worst case scenario of melee uptime because...?

BRD has 9 utility skills, on top of being mobile. I understand those mechanics literally stop you from doing anything but what about the other half of mechanics that a BRD can still continue to do their thing with no hindrance? Oh you need to stack? Keep shooting. Oh you need to dodge Thunder 3? Np just keep shooting.

It makes "sense" for them to be lower but I think that has more to do with the DRG nerfs, and with so much of their kit revolving around crit, in later tiers they will be back to end of HW DPS.

Bringing so much to a raid team on top of being the most unaffected DPS class when it comes to mechanics = lower than the rest.