A tank's concern

[Tillen]

Is this a problem that I am personally at fault with, or were these just some bad healers who don't know how to do their job?.

In the scenarios you have described, then it is bad healers plain and simple. Folks can analyze, "what-if", look for excuses, and blame the META all day. But at the end of the day if someone dies due to gradual loss of HP, then its the healer's fault. Sure folks do dumb things and get themselves killed, but if the tank dies to damage taken then its the healers' fault...plain and simple. Circumstances don't matter, under geared, tank didn't use cooldowns, tank pulled too much, tears tears tears always crying. Healers are equipped to heal under the most austere conditions so blaming the tank is sad...and I main the worst of the three healers!

I main SCH and only wiped on the 67 dungeon on first run cause it was a bitch. WHMs and ESPECIALLY ASTs have NO...ZERO, NOT ONE excuse to wipe a party or let a tank die. If it happens, that's on them. Healers heal, and then DPS second. If they don't know how to rotate between the two, that's on them.

Keep on tanking!.

[Feidam]

In the scenarios you have described, then it is bad healers plain and simple. Folks can analyze, "what-if", look for excuses, and blame the META all day. But at the end of the day if someone dies due to gradual loss of HP, then its the healer's fault. Sure folks do dumb things and get themselves killed, but if the tank dies to damage taken then its the healers' fault...plain and simple. Circumstances don't matter, under geared, tank didn't use cooldowns, tank pulled too much, tears tears tears always crying. Healers are equipped to heal under the most austere conditions so blaming the tank is sad...and I main the worst of the three healers!


Keep on tanking!.

This is crap. A tank who requires ridiculous amounts of healing can wipe a group just as easy as a bad healer. Tanks have cooldowns for a reason. Dps do make mistakes no one is perfect so they need heals sometimes too. Having to babysit a tank for every waking gcd isn't fair to the healer or the group. The healers responsibility is to the entire group not just Mr tank who thinks cooldowns or proper gear is not a thing to worry about. Healers are not the whipping posts of the group.

[Tillen]

This is crap.

No sir. I said based on the scenario that the OP provided and an issue of gradual HP loss, then it is the headers fault. OP asked a specific question and I answered it.

I main healer so I am very well versed in the mistakes of others, falling off platforms, getting the wrong debuff and standing in the wrong puddle, etc. Shit happens. But when a healer flat out decides to DPS more and not heal the tank in time...like the OP asked, then no It's not the tanks fault. I'm on the team to heal, not to DPS. If I can't do that then I'm gone.

By this logic of "oh the tank is under geared so I have to spend my whole time healing" is like the tank saying "oh these deeps are too over geared and not using enmity reductions skills, that's why I can't keep hate" or DPS saying "well that healer needs to meld more Piety, it's not my fault trash pulls take so long, he should have come prepared"
Folks always want to take the easy way out and blame others and never look inward. If healing is a problem, then its on the healer.

[Elamys]

If healing is a problem, then its on the healer.

If I'm spamming heals and CDs and the tank still isn't living because he's not using defensive CDs or he's in terrible gear (as in, gear so terrible it's a mystery how he got into the dungeon) that is 100% the tank's fault.

Friend of mine got a tank that had only 3k HP more than her as an AST. Nothing she did could keep him alive. Is that her fault? No, it isn't.

Admittedly, the above reason is why I'm kiiinda quick to boot DPSing healers, especially when they're letting someone die. As in, one death = auto kick. I've seen enough of such "healers" to know how it's going to work out from that one wipe.

If you're kicking healers like this for what could have honestly been a mistake or a "lesson learned" for them, you aren't the kind of person who should be running duty finder with randoms.

[Uzephi]

If you're kicking healers like this for what could have honestly been a mistake or a "lesson learned" for them, you aren't the kind of person who should be running duty finder with randoms.

This, Absolutely this. I ran Doma castle norm in DF and went into HW mode (dpsing 3 GCDs w/o more than a quick glance on health). explained to the group, they understood and we moved on, no more "accidental" deaths.

[Shurrikhan]

As a PLD, once out of TP, what else is there to do but Req-Clem spam while the AST spams Gravity?

And as a Healer, I've kept low-CD tanks alive in mass pulls with not a single GCD spent on healing during the fight itself.

So... what's the issue?

The only issue I run into as a healer in Stormblood dungeons is when the tank pulls into an area in which multiple raid or mob AoEs may target me at once, forcing movement or interrupts, during a time where my instant casts, Surecast, Swiftcast, and oGCD heals are already burned, and when they lack or neglect CDs of their own. Besides that, what worked at Baelsar's Wall speedruns in HW still works now. Almost identically.

Edit: Except that PLDs can now spend GCDs on AoE and SCHs now... basically can't.

[Feidam]

And as a Healer, I've kept low-CD tanks alive in mass pulls with not a single GCD spent on healing during the fight itself.
.

This just sounds like grandstanding. Maybe you have but from what I've seen I highly doubt it.

[Shurrikhan]

This just sounds like grandstanding. Maybe you have but from what I've seen I highly doubt it.

This was on a WHM. Consider for a moment how much potency there is in the oGCD arsenal. A Largesse Regen (pre-uptime into SC-Holy) is easily enough for the first mass pull in Doma Castle as long as you're using Holy in a way that maximizes stun time (e.g. keeping in mind AA delay), given Bene, Tetra, Asylum, and Assize. So long as DPS is high (it was with my first group and so I kept whoever would stay for the remaining speedruns until 69), they're all dead before the first Cure II - DB is necessary.

[EaMett]

I'm a pretty straightforward healer. Estimate the speed at which HP goes down, then find appropriate time to heal (this can be way bellow 30% depending on situations). If you heal yourself or someone else during that time then that just changes the speed at which hp goes down and delays my healing more.

I also have no issue letting a dps sit for a while with low hp if I know there are no mechanics hitting soon.

Also a tank that pulls a lot and doesn't use his cooldowns... or check party composition.. totally his fault. I can't count the number of times I've had tanks pull those two mecha packs and the dogs all the way to the end in Ala Migho while we get targeted by those ground aoes (healers will know what I'm talking about).
I'm not sure what they expect the outcome to be if they don't use cooldowns. It already takes every last ogcd I have + cure spams to maintain them alive when they're well geared and on cooldowns.

[Furious]

This was on a WHM. Consider for a moment how much potency there is in the oGCD arsenal. A Largesse Regen (pre-uptime into SC-Holy) is easily enough for the first mass pull in Doma Castle as long as you're using Holy in a way that maximizes stun time (e.g. keeping in mind AA delay), given Bene, Tetra, Asylum, and Assize. So long as DPS is high (it was with my first group and so I kept whoever would stay for the remaining speedruns until 69), they're all dead before the first Cure II - DB is necessary.

It's a bit of a misnomer to claim no healing and no cooldowns when you're talking about starting the fight with 7 seconds of all the mobs being stunned. There is no chance in hell that a non-whm is keeping a no-cd tank alive who pulled the first two packs of doma castle with no or limited cooldown usage using only off-gcd abilities.