Thread: Dragoons... how do you feel post 4.0?

Originally Posted by HaiHai

You're right, patch notes had a typo I guess.

It really is. If you look at the bottom of the page (Resolved issue part) it stated that Bhavacakra damage was changed from Physical to Magical, which means that it isn't affected by 20% damage buff from Dripping blade trait anymore, reducing its effective potency from 660 to 600.

True.

10/chars

was hoping at least they would give us more skill speed on our gear. 6 out of 7 left side pieces with ss isn't getting it done, we still have some crit left

The sky is falling? Can we panic? I mean yeah it's not like we can't function but to be told, fuck you SAM best deal with you're shitty utility, makes me want to take a sledgehammer to the guy's knees. I'm fine with being lower if we provided good utility. We don't. Not in the slightest. Our dps is low for how complex and effort needed the rotation is. Either buff our dps, give us some real utility or simplify the rotation since dps is lower.

Really shouldn't be this hard to balance. Also should haven't havea utility vs solo damage setup. Everyone gives some minor group utility. Dps numbers are balanced. Be good you do best dps. not here's a new class that's easy to play and does 10-20% more than everyone else.

Honestly I can't expect we'll get anything after that little quip that DRG provides great utility.

Originally Posted by Sparhwk

Honestly I can't expect we'll get anything after that little quip that DRG provides great utility.

That's the part I'm worried about. Seeing our RDM's numbers in runs while I'm juggling LoTD, HT and herding a DPS for Hungry Eyes to try and compete makes me go "...I love you DRG but holy hell you're a pain".

Originally Posted by Sparhwk

Really shouldn't be this hard to balance. Also should haven't havea utility vs solo damage setup. Everyone gives some minor group utility. Dps numbers are balanced. Be good you do best dps. not here's a new class that's easy to play and does 10-20% more than everyone else.

Honestly I can't expect we'll get anything after that little quip that DRG provides great utility.

It's even not really true to say SAM has no 'utility'. They have the slashing debuff, which not only is greater than the DRG piercing one, it is guaranteed to affect another party member since all 3 tanks do some kind of slashing damage (and you won't necessarily have a WAR or NIN in group to provide it as well), while you can easily get a group where the DRG is the only source of piercing damage.

Also, people misread damage 'utility' as a good thing. If it's a damage buff, it's designed as a synergy, but if the synergistic parts together don't exceed that of non synergistic parts, then there's no point as non synergistic parts are more resilient in the abstract since losses are linear.

If the 'utilities' are referred to as dependencies (as they are), people will think differently about it.

And no ability demonstrates the dependency concept (which is true of all damage 'utility') of this better than Dragon Sight and it's visual, visceral graphic.

Originally Posted by Eyvhokan

IAnd no ability demonstrates the dependency concept (which is true of all damage 'utility') of this better than Dragon Sight and it's visual, visceral graphic.

Yeah I hate Dragon Sight with a passion. Let's have a melee class that needs to weave back and forth while jumping a freaking 6y tether. Meanwhile MNK's brotherhood is 15y and can proc from tanks if no other melee. And RDM embolden is 15y aoe as well. Both more than twice the radius of Dragon sight.

Should of been a trait that buffed BL imo. Lowered CD to 160 so it lines up with every other BFB and gave a flat damage boost. CAuse right now it's not putting out much when crit values are so low. And it's synergy is only good for BRD who procs on crits but a look a their omega gear shows they lost a bunch of crit.

What are we providing for the group exactly that warrants lower dps for more effort?

I’ve mained LNC/DRG for as long as I’ve played this game, but at 70 I can say really don’t like playing DRG now. I don’t find the rotation difficult, but the job mechanics along with fight mechanics render it punishing with very little payoff. Even with parties consisting of players I know well, I’m perpetually annoyed when I play Stormblood’s Dragoon.

Dragon Sight – It’s clunky to use and feels like an afterthought to the class. With a 6 yalm range it’s too subject to mechanics. If we don’t have another melee, odds are it’s going to either the tank or a holying WHM. If it’s on the tank and it’s a larger boss, it’s not going to work out with positional attacks/cleaves. Nevermind the actual fight mechanics that separate DPS at times. I can't think of other DPS buffs that are dependent on others. And while this will change with enough time, I’ve also lost count of the amount of times a Samurai has ran from the Dragon Sight tether, because nearly all tethers in this game are harmful.

Mirage Dive – I was thrilled when the Jump animation lock was reduced yet again, but then I learned Mirage Dive and was saddened by how bad the lock on a new skill was. I do like having more GCD skills to weave in, as that was part of why I loved DRG in the first place.

Dragon Eyes/LotD - Eyes take way too long to build, and this is most apparent in dungeons. Falling off in between pulls with a slow tank, or during a long sprint for larger pulls. Then there’s fights like Kugane Castle’s final boss that goes invulnerable very early into the fight, or long phase transitions like the Royal Menagerie, where other jobs like Samurai can meditate for kenki (which doesn’t deteriorate at all.) Maybe if we had a way to gain all 4 eyes in a cooldown(what Dragon Sight should have been probably), they didn’t fall off, or they built more quickly. The eyes not decaying seems the most likely outcome though.

Nastrond – The 70 skill is just a faster, stronger, prettier version of our 60 skill. Not terribly exciting, especially with how long it takes to actually use. What’s still confusing is having this 320 potency AoE as the reward for focusing on single target at the expense of our main AoE skills.

They have spoken loud and clear with a failure to adjust this class, so I will be leveling another dps class as soon as I can.

Goodbye for now Dragoon, you were awesome for 2.0 and 3.0 but there's no place for you in 4.0.

Originally Posted by Thandronen

They have spoken loud and clear with a failure to adjust this class, so I will be leveling another dps class as soon as I can.

Goodbye for now Dragoon, you were awesome for 2.0 and 3.0 but there's no place for you in 4.0.

I myself am going to see what 4.05 brings us as that will be when the big changes hit and we'll truly see what will happen. Given this is an early issue, if Savage truly highlights any issues I'd be willing to gamble on the devs going "...fine, we messed up".