Tanks are fine (show your support so they don't change them)

[Araxes]

snip

So... YOU might be happy with the Tankchanges. 80% of the other Tanks are not. Maybe that should give you something to think about.

[Vallamaria]

Do you have any proof of this? And "force"? How does one force anyone else to do anything in this game?

Well Ghastly seems to be a lot like certain Healers back in HW who had this mentality of only wanting to Heal and not do any any damage at all because they insisted it "wasn't their role". Except in this case Ghastly is a Tank who has the mentality of wanting to do nothing but holding aggro and not wanting to contribute more than the bare absolute minimum.

The mentality needs to just switch a bit. Take pride in others being able to do big numbers and not pull hate, making the fight go quicker with you vs someone who can't hold hate with the same group.

I would say it's the mentality that you and the OP of this thread have that needs to change actually. Since you both seem to think that being able to effectively hold aggro and doing more than the bare absolute minimum as a Tank are somehow mutually exclusive.

[xaventh]

Well Ghastly seems to be a lot like certain Healers back in HW who had this mentality of only wanting to Heal and not do any any damage at all because they insisted it "wasn't their role". Except in this case Ghastly is a Tank who has the mentality of wanting to do nothing but holding aggro and not wanting to contribute more than the bare absolute minimum.



I would say it's the mentality that you and the OP of this thread have that needs to change actually. Since you both seem to think that being able to effectively hold aggro and doing more than the bare absolute minimum as a Tank are somehow mutually exclusive.

Huh? My response was to the herd mentality misconception that dps will pull away from tanks based on left side when that isn't true. Yes, it's a little more challenging holding hate, no where did I say anywhere anything about tank dps.

Maybe it's you who wants to do the bare minimum and blindly dps... I mean I'm not sure what your angle is.

[YitharV2]

Well Ghastly seems to be a lot like certain Healers back in HW who had this mentality of only wanting to Heal and not do any any damage at all because they insisted it "wasn't their role". Except in this case Ghastly is a Tank who has the mentality of wanting to do nothing but holding aggro and not wanting to contribute more than the bare absolute minimum.

Hmm...

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...g_nothing_but/

Huh? My response was to the herd mentality misconception that dps will pull away from tanks based on left side when that isn't true. Yes, it's a little more challenging holding hate, no where did I say anywhere anything about tank dps.

You keep saying left side, but tanks get STR from their left side...?

http://i.imgur.com/sBZUTGF.png

[Vallamaria]

Huh? My response was to the herd mentality misconception that dps will pull away from tanks based on left side when that isn't true. Yes, it's a little more challenging holding hate, no where did I say anywhere anything about tank dps.

I greatly apologize for completely misunderstanding your meaning then. You stated that Tanks should take pride in DPS being able to do big damage and not pull aggro off them as opposed to a Tank that can't hold aggro within the same group. So I mistakenly thought you were implying that a Tank who tries to do more damage wouldn't be capable of properly holding aggro. The slightly heated nature of this thread also clouded my judgement a bit as well.

Hmm...

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...g_nothing_but/

That certainly does illustrate the point of a narrow-minded Tank with a minimalist attitude perfectly. It's honestly shocking in a way that one can even manage to show such extreme ineptitude. Since the truly scary part is there's actually people who truly fully believe in that mindset.

[xaventh]

Hmm...

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...g_nothing_but/



You keep saying left side, but tanks get STR from their left side...?

http://i.imgur.com/sBZUTGF.png

I was going by the characters perspective ... Maybe that's the wrong way. My bad.

[Yurihyuga]

You do realise that this isn't about tanks wanting to dps yes there are some that do, dps will always do more dps than tanks unless there bad. You have created a thread with barely any support because the large majority of tanks are not stupid they know there is going to be a long term issue at hand.

While now its not that hard to hold agro if you spam enmity combos but that is the thing having to constantly spam enmity combos or aoe enmity is bad you should always just have to do enough then actually try and use some of your better skills to do some dps while still in tank stance, switching to dps stance has always been optional and have seen pure tank stance tanks complete raid so never have pure tanks been under threat. Now we have an issue where our vit dmg was taken away which has seen enmity issues meaning we have to play sub optimal to just make sure were doing our job, only people that seem to think its fine are the tanks that just wanna tank and not contribute to anything else more fool them to be honest. Now this will only get worse as dps get better geared and each time they get better geared the gap will keep on getting larger and with it our enmity will keep getting thinner and thinner.

[xaventh]

What are you basing enmity getting harder and harder to keep on? Its going to stay how it is, SE made it more challenging yes, but it won't get worse and tanks can still dps.

[Yahallo]

This has been my experience as well. I opened my mind to actually going with the changes. I never if ever lose aggro (I've done all sb dungeons). Would be better if people start learning how to actually tank combined with accepting the changes. If your mind can't except the changes you'll never keep any aggro or perform your role.

It's good to see someone who can keep their aggro. Enjoy drk btw, that's the next tank I'm leveling (without losing aggro and allowing healers to dps).
I wouldn't be surprised if the japanese tanks already adapted and are fine with the changes.

I've adapted to the changes, even just got my Susano's Greatsword, but I am far from happy about the current state of tanks. As someone who has adapted, I still want changes. The problem may only be rearing its head now, but it is going to become a serious issue as our ilvl increases and the damage gap between Tank and DPS increase.

Also it seems that the Japanese want some changes as well; here's a link to a 24 page thread on the Japanese Tank forum asking for a return to Vit+Str hybrid formula for Tanks: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...81%97%E3%81%84

[Jim_Berry]

Meh!

I'm considering going DRK. Main'd PLD for a while. Now, I'm competing with other PLDs.