Clemency a bit OP?

[Reynhart]

DRks can barely heal themselves. Odd because DRK in FFXI was all about Drains and Bloodweapons to take HP. The HP drain from Souleater is the only self heal they have, and Abyssal Drain but that's AoE and costs a ton of MP.

For me, PLD should have mitigation and healing spells, WAR should have absurd amount of HP and healing received boost and DRK should have leech abilities, especially Dread Spikes as its tank stance.

[MomoOG]

Lol that paladin envy.

[GDFletcher]

Right stop there OP my arse, until Level 64 the skill costs 2,121 MP per time, you can usually get 2/3 off before you are drained of full mana and then the refresh rate of the MP from Riot Blade is around 700 which means you are now diverting a guaranteed enmity rotation for a MP rotation to use Clemency again!

In no way shape or form is Clemency overpowered to the point it will replace an healer in party, just because SB didn't deliver on your own expectations for the class you play the most doesn't give you the right to start pissing over other class's abilities which are there to help keep them alive and be a utility in Dungeons and or Raids.

At level 64 it now costs 1,164 with the passive ability learnt which again allows me to use it an extra 2 times! so in my Mana Pool at Lv 64 I can use this skill 5 times before I am drained of my MP pool. The cost and limited use allows it to have a 1,200 potency.

Again stop trying to get SE to piss over another class because the healers are salty about their own!

[SerahFarron]

Lastly, checking your posting history, where were your complains for the last 2 years when Paladin were crap? Now that they are even or arguably better, you have a huge problem with it, but were fine when Warriors and Drk were gods? Hypocrisy.

Oooh we got a creeper over here. WAR and DRK weren't "gods" in 3.0 PLD was just trash. Which is why I wanted it fixed . It's bad that I wanted tanks to be balanced yeah?? You sound stupid

[Ogulbuk]

I find it funny how people seem to ignore that the OP is PLD main, and insist he is just jealous/pouting because "his job didn't get as much love."

I'm personally still holding my opinion until I have leveled every tank to 70 (cant evaluate MP costs without hands on experience, the data I get on the job guide does not include MP values,) but got to say I find it weird they took Bloodbath away from Wars, nerfed every war sustain, but thought Clemency needed a buff. Bloodbath + Overpower was weaker than Clemency spam, it left you entirely drained to do anything. Clemency spam is nowhere near that, and you still can use your weaponskills.

It really smells like they over-buffed Paladins.

[eagledorf]

In all seriousness, because Clemency does significant damage to your DPS and reduces your ability to use Sheltron in Shield Oath I think it's fine that it's more powerful than Equilibrium.

Keep in mind, DRK can also spam a self-heal now for 20% of HP with The Blackest Knight. Shields are effectively self-heals (anybody remember self-healing with Stoneskin while the SMN raised the healer?) and while TBK is weaker than Clemency as a heal, it's mitigation and self-heal in one and does very minimal damage to your DPS (like 10 potency loss) so it's more versatile than Clemency. TBK is also strongest when used on yourself and weakest when used on a party member while Clemency is the opposite. In fact, if Clemency wasn't significantly stronger than DRK self-healing, DRK would be way overpowered.

Right now PLD looks like they're the best at a variety of things, but to do one thing they must lose the ability to do another (say you want to DPS hard, now you can't heal or if you want to mitigate your next tank buster you can't shield a party member anymore). DRK is the best at AoE and while they're weaker than PLD in utility, they're more flexible in that they can pop TBK and keep rolling. WAR is sort of middle of the road in that IB is a 150 potency loss from Fell Cleave and they have strong single-target and AoE DPS, but probably not top-tier at either anymore.

There will be a serious problem with balance if SE designs content poorly. For example, if you need LOTS of mitigation of tank busters DRK will be trash. If you need LOTS of single target DPS DRK will be trash. If you need LOTS of AoE PLD will be trash. If you need lots of single target party member shielding (would this ever happen?) WAR would be trash. If SE makes content so that the demands on the tanks are varied the tanks should be better balanced.

I suspect if there's no AoE PLD will be somewhat overpowered and if there's lots of AoE PLD will be somewhat under-powered and visa-versa for DRK, but hopefully SE isn't so stupid as to make it as bad as HW for two expansions in a row. I suspect this patch the real trash-tier balance is going to be the healers...

[Reynhart]

Shields are effectively self-heals

No, they're not, because you can't overshield like you can overcure, and you can't shield to trigger HP-based effect.
And TBN is certainly not self-heal and mitigation in one.

[Kosmos992k]

I'm not certain about whether it's OP. For me Clemency is a dual purpose skill, in solo content it's point is obvious - self heal. In group content, especially for OT, I think it's more valuable as an "Oh Crap" heal for the MT (or self). Alernately, the OT can keep half an eye out for trouble and do something positive if things are fraught and health is low - say if a healer is down.

Combined with Divine veil, Cover and Intervention, I think it's a part of the Paladin's party defense toolbox rather than straight self heal. I mean obviously you get 50% of the heal yourself when you use Clemency on others, but given the MP cost, GCD loss and combo interruption, it's not like you're there to be a healer, it's just part of the toolset. If you spam it too often you hurt your DPS, a lesson I learned when a friend commented during HW content at how often I use clemency.

The fact that it takes away from the DPS counterbalances the power and spamability of Clemency IMHO.

[eagledorf]

No, they're not, because you can't overshield like you can overcure

Um, doesn't that mean shields are superior to heals of the same potency? Overheal is all wasted, but a shield is never wasted. The only time a shield is a problem is when they don't stack like Adlo and Nocturnal Aspected Benefic.

Player performance trackers literally count shields as heals. The only time a shield isn't equivalent or superior to a heal is it you don't take damage for its duration and it wears off.

you can't shield to trigger HP-based effect

You mean the thing only Paladin or Warrior has so it doesn't matter of DRK can trigger it or not? What point are you trying to even make by saying this?

TBN is certainly not self-heal and mitigation

What is Thrill of Battle? What is the shield part of Aldoquium? The Blackest Knight is the same.

[Reynhart]

Um, doesn't that mean shields are superior to heals of the same potency?

In a sense, yes, they are. But then you need to consider the MP cost, the recast, the effect of Convalescence, etc...

You mean the thing only Paladin or Warrior has so it doesn't matter of DRK can trigger it or not? What point are you trying to even make by saying this?

Spamming TBN can not ease the burden of Walking Dead. Nor does it have any direct effect on a Doom debuff like the one in Wanderer's Palace Hard.

What is Thrill of Battle? What is the shield part of Aldoquium? The Blackest Knight is the same.

Thrill Of Battle heals you and increases your max HP, Adloqium heals and puts a shield on you. Blackest Night only puts a shield, like Stoneskin did.