I quit

[NewSinz]

I dont get it. All of the tanks in my Free Company have not complained at all about the changes. I have healed for EVERY single one of them and I have had 0 issues keeping them alive. Paladin easier to keep up? Sure. But its not that big of a difference. The only thing I see people crying about on the forums is "Oh noes my dps is not high enough anymore!" Sorry. You're a tank. Question yourself: "Am I holding aggro? Yes? Ok im performing my duty. Am I not holding aggro? Yes? Then I should look a little more into what I am doing wrong."

[YitharV2]

I dont get it. All of the tanks in my Free Company have not complained at all about the changes. I have healed for EVERY single one of them and I have had 0 issues keeping them alive. Paladin easier to keep up? Sure. But its not that big of a difference. The only thing I see people crying about on the forums is "Oh noes my dps is not high enough anymore!" Sorry. You're a tank. Question yourself: "Am I holding aggro? Yes? Ok im performing my duty. Am I not holding aggro? Yes? Then I should look a little more into what I am doing wrong."

Assuming good cooldown usage, not much has changed in terms of tank survivability (besides stuff hitting harder), so I'm not sure what you're saying about having issues to keep them alive?

I really wish people would stop saying that. Yes, the DPS has been lowered. But guess what? Tanks can still do an upward of 2.5k DPS or so. I've never even hit that high on a tank, so why would I be complaining about DPS parses? Take a look at this if you're actually interested in why we're upset.

If nothing changes, aggro (specifically on trash) will become harder to hold in the future (note that neither WAR nor PLD got enmity buffs on their AoE skills), because DPS are getting damage from both their main stat and substats. Now DPS do have CDs to manage enmity, but I wouldn't expect pugs to use them.

[Ogulbuk]

YitharV2, Warriors did get a big sustainability nerf. They removed blood bath, lowered how much their two healing attacks heal back and because of doing lower damage you could say they got 2x nerfed on their self-sustainment.

[YitharV2]

YitharV2, Warriors did get a big sustainability nerf. They removed blood bath, lowered how much their two healing attacks heal back and because of doing lower damage you could say they got 2x nerfed on their self-sustainment.

I played a Warrior during Heavensward, lol. I'm also aware of the changes to IB and SP. The IB/SP change isn't super significant tbh. However, we also did get Rampart, which is a step up from Foresight.

I would say if a Warrior stayed in Defiance (which seems to be what SE wants), the survivability difference between then and now is not that different. However, in Deliverance, Fell Cleave and Decimate did make Bloodbath a very powerful CD.

I mean you still have Equilibrium, Thrill of Battle, Vengeance, Raw Intuition, Inner Beast. All very powerful CDs.

[Ogulbuk]

I played a Warrior during Heavensward, lol. I'm also aware of the changes to IB and SP. The IB/SP change isn't super significant tbh. However, we also did get Rampart, which is a step up from Foresight.

I would say if a Warrior stayed in Defiance (which seems to be what SE wants), the survivability difference between then and now is not that different. However, in Deliverance, Fell Cleave and Decimate did make Bloodbath a very powerful CD.

I mean you still have Equilibrium, Thrill of Battle, Vengeance, Raw Intuition, Inner Beast. All very powerful CDs.

There wont ever be anything like Unchained And/or Berserk +Blood Bath + Overpower Spam on a group of foes.

Not sure about DRK, but PLD can heal themselves for so much more with Clemency.

I never miss any of this on boss fights, but I sure miss it in large spawn piles.

[Cyril_Nex]

Stick around, the company seems very responsive to problems so I think this is something they will address rather quickly.

[aqskerorokero]

I dont get it. All of the tanks in my Free Company have not complained at all about the changes. I have healed for EVERY single one of them and I have had 0 issues keeping them alive. Paladin easier to keep up? Sure. But its not that big of a difference. The only thing I see people crying about on the forums is "Oh noes my dps is not high enough anymore!" Sorry. You're a tank. Question yourself: "Am I holding aggro? Yes? Ok im performing my duty. Am I not holding aggro? Yes? Then I should look a little more into what I am doing wrong."

Sharp, tank's is a valueble thing, but should come after everything else.

[Lannybaby]

It seems the consensus is that the tank changes primarily affected the end-game raiders - the ones who try to maximize dps while tanking. Unfortunate as it is, the fact of the matter is that tanks are not damage dealers. They hold enmity and cycle between their defensive skills, depending on the situation, so they don't give healers a hard time. Healers already have their hands full handling the squishy dps - they don't need another headache from a war who tanks in deliverance 100% of the time, or a drk who refuses to turn on grit.

I'm a very casual tank player. I did end game raids (extreme/savage) in ARR and HW, but I was always the kind of tank who prioritized staying alive (and holding enmity, of course) over dealing as much damage as I can. To the tanks who want to go above and beyond, cool, but note that your dps is peanuts in the grand scheme of things. You'll end the encounter, maybe a couple of minutes faster. Big deal.

[Yallaid]

It seems the consensus is that the tank changes primarily affected the end-game raiders - the ones who try to maximize dps while tanking. Unfortunate as it is, the fact of the matter is that tanks are not damage dealers. They hold enmity and cycle between their defensive skills, depending on the situation, so they don't give healers a hard time. Healers already have their hands full handling the squishy dps - they don't need another headache from a war who tanks in deliverance 100% of the time, or a drk who refuses to turn on grit.

I'm a very casual tank player. I did end game raids (extreme/savage) in ARR and HW, but I was always the kind of tank who prioritized staying alive (and holding enmity, of course) over dealing as much damage as I can. To the tanks who want to go above and beyond, cool, but note that your dps is peanuts in the grand scheme of things. You'll end the encounter, maybe a couple of minutes faster. Big deal.

I've never felt like this was an accurate take away from situations like this.

Many many low-med tier players, people who run a lot of 4-man and maybe up to EX trials, pattern themselves after the play-styles established by their high-end peers. There's a lot of enjoyment to be had realizing that there is a higher level to strive for and attempting it on your own, even if you're not hardcore enough to truly play your class perfectly.

What I hear from the end-game tanks who dislike some of the recent changes is that it lowers the ceiling for them to excel. This kind of problem persists downwards, even if you don't need to micromanage your job and excel in order to get through a 4-man leveling roulette, the potential to strive for that level of play remains appealing to many players.


The reality seems to be -- fewer players are queuing as Tanks since the release of SB -- that very necessarily means that it is not a problem exclusive to the end-game community. It's an issue that affects all of us playing the game together.

[YitharV2]

To the tanks who want to go above and beyond, cool, but note that your dps is peanuts in the grand scheme of things. You'll end the encounter, maybe a couple of minutes faster. Big deal.

I wish people would stop bringing up DPS because that's not the concern of most of us. As this comment says, some people are missing the point. It's only really important to end-game raiders. I mean if you have fun spamming your AoE enmity skills and sitting in tank stance, more power to you, but a lot of us don't find that fun and engaging gameplay.