Please DON'T remove the Armoury system

[OMEGA_HACK]

I really hate pulling from other MMOs to give/make a point but I suggest looking up some of the melee WHMs in XI, equipped properly they could out DPS some of the highest DPS-able jobs in that game...its not impossible.

And to make reference within the game, duo'd Toto-Rak (LNC and CNJ) from levels 25 (each) to 35, CNJ did engage (melee) on the monsters and made it A LOT faster (since you are under a 1hr time limit) and was worth it. Granted this was during 1.19 but I don't see why CNJ still couldn't do it now.

[Vaymathias]

I really hate pulling from other MMOs to give/make a point but I suggest looking up some of the melee WHMs in XI, equipped properly they could out DPS some of the highest DPS-able jobs in that game...its not impossible.

And to make reference within the game, duo'd Toto-Rak (LNC and CNJ) from levels 25 (each) to 35, CNJ did engage (melee) on the monsters and made it A LOT faster (since you are under a 1hr time limit) and was worth it. Granted this was during 1.19 but I don't see why CNJ still couldn't do it now.

Wow, you are completely missing the point. Your looking at just the classes. You have to look at just the classes in relation to the jobs. As it stands now in many cases, jobs are going to make classes obsolete. A CNJ melee(ing?) is still a healer by FAR, and will never be selected to a DD. That's the problem, if the classes are not versatile enough then they'll just be left out to die. And there's no reason to think that a whm couldn't melee as good or better than a cnj, since the few abilities that a cnj can get from other classes that increase it's damage make little difference.

As it stands there has to be some changes. Maybe after the jobs come out they can retool the classes. Put less of an emphasis for identification for classes (since that's taken care of with jobs) and push them for versatility. Remove some defensive abilities from Glad and add something with damage. Decrease LNC's damage a bit and give them some party support abilities. Make CNJ nukes worth something. And make some of the cross class-able abilities more effective all together to merit usage and push for that versatility.

[darkstarpoet1]

I really hate pulling from other MMOs to give/make a point but I suggest looking up some of the melee WHMs in XI, equipped properly they could out DPS some of the highest DPS-able jobs in that game...its not impossible.

And to make reference within the game, duo'd Toto-Rak (LNC and CNJ) from levels 25 (each) to 35, CNJ did engage (melee) on the monsters and made it A LOT faster (since you are under a 1hr time limit) and was worth it. Granted this was during 1.19 but I don't see why CNJ still couldn't do it now.

remember mages still had their darts and tp moves in 1.19. they no longer have either. the only tp move a mage can use now is second wind.

[KenJammin]

They can delude new players into thinking they have customization and have an easily balanced system for max levels!
Its a slam dunk...

Hopefully the increase in the max level adds a verity of skills worth using but as it stands now everyones going to have 2nd wind, cure, and invigorate on their pallet.


I'd rather have a more streamlined system then this pathetic excuses for "customization" that goes for the point allotment system as well...

Still though it seems like they're setting the job system to be the bulk of endgame content, saving classes for the more mundane content they've displayed so far (collecting seals, making materia, and hunting NM's)

[OMEGA_HACK]

by mundane you really just mean the solo/low-man group stuff (just an honest observation) which to some are not really mundane at all?

Which brings it back to my point all to well, Classes are being designed for low man / solo play while jobs will specialize in full party events. IF that means you only want to do let's say Primal Fights from here until the end of time, then yes, the classes will become obsolete to you, but that is your own choice, not the choice of someone who needs to add the additional DPS, or healing to support him/her-self or a single friend while solo/duo-ing. Because Ill say it just this last time, because Im not here to try and persuade anyone, but Im going to be my class when needed to make a support or "jack of all trades" role, especially since I probably wont be able to heal as a DRG. (yes cure will probably be locked out)

[SwordCoheir]

Eh I read most of the thread, but the majority of what I got from what everyone was trying to say is.

We want versatility, but retain class uniqueness: TBH if they build up off this with the job specific traits that they redid in 1.20 I think it would easily let jobs retain their unique roles and strengths while allowing that same freedom of flexibility from pre-1.20.

and...

Will the new jobs destroy the current classes: I think this one is still too much up in the air, personally I havent seen or heard how they planned on implementing the new jobs. From what I've seen from the pre-listed abilities from a few weeks ago however, they seem to be using a promotion system like what was introduced in FF1 which just grants new abilities and stats, rather than treating the new jobs as an entirely new job to level up. The thing I'm curious about however is will there be the option to still use preexisting abilities from the old jobs that got upgraded that the new job does not have, and if there would be some way to still play both the old and advanced job (Since Yoshi insinuated there would be some differences in the way they play.)

[Malakhim]

Eh I read most of the thread, but the majority of what I got from what everyone was trying to say is.

We want versatility, but retain class uniqueness: TBH if they build up off this with the job specific traits that they redid in 1.20 I think it would easily let jobs retain their unique roles and strengths while allowing that same freedom of flexibility from pre-1.20.

and...

Will the new jobs destroy the current classes: I think this one is still too much up in the air, personally I havent seen or heard how they planned on implementing the new jobs. From what I've seen from the pre-listed abilities from a few weeks ago however, they seem to be using a promotion system like what was introduced in FF1 which just grants new abilities and stats, rather than treating the new jobs as an entirely new job to level up. The thing I'm curious about however is will there be the option to still use preexisting abilities from the old jobs that got upgraded that the new job does not have, and if there would be some way to still play both the old and advanced job (Since Yoshi insinuated there would be some differences in the way they play.)

If you haven't already, you should look up and read Matsui's(Battle Director) original battle blueprint, of course it's just as nebulous as most of this thread and any interview where Yoshida has been asked about the Job system.

The way they've introduced the new abilities in patch 1.20, I'm worried that either jobs are going to be superfluous "class skins", or that classes are going to go the way of the dodo in terms of relevance. I honestly don't know how the two are going to coexist anymore.

[Pyretta_Blaze]

I was surprised that they restricted the class abilities so much. I really thought they would leave classes to be more of a jack-of-all-trades and then jobs would be very restricted and only able to perform a single role.

[NotoriousZow]

I love the changes they have made, and I like the direction they are going. I don't know how people can truely even judge the whole class/job relationship right now when jobs aren't even here yet. I hope they keep the classes around. I like the whole system. =)

[Jynx]

The classes as they are are doomed to either languish in obscurity or flat out be removed from the game. The "Armoury" system is allready giving off it's own death throws.

Class specific skills, bonuses on specific classes, ect.

Personally I hope the jobs do such a good job at defining our roles as players that the class system eventually dissapears and the developers focus on keeping us unique but usefull. Jack of all trades for all jobs ends up with everyone doing the same thing only slighty different way and ends up a boring homogonized mess as we seen at XIV launch.