Why HP inflation is a valid concern

[Rhinos]

If the intent for cutting str really was purely to nerf tank damage, SE did it in the entirely wrong way. If they want to lower tank damage, fine, but that should be done by altering the potencies of their moves, which would at least avoid this wonky atk scaling issue we have now.

If this already wasnt the majority of fights we run in to, but this is pretty much how it works already.
They have more on their hands to worry about than tank damage, if theyre trying to change balance this much. This requires scaling down healers healing potency, reducing or flat out removing cooldowns on tanks and or tank stance altogether.

As it stands being a tank means you can survive TWO hits, while dps just melt. (oj a bit of an overexxageration,but still)

This only reinforces my point - tank HP has already inflated since 2.0 and will continue to with tank gear as it is. Even if it's not severe enough to be considered a problem right now, it eventually will be if tank gear is not adjusted. Removing Vit from the damage formula makes it easier to adjust HP values from future gear if needed.

[TankHunter678]

This only reinforces my point - tank HP has already inflated since 2.0 and will continue to with tank gear as it is. Even if it's not severe enough to be considered a problem right now, it eventually will be if tank gear is not adjusted. Removing Vit from the damage formula makes it easier to adjust HP values from future gear if needed.

Considering that any smart coder would put it so that they can adjust the stat weight of the affects of a given stat there is no way that removing vit from the damage formula makes it easier to adjust HP values. As they could adjust future tank armor VIT values for HP and then nudge the AP gain from vit for damage without affecting the HP gain at all. That is the point of adding extra child modifier slots.

Hell, in the Company of Heroes series a given weapon actually had a long list of child modifiers that altered how the weapon performed at a given range in terms of damage and accuracy based the target type, armor type, and facing, as well as influencing the critical event rate, what critical event was to occur, etc. Allowing weapons to be easily tuned to be buffed against particular targets.

Here they could have reduced the stat growth on armor pieces and bumped up the AP modifier for damage without HP gain being affected by anything other then average ilvl and how much raw stat.

[Waliel]

Because if VIT increases both AP and HP, you can't increase/decrease one without affecting the other. If you want to change AP but retain the same eHP, you would need to alter incoming damage to match the HP change, otherwise tanks would have relatively inflated HP on AP increase and deflated HP on AP decrease. Now, if you alter incoming damage, you also have to adjust tank def/mdef or VIT (def/mdef) for all other classes, because raid AoEs hit everyone, not just tanks, unless you don't care how much they hit tanks for. For any AoE mechanics that are preceded or followed by tank busters, you probably would care.

Alternatively you could adjust VIT:AP multiplier every time you want to make a change, which would affect the whole level range, unless they have level specific modifiers for the value. That could possibly break old content tuning, which you might or might not care about. Old players probably wouldn't, new players might.

You'd change the multiplier. The AP difference for low levels would be minimal, if the majority of your AP still came from STR, like I suggested, but you'd have some form of scaling from the right side as well. Now if you tried to change AP by changing the amount of VIT itself, you'd have to start messing with item budgets and how much HP VIT gives to tanks and tanks only. Even now raid AoE only tickles tanks and isn't meant to kill them, so that's irrelevant. I'd be totally fine with Squenix adding some STR to accessories itself, but adding a few points of VIT to low level gear to give tanks their 5 AP back is a much smaller amount of item changes. Just do something to have some scaling from accessories. Wild idea: increase AP gain from STR to 1.25x so you don't have to mess with the right side at all.

The bigger issue I have with this is their sorry excuse of "HP inflation". Now if Squenix just said they did this to lower the tank damage I'd be totally cool with it, but what they gave us just really rubs me the wrong way.

[SpookyGhost]

Just gonna be real for a second: The big, actual problem is that STR isn't on Fending accessories by default. No matter what calculation they run for stats, it still means that in order to fully benefit you need to meld those primary stats onto your accessories. No other job has to do this, everyone else is free to meld secondary stats (which have a much lower weight). This really isn't fair and hasn't been fair since forever. They need to add STR to Fending accessories and then whatever calculation they do with VIT and STR from there doesn't really matter because we'll always want Fending accessories and they'll freely be able to adjust any of the values on them.

[BluexBird]

The problem is that SE thinks that VIT is our primary stat. They think that our goal should be to have as much HP as possible. Even if it's to the point where it makes tanking become laughably easy.

I'm not gonna say that they don't want us to do any damage, because let's be honest - even with VIT accessories, tanks are still able to do quite a lot of damage when they really try and push themselves. Especially when they tank out of tank stance... which is further encouraged by the fact that with VIT accessories they have more HP than they actually need.