The Current State of Dragoon

[MordynE]

Drgaon Sight FIX: Drgaon Sight raises the DRG DPS by 10% and raises all party members by 5% within a 15 yalm radius.

Haven't done much thinking on Dragon Sight as I've been more focused on LOTD and how it functions, but this would be a much welcomed change in my book. Maybe a bit too powerful though? Either way if it is it would be simple to balance, would just have to adjust the numbers a bit.

LOTD requires only 3 eyes. This will allow for you to enter LOTD very quickly at the start and much more often throughout the fight.

I think this is a good suggestion and would go a long ways into solving LOTD's problems, but I think they'll be disinclined to go with this approach unfortunately with the 4 eyes being symbolic of the whole 4 original dragons thingy with the lore.

Dragonfire Dive will be acknowledged as a Jump and be influenced by BOTD and proc Dive ready for every add it hits.

I originally thought this would be a bad solution due to how congested our opener would become with having to weave Mirage Dive's in and out after every jump. Would be difficult to fit in Life Surge -> Full Thrust for the initial part of our rotation . However, if we could stack Dive Ready's as you've suggested, this wouldn't be as much of an issue and we could simply hold the majority of the Mirage Dive's until after the first Life Surge -> Full Thrust. Good suggestion. Optimally I think this is probably the most realistic and beneficial change the team could make.

That being said, my suggestions are for if they decide for whatever reason they would not wish to have Dive Ready as a stackable buff:

1. The ability to stack up to 2 Eyes of the Brood if BotD is dropped.
The benefits of this are pretty obvious. It would simply make phase transitions a bit less punishing for us and dropping BotD wouldn't be such of a pain. Not a fan of this suggestion though. It wouldn't really solve the issue of LotD just simply feeling underwhelming and infrequent, and it would more than likely be a bit more of a pain to code into the game. There's some other pretty obvious drawbacks as well such as fights like A1s, A5s, and A9s that have mini bosses where you can stack eyes before the actual raid fight.

2. Lowering the CD of Spineshatter Dive to around 40-45 seconds or so.
I can see this being a change the team could make. It's a rather straight forward approach that wouldn't be difficult to add to the game, would allow us to enter LotD more often and would bring up our numbers a bit since we seem to be on the tail end of most jobs atm. Our opener wouldn't change much but CD alignment might be kinda iffy. That's one of the problems I see with this.

Overall, I'm a big fan of the stackable Dive Ready's and Dragonfire dive proc. So far that seems to be the best suggestion that I've seen.

[Vincent_Mateus]

Haven't done much thinking on Dragon Sight as I've been more focused on LOTD and how it functions, but this would be a much welcomed change in my book. Maybe a bit too powerful though? Not sure.



I think this is a good suggestion and would go a long ways into solving LOTD's problems, but I think they'll be disinclined to go with this approach unfortuntely with the 4 eyes being symbolic of the whole 4 original dragons thingy with the lore.




in progress**

I agree the number of eyes can't change. Per the lore the 4 remaining dragons are Vrtra, Azdaja, Hraevalgr, and Tiamat. This can't be reduced unless one of them dies

[MordynE]

I agree the number of eyes can't change. Per the lore the 4 remaining dragons are Vrtra, Azdaja, Hraevalgr, and Tiamat. This can't be reduced unless one of them dies

I personally don't really care if the lore matches the abilities and whatnot, but yea I'm sure the dev team will be more strict on that unfortunately.

[Shurrikhan]

I agree the number of eyes can't change. Per the lore the 4 remaining dragons are Vrtra, Azdaja, Hraevalgr, and Tiamat. This can't be reduced unless one of them dies

Couldn't the BotD or LotD itself be considered as the "Gaze of the <First/Fourth> Brood"?

That said, the gameplay differences between LotD per 3 Eyes and LotD per 4 and Dive Ready on DFD come down simply to whether or not you want greater frequency or greater dynamics, assuming output is balanced accordingly. With the latter, you get the same speed of first entry (2nd Jump at 30s), but a much more varied interval thereafter, whereas LotD per 3 Eyes would be entered every 60 seconds on the dot after the first at 30s.

