Incentives to NOT queue as DPS

[Drakkaelus]

If you really don't like tanking or healing then being forced into it turns what was once a pleasant hobby into a burdensome chore. Punishing people for not doing their "chores" in a game doesn't make sense when they are still willing to show up to group activities and do their chosen roll well, finish the storylines, do the quests, farm their thingy-mabobs, tough out the grinds, etc.

It's not like they are lazy or self indulgent because they chose DPS, "lazy" is a personality issue not a playstyle, and so punishing or shafting DPS as if they having been holding back or something is illogical.

You aren't being punished for it though. Any more than you're being punished for driving on a busy street during rush hour or going to a popular store on Black Friday.

If everyone wants to spamfuck the same thing at the same thing, there's going to be a line. There's no magical way around it.

[Themarvin]

The hype will eventually stop as it is and go back to normal 5-10min queue time for DPS...

[Derio]

If I got an xp token for my dps every time I ran content as a tank, I would run all content as a tank all the time

[KisaiTenshi]

If I got an xp token for my dps every time I ran content as a tank, I would run all content as a tank all the time

This illustrates the problem. You encourage bad tanks rather than good tanks to take advantage of EXP gaming.

What SE needs to do is a way to "sink" the DPS queues by having more things that DPS can do that doesn't require the healer and tank. But these things should not be EXP games. PotD has proven that if you make something easier than the main content, then people will not do the content, thus creating the long queues.

If PotD could only be entered by DPS roles, -THAT- would have fixed it. PotD should have stopped giving out EXP at level 60 and only give out tomes for completing floor 100.

[Mapleine]

Classic MMO problem that has needed squashing for ages: People should not have to play something they do not want to just to get by. I've mained a healer since WoW: The Burning Crusade in MMOs but I still entirely sympathize with people being asked to wait upwards of an hour just to play one darn dungeon.

If someone is outright forced to play a healer or a tank, despite having no interest in such, it is objectively poor game design. That and the 30++ hotkey design are two of the largest heels in the genre.

The main thing that has always boggled my mind is while tanks are exceedingly unpopular in these games, to the point where designers have marginalized them to a barely existent presence, they refuse to just pull the plug. Designers seemingly insist on the bottleneck despite the fact that a tank, nowadays, is also barely a tank anymore. They have become little more than clunky DPS with threat baked in.

[Drakkaelus]

Classic MMO problem that has needed squashing for ages: People should not have to play something they do not want to just to get by. I've mained a healer since WoW: The Burning Crusade in MMOs but I still entirely sympathize with people being asked to wait upwards of an hour just to play one darn dungeon.

The main thing that has always boggled my mind is while tanks are exceedingly unpopular in these games, to the point where designers have marginalized them to a barely existent presence, they refuse to just pull the plug. Designers seemingly insist on the bottleneck despite the fact that a tank, nowadays, is also barely a tank anymore. They have become little more than clunky DPS with threat baked in.

Nobody's forced to do anything though. I do find it funny that you say, "People should not have to play something they do not want to just to get by" and in the same breath, suggest the complete elimination of a playstyle (which actually would force people to play something they don't want).

Even though the tank and healer numbers aren't drastically different, I couldn't help but notice that you didn't suggest the removal of your role. Funny how that works.

I always wonder why the DPSzergfest dungeons in Guild Wars 2 weren't better received. Because people swear that's what they want.

[Fluffernuff]

I think a pretty good incentive is NOT being ordered around and being treated like trash? Maybe? Just me? ok.


seriously. don't treat the tanks you get like dirt and don't order them around when they don't meet your standard of a speed run 2 weeks into the launch of an expansion. I know 4 tank mains alone in my tiny server swearing it off because Duty Finder has been getting so toxic lately. I can only imagine how bad it must be on the larger servers.

[Laerune]

This is sadly one of the factors on why alot of tanks do not:

1. Tank dungeons with strangers.
2. Quit the role before trying it at endgame.

The first time I leveled a a tank class, I was having issues with keeping agro, the dps started pulling mobs left and right and when something went wrong, I got blamed for it. I was used to these type of situations and developed a thick skin, but not everyone will be oke with it. I did some Mentor roulette and the newcomer tanks were pushed to pull more, pull less, go right, go left etc. They were treating the tanks like an animal. Worst was when something did go wrong and most of the time this was not the tanks fault, they still blamed the tanks. When it comes to tanking, the gameplay is not hard, I find it easier then dpsing. What makes tanking and healer harder is their fellow players.

Fact is unless you are doing Savage or Extreme content, as a DPS you can hide your mistakes or share the burden with a fellow DPS, this is alot harder when it comes to healers and tanks. Unless you are paying attention to the dps or using some tool, its going to be alot harder to find out what the dps did wrong, compared to when a tank or healer is failing.

On-topic.

The problem that we are facing is, there is less tanks and healers then dps players. Now we need to think on to encourage players to play those roles, while understanding that nobody wants to be forced to play something that they dont like. Which is why I think giving them an incentive to tank/heal more is the right path. DPS players have shared on this thread that giving tanks and healers bonus stuff is not fair. My question to those players is: what do you suggest then?

- We can not force DPS players to play tank and healer roles.
- We can not force tanks and healers to queue more everyday
- I doubt the developers will remove the holy trinity from the game. Guild Wars 2 tried this and we know how it ended.
- Yet every (dps) player wants short queue time.

Even if SE were to increase the group size from 4 to 5 or 7, DPS would still outnumber the other two roles. I personaly, do not see how SE could fix this, without removing the other roles.

[HyperSMB]

- We can not force DPS players to play tank and healer roles. Sadly true. Way to many people think they shouldn't have to do something, it should be someone elses problem.
- We can not force tanks and healers to queue more everyday Nope. I sure as hell won't be ordered to que more to make up for DPS zealotry.
- I doubt the developers will remove the holy trinity from the game. Guild Wars 2 tried this and we know how it ended. The holy trinity is built into the core of this game. In order to break it you need to make the difficulty such a joke.
- Yet every (dps) player wants short queue time. Which they aren't going to get.

Even if SE were to increase the group size from 4 to 5 or 7 I and many healers and tanks would quit. Babysitting 2-4 (In an 8 man I have another healer to help me) tunnelvisioning DPS is enough. If I had to do more I would just straight up quit.

Bolded my additions

[YitharV2]

-snip-

To be fair, bad tanks make me very sad. I did expert roulette earlier and got a PLD that thought 1 Flash was enough to consolidate aggro. No, 1 Flash isn't enough. I don't remember the last time I actually needed to switch targets. And I was doing my AoE rotation, which requires me to do single target first to use Rockbreaker. >_>

But I do agree with the double standard sucking. It's just the way the game is sadly, because no official parsers. DPS can't be held accountable but tanks and healers can be.

For me personally, tanking in this game is boring as crap, plus you are at the mercy of your healer not being bad. And heal carrying baddies isn't my idea of fun. So I don't solo queue on tank/healer. Even with the mount and gil incentives, I probably wouldn't queue up. Maybe for the tomestones, but probably not.