SMN...and SCH broken

[Iromi]

SMN seems fine to me. Sure it could use some tweaks but I don't mind it. The rotation at 70 is really fun. I can get up to 6k dps lol

Just read the tool tips...really its not that hard :x

[Fyce]

The skill floor and ceiling of SMN was raised -a lot-.
By having the same average awareness and CPM, I do a lot worse than before. I don't think I can concentrate on the job while raid leading anymore.

I'm clearly not a top SMN by any means, but I know how to recognize that my job is now more demanding. Yes, it can pull good numbers. But you have to be up for it.
Basically, if you s*ck, SMN s*ck. If you're good, SMN is good. This is probably the only job in the game with such a skill variance. Compared to RDM, they are like day and night.

SE took the concept of "multiple sources of damage" and raised it to a whole new level. SMN is an extremely busy job.

Oh and, Demi-Bahamut is a real pain for both the SMN and teammates because of how much screenspace it has. Especially the wings. I often need to position myself in such a way that I won't disturb people with my giant dragon. I made more than one player fail a mechanic because of them not seeing a marker or something. Buuuuut that kind of off topic. Personal rant. Sorry.


SCH, on the other hand... Well, it's quite sub-par compared to the other healers. I can see SCH being in a party for speedkills, but that's pretty much about it. WHM is king in casual content and definitly strong in raid (don't get me wrong, the lily sytem is still sh*t, but it doesn't prevent the WHM from being really good), and AST is still AST, and even better than before.

[Gallus]

While relatively complex, SMN is still playable and very fun. DRG on the other hand...

[Neela]

The bad thing about summoner is missing 1 aetherflow and you're screwed. 1 Tri disaster + early fester means you're down on your luck for a good minute and sets everything back by a minute. This happens even to the best players.

Thats true but no argument for a skillchange-request. There are several ways to avoid it you can use a macro which times your first fester (bad idea though), you can take ruin ll as a filler between tri and the first fester, or even rudas con as filler between tri and fester – if you can't get the timing right by yourself its not automatically a "whole community problem" nor bad skill design .___.

The skill floor and ceiling of SMN was raised -a lot-.

I'm clearly not a top SMN by any means, but I know how to recognize that my job is now more demanding. Yes, it can pull good numbers. But you have to be up for it. Basically, if you s*ck, SMN s*ck. If you're good, SMN is good. This is probably the only job in the game with such a skill variance. Compared to RDM, they are like day and night.

SE took the concept of "multiple sources of damage" and raised it to a whole new level. SMN is an extremely busy job.

absofuckingloudly right! :3

its weird to ready that so many player say smn now is clunky as hell... cause actually they aren't – you just have to put more effort into it to find a new flow. you wanna a "op" output? than you also have to play "op". easy like that. Dps on smn isnt a gift on a silver plate anymore - you actually have to work for it now - and that is great. CecMiller is absolutly right about this manner:

The fun (and imo) the good thing about summoner is catering your rotation to every fight. There is always something you can improve in each and every fight.

I personally like that so many left this job atm – being a good Smn actually means something again.

[MStowastiqVahlshdeh]

I'm not concerned about fixing the current max dps other than it is greatly effected by my inability to do things while I am busy re-summoning my dead pet.

1. Give us back Sustain

2. Fix their health regeneration because its broken slow. Make pets not paper thin skinned as they currently are or give some form of better hp regen.

3. Shorter leash or /Closefollow
If you can't do the above, make pets run with and underneath their summoner and not at a distance which makes avoiding aoe's pointless because the pet will get hit, and die because his health just sits there and does not regen. I also have to spend a lot of time heeling him to my side just to get him that tiny bit of space closer to me. A close follow ability would be nice.

4. Put pets on the party list
If you cannot do any of the above at least put pets on the party list so healers can focus them without being bothered by trying to search for them in the party.

5. Give us a useful healing ability for pet other than Physick- See #1 and 2.
If you cannot do any of the above, give us a better mnd rating so we can heal them ourselves.

I don't have issues with encouraging teamwork, if that's what SE is trying to do here.. but if the pet is part of the party it should be on the party list. As it stands I need to ask healers to regen/heal my pet so that I don't have to constantly resummon him when I should be dpsing and avoiding aoes. Spending my time worrying about my pet is what preoccupies me now and I don't think it was intended.

[Neela]

word.

I guess #4 would be my personal favorite hmm...

[Nerisu]

its weird to ready that so many player say smn now is clunky as hell... cause actually they aren't – you just have to put more effort into it to find a new flow. you wanna a "op" output? than you also have to play "op". easy like that. Dps on smn isnt a gift on a silver plate anymore - you actually have to work for it now - and that is great. CecMiller is absolutly right about this manner

Which is ironic because, if I remember correctly, the devs' goal for 4.0 was to make rotations more streamlined and "easier". On the current SMN, one wrong move and your DPS dreams all goes down the drain.

[Neela]

in general its a shame that they made a lot of things way easier than we were used to not just rotations... I'm working in marketing as well and can't understand why their intention goes "pro new player con veterans"... - new player tend to leave after a trial phase or some month later... the veterans on the other hand are the base who pay their bills in a long term... well after all its not on me to judge this mindset : /

[Xiozen]

Because most people just took a quick look at raw potecy. They are not aware of how often r4 procs, how much dmg Bahamuts shockwave adds, how much the aetherskill cd reduce adds and how often you can refresh your dots without hardcasts. -> it seems most of the complainers haven't tried the cls on 70 themselves. That's why ^^

This! and to add to it... the fact that Ruin 4 reduces enkindle coodown by 10s per cast... and R4 procs OFTEN, your talkin' multiple casts of the enkindle ability more so than ever before... So those claiming the job is nerfed, PAHLEZ!. Me and my carby gon' keep on stompin. Wut!

[Jonnycbad]

Bane is fine for SMN because Shockwave and Ahk Morn are OP. I hope they split SMN and SCH soon. Let SMN keep DoTs and Ruin as it fits their style.

SCH's Ruin line should be replaced with that new unsuspected magic spell that the snake beastmen cast (Spark). Then have Spark upgrade to Broil. Then at 50, instead of Shadow Flare (now SMN only), we get an AoE Broil called "Meltdown" like SCHs Tabula Rasa spell in XI. AOE 200 potency with diminishing damage on additional mobs, additional effect Blind.