Problem: Items are Worthless

[Kimahri]

To the OP: That's a hell of a lot of NQ crab bows to make an end product of a +3. You're talking about 8 to the power of 4. That's 4096 crab bows to end up with a +3 at the minimal success level. I would much rather be in favor of a desynth option to get back a certain material(s).

[Solipse]

To the OP: That's a hell of a lot of NQ crab bows to make an end product of a +3. You're talking about 8 to the power of 4. That's 4096 crab bows to end up with a +3 at the minimal success level. I would much rather be in favor of a desynth option to get back a certain material(s).

Yeah, it's ridiculous, but it was supposed to be.

As I commented before, though, this wouldn't be meant as a way to reliably get a +3 item. Rather, it would be solely used as a way to empty the market of bottom tier items.

In effect, it's price control. The second any NQ item price falls below that control price (let's say, +1 item price/10), you buy 8 and synth a +1. Same with +1 items and +2, or +2 and +3. That's all that it's meant to address.

[Kiote]

As an aspiring Alchemist I would like to note that while status effect potions are incredibly effective, most healing and status up potions are useless. This is because you can only use one then you have to wait a ridiculous amount of time. I don't necessarily think we need to be able to spam potions to keep us alive but there is no need for a 1 minute recast timer. Also if i have enough potions to buff an entire party i should be able to do so without hesitation.

[Solipse]

As an aspiring Alchemist I would like to note that while status effect potions are incredibly effective, most healing and status up potions are useless. This is because you can only use one then you have to wait a ridiculous amount of time. I don't necessarily think we need to be able to spam potions to keep us alive but there is no need for a 1 minute recast timer. Also if i have enough potions to buff an entire party i should be able to do so without hesitation.

While that's very true (I am a 50 alchemist) - this was more about equipment. I should have probably said so in the title.

[Lienn]

Hmmm...nah, not a good idea IMO. I agree with the dude at first page who said making even higher tier weapons would make NQ ones even more worthless.

For me even the +2 and +3 are already bad enough...i'd rather you having NQ and HQ versions only and not multiples HQ tiers.

Anyway, i believe that, since the market do is saturated of some items, SE should, instead of making uber ninja ways of making e-peen, just add an option where you can exchange items at the guild for guild marks. this would be a simple way to lessen the amount of certain items at market, protecting their value.

[TirionCrey]

I don't give a shit if Items are worthless or not, the way bigger problem right now is, that Items don't matter. It doesn't matter if its NQ, +1 or +3. The difference is so minimal, that it makes no difference worth going for. The thing what SE needs to fix first before anything is STATS and Attributes.

Plus....I don't know where you get your numbers....but there is NOT ONE Item in the game that sells for less, than what you pay to craft it. There is hardly any Item in the game that costs more than a few thousand to make. Even the crappiest BS sells for 10k...and to me it's hard to synth anything that costs more than 10k. I don't know how self sufficient you are...but I can literally craft any piece of gear I could craft with almost none or none expenses at all, cause I either have the mats lieing around, or getting the mats(crafting/farming them) takes only a few minutes.

Of course if you're not self sufficient at all...and have to buy every crappy piece of material from the wards...stuff will cost a bit to make them...but seriously, why the hell would anybody feel the need to buy materials from the wards unless your not crafting at all and are dependant of the materials at the wards?

Equips' worth doesn't need to be fixed, the stats and therefore the efficiency of Equip needs to be fixed, the worth of items will rise by itself if that happenned.

The other thing is...how the hell will making progress easier add anything to the economy? In fact it needs to be hardened...Crafts only matter(items will be worth something), if either crafting those items is hard, or getting there is, but right now both is way too easy. It would actually help the economy a lot more, if people who achieve the Max Rank in a craft are the exception, not the rule and as it is right now, it is the rule, cause anybody can achieve the Max Rank in crafting classes given the time. People with 100+3 in XI were the exception. First cause it was hard to gather the materials to actually "grind" crafts, or the materials became so ridiculously rare that it took forever for those last few skill ups. In XIV all it takes right now is to log on every 36h and do 8 local leves. It may take quite a long time...but still...there is NO personal effort involved at all and this is just wrong. That's like handing Battle Classes a few k SP every reset while doing nothing.

The only other way to make Items worth something, is to add some kind of ingredient into any worthwhile Equipment synth, that is sort of rare(Damascene Cloth, Damascus Ingot as in XI etc)

Fact is...if the system stays the way it is...it will end up like WoW where crafts are nothing "special" with the only exception, that people will actually wear the crafted gear, while in WoW 90% of them are just useless junk.

