Problem: Items are Worthless

[Xenor]

NQ market will always be dead while the mats are so easy to obtain.

[Lienn]

True true. Like i said, it was suggested in another topic here. I just quoted the idea here assuming people would want a boost on HQ rate (based on OP). The powder thing is actually very similar to what Raijin said...you're pretty much turning a finished item into something else to boost another item. I'd assume the way you said it like a reforging, right? Multiple synthesis to enhance an already finished weapon.

I must say i saw a system similar to this one at Dragonica, where you could reforge over and over an weapon until you reach the obscene HQ of +20. But if you fail upgrading it you could, from losing partially or completely the HQ effect (becoming NQ again) or, after a certain point, even losing the weapon. I didn't like this much because it was like gambling ALOT of work (specially since dragonica is heavily based on cash shop so the reforge rate was minimal after a while to force people buying stuff to protect the weapon from breaking if it fail).

But if you want me to say a game that excells in anything regarding weapon upgrades, i can suggest the summon night serie (GBA/DS). The reforge synthesis there is awsome, with you having the "blueprint" of weapons only...like you can synthesis a "Bhuj" but the finished bhuj will be based on what you put on synth. An example would be like this...i pick a bhuj recipe and it lists a head, a shaft, a butt, a clasp and a glue. Its up to you to combine the items the way you want, with some generating different weapons (if you use a bronze bhuj head you will have a bronze bhuj, if you use an iron bhuj head you will have an iron bhuj) and others just changing the effects of it (like adding an ash shaft would end i a bhuj with better accuracy while a cedar shaft would end in a bhuj with better attack)...and if you get an HQ you being able to exchange the stars for even further bonuses (like a iron bhuj +2 could be enhaced by exchanginh a star for a reforge with an item that adds +5 STR effect, becoming then a iron bhuj +1 with +5 STR additional effect. You then could exchange again the star for another reforge, lets say i add an item that adds + 5 DEX this time...it would become a iron bhuj with additional +5 STR and +5 DEX effect).

Even further, similar to a tactics game from SE i forgot the name (all the artwork was made by the same artist that do FF artworks), if you follow a certain reforge path you may not reach what you wanted, but a totally different item (like...if it was a +3 iron bhuj instead of a +2 and, after i made an iron bhuj and add + 5 str and +5 dex i did a third reforge adding another +5 STR and it happens to be the correct path for a Conqueror Bhuj, isntead of receiving my Iron bhuj with additional effects i'd receive an conqueror bhuj, which is obviously more powerful than the iron bhuj with the 3 additional effects). But of course that reforges would add no HQ version...or else this would have a chance of keep going forever if the dude is extremely lucky.

But back to summon night...the cool there is that you can even name your weapon after a certain amount of reforges, which woould be very nice here too as soon as renamed item become exclusive.

[Kirith]

I'm not a crafting tycoon like you guys, but i think we should point out the issues and let the developers find a way to fix them, instead of proposing systems.

It's obvious that going by gut feelings you can get to criticize something as fundamental in this game's design as crafting classes being as central as battle classes: you don't have the whole system perfectly laid out on paper like SE does.
So let's just say we want challenging battles like CoP and let SE decide how to make it viable in this system. If enough of us point a problem, it will be addressed eventually.

About CoP, i loved it, but the reason we won't ever get something as good as that was is because lots of people hated to be unable to defeat a capped instanced fight at the very first try like every other quest in the game and preferred to camp a NM that had impossibly long respawns precisely to avoid people camping it, or to farm gobbues all day long.
Difficult fights? Party strategy? Beautiful scenario? One of the best stories ever seen in a Final Fantasy game? Too much of a hassle.

[sWhiteboy]

In a competitive market, the seller does not set the price. That's what OP wants to do.

Here's a basic outline of what happens in an open market: A producer recognizes a product that can be sold for a profit, then they produce it; other producers recognize that there is profit to be made, then they also produce said product; the market is now flooded, causing the price to tank; the producers stop producing and prices normalize.

I suggest that the OP sell their stock and move to an unsaturated product.

[Raijin]

In a competitive market, the seller does not set the price. That's what OP wants to do.

Here's a basic outline of what happens in an open market: A producer recognizes a product that can be sold for a profit, then they produce it; other producers recognize that there is profit to be made, then they also produce said product; the market is now flooded, causing the price to tank; the producers stop producing and prices normalize.

I suggest that the OP sell their stock and move to an unsaturated product.

that is correct, however in an economy things are perishable, decaying, outdated. This is not occurring in this economy and all items that are being made arent taken out of the market, so preety much every item that can be flooded to hell i already with a very limited profit margin or negative profit margin.

[JakeRoon]

that is correct, however in an economy things are perishable, decaying, outdated. This is not occurring in this economy and all items that are being made arent taken out of the market, so preety much every item that can be flooded to hell i already with a very limited profit margin or negative profit margin.

Both of these are solid and valid points, other games have solved this problem.

While some of the item do in fact perish when a player quits or decides to NPC an item (which the OP could simply buy all the NQ and NPC them if she was so inclined to "fix" the market)....but this is rare.