[Eyvhokan]

I agree the number of eyes can't change. Per the lore the 4 remaining dragons are Vrtra, Azdaja, Hraevalgr, and Tiamat. This can't be reduced unless one of them dies

But which should we kill first?

[Sparhwk]

I hate Dragon Sight. It's stupid when you look at MNK's Brotherhood or RDM EMbolden, both having a 15y effect vs DS being 6y. For a class that needs to bounce, weave and jump around having a tether ability is beyond retarded.

My idea, turn Dragon sight into a trait. Lowers Battle Litany CD to 160 sec and gives 5% damage to everyone. This let's it line up with every other BFB and lets our main raid utility be used more often. Increase the crit/damage if needed if it's under preforming.

LotD ideas:
1) Make Dive ready into a stack you consume. So Jump generates 1 stack, Spineshatter generates 2. This makes spine actually equal to jump since 30s vs 60s cd. Helsp if you SSD during LotD meaning you get back in faster
2)Massively buff the potency of Gerk and Nastrod. If it's going to takes us 80-90s to get into LotD then it should hit like truck powered by a jet engine. Make Gerk like 400 and Nastrod 700+ Values can be tweaked but since pvp skills are now seperate we can make the big burst phase real burst in pve.
3)Let us stay in LotD long as we follow the rotation. So Wheeling and F&C both extend LotD like they do BotD. Give Mirage Dive a potency boost while in LotD. Still has the same horrible problems of falling off during big phase changes (primal ultimates) but it shoudl feel more like a high power mode we maintain then rather then barely any burst.

[SpeckledBurd]

Dragoon didn't really lose Power Surge, the total damage was just Folded into Jump so you don't have to hit 3 buttons to attack twice every minute, and Spineshatter was just buffed in general. You're also ignoring the flat potency buffs to most of the Combo actions overall. But overall I do agree that LOTD needs some tweaking so you don't get completely screwed by phase transitions. I imagine Dragon Eyes not being lost with BOTD would go a long way toward fixing this.

[Sepher]

Dragoon didn't really lose Power Surge, the total damage was just Folded into Jump so you don't have to hit 3 buttons to attack twice every minute, and Spineshatter was just buffed in general. You're also ignoring the flat potency buffs to most of the Combo actions overall.

I'm not ignoring the potency buffs they are just insufficient. They are in place to make up for the Disembowel nerf which was a flat 5% nerf to all DRG moves as well as utility. Losing Leg sweep is a 130 potency attack every 20 seconds and it shouldn't have been removed since both MNK and NIN did not lose their equivalent moves. They only lost the stun/silence effect. With Power Surge taken away the potency loss from these are not made up with the increased potentiates.

[IchiExorz]

I posted a suggestion in the other DRG trait but i'll repost it here because its more relevant here.

-Reduce the amount of eyes needed to activate LoTD by 1 so we only need 3 eyes. making downtime bit less of a problem.
-Reduce cooldown of our Jump & SSD by 50% while in LoTD
-Change nastrond into a single target nuke (500-800potency) that ends LoTD & puts us back into BoTD.

This would make LoTD about building up eyes asap to then build eyes up faster while LoTD is active with decreased cooldown of our jumps. Then finish LoTD with Nastrond.

The point of LoTD would be to be able to use Nastrond as frequent as possible. (30-45 sec)

We would lose potency of Nastrond during 1 LoTD duration but we would gain more Jumps, Mirage Dives & a much more frequent LoTD.
Geirskogul should be used whenever our LoTD goes down.

Numbers on cooldown reduction & general potencies will need tweaking for balance purposes.

Once again, I doubt SE will do anything too crazy. This is just an idea.

[Pentt]

I don't know about any sweeping changes to how LoTD/eyes work but Nastrond needs to be brought up in potency. I think everyone can agree it's underwhelming for the amount of time you have to ramp.