How much WHM DPS is enough?

[Kethic]

Snip

I'll be honest; I'm afraid all this attention is going to result in a WHM nerf once the actual dps numbers start to come in. If they change our mechanics, we're going to have to pay for it somewhere, and dps is all we have left.

[DreamWeaver]

etc etc....
So, I think it may actually be possible that WHM personal dps will be adequate to bridge the gap, given the GCDs we've been given back. It doesn't change that Lily's and Confessions are likely to be almost entirely ignored.

I'm sorry but that's not how you do a comparison,

The WHM have to bring ADDITIONAL DPS to offset the Balance effect, you can't just say "Yup Balance brings an extra XXX dps, as long WHM deals above XXX, WHM is better!!".

Don't forget the bringer of Balance, the AST, is also doing damage, so in order for WHM to be better than AST with Balance, the dps of the WHM have to be higher than the AST's damage + Balance dps combined.

In your case, the WHM is higher than the AST by 500, but your math states Balance brings an additional 1k dps (I'm pretty sure this is incorrect), so bringing the WHM still results in a net 500 dps loss.

Napkin math for Balance:

Assuming the best case scenario of a lucky god for easy calculation:
AoE balance of 40 seconds every 2 minutes (due to Celestial Opposition).
Means a balance uptime of 33%.

33% of 10% damage increase = 3.33% overall raid dps increase.

So let's say a group's rDPS is 15000, the balance provided an additional of 15000*0.033 =approx 500 dps.

[Kethic]

snip

yeah, i realized the flaw right before bed. i'll re-poke the numbers today.

[Lunaxia]

I'd actually be on board with WHM being a dual mega healer/ DPS powerhouse in lieu of utility. Switching between pure healing power and insane holy magic damage would be pretty fun, though it'd never happen.

[Risvertasashi]

I'd actually be on board with WHM being a dual mega healer/ DPS powerhouse in lieu of utility. Switching between pure healing power and insane holy magic damage would be pretty fun, though it'd never happen.

Ironically we're a lot closer to the "insane magic damage" part than the strong pure healer fantasy SE talked about. WHM has a pretty comfortable lead on both the other healers for average potency per GCD output, and with SCH's mp costs going up so drastically, that may really hurt their sustain. Whereas WHM mp management, on the other hand, is improving.

[winsock]

I think if you give WHM the DPS of a DPS, you risk replacing DPS. The SCH approach might work: increase WHM healing potential while in full DPS rotation.

Imagine if Regen got a potency buff, could generate lilies on HP restoral / reduce cds / give confession (similar to cure in SB), and could be used off gcd similar to the way energy drain's CD works. Then, buff lily CD reduction to be a bit more meaningful​

WHM would be a monster, having a substantial aptitude for delivering healing without halting it's DPS. I could see a WHM/NAST combo working very well, where WHM DPSes and helps fill the NASTs hps. SCH / WHM could be a decent option as well, as both classes could push substantial DPS and healing/mitigation at the same time w/o worrying about balance rng.

[Kethic]

Looking at 3.x numbers, WHM frequently approached the average sustained dps of a DPS when they tried. I agree it would be OP in DF, but if that's already the status quo, and we're not getting any other utility, seems rude to break the trend.

[Almagnus1]

I think if you give WHM the DPS of a DPS, you risk replacing DPS. The SCH approach might work: increase WHM healing potential while in full DPS rotation.

Imagine if Regen got a potency buff, could generate lilies on HP restoral / reduce cds / give confession (similar to cure in SB), and could be used off gcd similar to the way energy drain's CD works. Then, buff lily CD reduction to be a bit more meaningful​

WHM would be a monster, having a substantial aptitude for delivering healing without halting it's DPS. I could see a WHM/NAST combo working very well, where WHM DPSes and helps fill the NASTs hps. SCH / WHM could be a decent option as well, as both classes could push substantial DPS and healing/mitigation at the same time w/o worrying about balance rng.

That's actually more of an argument for why WHM needs to have a buff unique to WHM (Presence of Mind or Cleric Stance as a group skill?) so it's on par with the other two classes.