Other games solution is to make some weapons/armor "customized" once equipped , or for WoW players "binds on equip"; meaning once the item is used by a player it cannot be sold. I know a lot of you may think that's kinda harsh for the buyer, but it's really not that bad because prices are much more stable. IE: only those who NEED the item buy it usually. Once the item is no longer useful it can be sold to an NPC (taken out of the system) for a FAIR price (not a total slap in the face) allowing players to recoop about 50% of what they should have paid for the item; which in turn allows them to purchase a newer weapon/armor from the crafter. It's a fair, and useful system; that makes sense. (How can a Roegedyn, buy, re-use, and wear the same acton that was customized and worn by a Lalafell?)

Again, as with most of my posts I'll mention.....this isn't rocket science....these methods to combat the problems the OPer and other see have been around for a decade already. SE just didn't bother to do their homework.

EDIT:
I'll also add in that the only way to have a stable market is to make most every item/weapon/armor available at NPC's for 5 times the crafting costs (or a fair price for base mats) thus making the player sellers unable to over inflate the price of that item, yet keeping the crafting profitable when the crafter sells the item under the NPC price. In turn players prefer to buy from crafters because they should get a steep discount on the item by doing so.

If a player base attempts to over-inflate the price of a base martial, rather than allowing the trickle down exponentially inflate prices of crafted items; the crafters simply go purchase the item from the NPC until the player base realizes no is gonna buy that item at such a ridiculous price.

Again, this isn't a new idea, or speculation, or one that "may or may not" work....it's a system that has been in place in many MMO's with success for quite a few years.

[Sephr]

Personally, I can totally agree with what's been said a lot here, the lack of perishables and easy introducing new items is only going to degrade the market as we go on.

However, I think there's got to be a better solution that the absurdity of merging 512 bows (which not only makes no sense, but is also an incredibly dull grind). I'm not one to propose some radical new system, especially as I really don't feel like donating the time to it as you so generously have. However, I'm confident there's a better way of doing it.

It just feels like a system suggestion that's made by someone tailoring it to themselves and the situation they're in personally, is the main impression I get.

EDIT: I also don't agree with a bind-on-equip system being added personally, WoW's economy might work relatively well, but the crafting system is an awful example of MMO success being as it becomes near-redundant after the first 3ish months of the game, as everyone who has the items crafted already does and cannot pass them on. There's no circulation outside of the 'service' crafts such as enchanting where new items are constantly requiring new upgrades.

The suggestion of making gear available from NPCs seems good for lower levels perhaps, a decent way of removing some gil from the economy (5x is a bit steep) whilst pushing people to buy from players (although is that likely to change anything? Most people use the wards to buy everything anyway).
Given the state of gil at the moment, it might not actually be that hard to generate enough to be 5x the crafted value of an item, so introducing later items to NPCs might undervalue them in the long-run

[Griss]

I think they did take a stab at removing items from circulation, in both the way some items get upgraded and the fact that items that are not in "Mint" condition can not be sold.

But here we are facing over saturation and this gets compounded every time any one throws up there hands and says "F it i'm out". How ever i do not think that adding a super hq teir is the way to go about this. Again its another market that will suffer the same exact fate. while it might help in the short term in the long run its just not sustainable in fact it could very well have very negative ramifications on the market as a whole.

Like others said the solution to this problem is to take items out of circulation with out starting the whole mess over again. Now what if instead of taking 8 items out of circulation to create one, you took the 8 items out and were rewarded for doing so by gaining guild marks or faction credits, anima, guardian's favor, or a whole host of other things. Yes i realise that is not a perfect solution either.

[Solipse]

As I stated in an earlier post:

I'm not saying my idea is foolproof (it's not). But it does address the main issues:

Low quality gear and mats need to leave the economy.
Combat/Gatherers need a constant income stream.
Let people make progress and not have to play roulette to get ahead.

These are the 3 main problems in the system. I've highlighted them a few times - my suggestion was just a stab at an idea to fix those problems, there are plenty of others. The solution that is needed is one that addresses all of those 3, not just one or two of them.

[Chory]

There is really only one problem with crafting. We have a lot of materials and we need long long hours of spamming one synthesis to skill up crafting. The results are:

1. Garbage in inventory (every single mob drops like 3-4 different items + HQ versions, and they drop A LOT + rewards from leves).
2. Drops from monsters/gathering are worthless since theyre very common.
3. Crafters use A LOT of materials (spending BORING in game hours) crafting A LOT of items.
4. A LOT of crafted items means they are worthless items.

If, there was no item rewards from leves, drops from monsters/gathering were quite rare, and DoH SP/rank was much much lower, it would result in:

1. No such a garbage in inventory/retainers.
2. Rare drops means more valuable drops.
3. Crafters use much much less materials during skillup, spending much less time mashing STANDARD SYNTHESIS, and make much less items.
4. Less items = more valuable crafted items (even NQ).

Crafters still wouldnt rank up fast, because there woudnt be enough materials to skillup fast. And with demand much higher than supply, materials would be worth farming.

Currently in FFXIV one Goldsmith skilling on silver needles would make like 2 needles per every person on the server and still he would be getting decent skillups on that synthesis. This is crazy. How do you expect crafted items to be valuable?