[Naylia]

It may take quite a long time...but still...there is NO personal effort involved at all and this is just wrong. That's like handing Battle Classes a few k SP every reset while doing nothing.

I get more SP running Dunes once a reset then from all 8 crafting leves combined...

I could probably get more SP standing around in a Behest for 15 minutes doing nothing than I get from 8 all local leves and that's every hour. I wouldn't exactly say that crafters are getting loads of free SP.

And I'm just curious, but once you hit 45...how many good local leves did you get per reset?

[TirionCrey]

I get more SP running Dunes once a reset then from all 8 crafting leves combined...

I could probably get more SP standing around in a Behest for 15 minutes doing nothing than I get from 8 all local leves and that's every hour. I wouldn't exactly say that crafters are getting loads of free SP.

And I'm just curious, but once you hit 45...how many good local leves did you get per reset?

I guess you failed to see my point here. It's not about the fact that its free SP they get, it's the fact that craftings can be taken to Max Rank, with local leves only(mats and shards not needed), no matter how long it takes, its an undeniable result of doing them, while Battle Classes aren't as "comfortable". Thus makes crafting classes not as "special" as they were back in FFXI, which results in the market being flooded with equip and not enough demand to actually have use for it, which results in items being worthless, cause people just want to get rid of them, no matter how low the price.

First, crafts need to be taken out of the "Fully fledges class" BS...they are not...they craft...they don't get involved in endgame(except for turning drops into equip) and they never will, so why not let them be what they are? Crafting classes.

Second, either make the synthesis of items harder, or make grinding the crafts harder, so they are actually worth doing.

Third, fix the damn stats and attributes so people actually care about HQs and shit.

[origamikitsune]

Whether you like it or not (and it is a perfectly valid opinion) crafters ARE classes. It is a fundamental design of the game, and one the (few) things that is unique and not so game breaking it requires a complete rework. IMO, if SE is smart, they will keep it that way. That said, they definitely need to make adjustments to crafting to balance it and expand on the ways that crafters get SP - net necessarily increase or decrease it, but give them the variety that DoM/DoW has (behest, leves, grind, NMs, etc.) and then balance from there.

[TirionCrey]

Whether you like it or not (and it is a perfectly valid opinion) crafters ARE classes. It is a fundamental design of the game, and one the (few) things that is unique and not so game breaking it requires a complete rework. IMO, if SE is smart, they will keep it that way. That said, they definitely need to make adjustments to crafting to balance it and expand on the ways that crafters get SP - net necessarily increase or decrease it, but give them the variety that DoM/DoW has (behest, leves, grind, NMs, etc.) and then balance from there.

The biggest flaw of that "fundamental" system, where crafting classes are supposed to be classes just as the Battle ones is...there will never EVER be anything like CoP again, ever. Crafting classes are supposed to be able to get all "Story Quests" done, just like Battle Classes...which makes challenging battles like in CoP completely impossible.

The fact that so many people liked CoP and still think it was the best storyline in FFXI so far(and prolly will be forever) was not only the storyline itself being really good, but it was the whole "effort" it took to actually experience it.

Something like this will never be in FFXIV ever, when crafting classes stay the way they are.
I do craft myself...I do it a lot actually...but crafting classes being part of "Main Classes" is just limiting the content they could implement for Battle Classes and wether you like it or not...the majority of the players still play Battle Classes over Crafting Classes.

The ONLY option right now to get something like CoP in the game and let crafting classes stay the way they are would be, to implement 2 different Storylines for Battle and Crafting Classes. Battle Classes should experience the Storyline from a more battle involved perspective, while crafting classes could experience the Storyline from a more "supportive" perspective, for example there is a big battle going on between the Garlean Empire and the leftover nomads from Ala Mihgo. Battle Classes could be directly participating in that battle, while crafting classes experience it from the "defense" line and craft stuff for the nomads battling on the field or anything like that. Make the Storylines reward different things to match the Class you're playing it with(just like the CoP Rings for each class, just make it crafting/battle/mage rings for example)

The only reason I want to see crafting classes being treated as what they are, is the fact that it would ruin the possibilities for the storyline when it comes to challenging fights.

PS: Do you actually play FFXIV? Cause there is no character shown on the Lodestone on either Sanctus Refero, or Origami Kitsune...