Yes, 4.0 Dragoon is TOO simple

**Shurrikhan** · 06-05-2017 02:32 PM

Originally Posted by Adventica6

Lots of people didn't even play drg because of it's long and ridiculous combos, people don't like playing an accountant job, they would prefer something more slimmed down.

Every single job is being dumbed down by a large margin, you have to accept that there just isn't very many smart mmo players, they like to be lazy and just press whatever lights up first, and that is why stuff is changing, to help support that.

—One of the above concepts is merely tangential to the other.—

It's entirely possible to cut down on artificial difficulty (e.g. dealing with unnecessary button bloat) without diminishing gameplay depth.

In most cases, reducing such annoyances can actual enhance depth for the average player. Yet here depth seems to have been targeted for pruning at least as much as artificial difficulty.

And I gotta ask, if someone takes little interest in combat in their own class's perspective, should they really be the people we're building savage raids for?
As it stands, normal raids do not require optimal output even at minimum ilvl. So why should they mind that they're not milking their toolkit as much as they can?
Why should the answer to this inexistent issue be to create less within each class to engage with?

**Ayerinn** · 06-07-2017 07:06 AM

Originally Posted by Adventica6

Lots of people didn't even play drg because of it's long and ridiculous combos, people don't like playing an accountant job, they would prefer something more slimmed down.

Every single job is being dumbed down by a large margin, you have to accept that there just isn't very many smart mmo players, they like to be lazy and just press whatever lights up first, and that is why stuff is changing, to help support that.

Don't confuse dumb/lazy vs desire for lack of needlessly long and/or tedious combat rotations in a game...there is a difference.

**Shamox** · 06-05-2017 02:53 PM

Because the average player which is pretty bad wants everything.

And just like a lot of things works in the world, you're purpose is to make money, you make money by having more people playing, and most of them are gonna be casuals.

Anyway, as a filthy elitist, I don't really mind the skillcap being lowered, they just didnt understand that bad players that can't put anything in the game arent even able to do a correct rotation which only imply to do something over and over.
You're gonna meet a lot of people that wont simply give a shit just because it's a "game", and their principal problem will be their investment, not their capacity.
Since they have this shitty mindset they wont progress at all and they're still gonna be bad, even with an easy class.
Add to this the fact that being given any advice in game is gonna end up in a drama because you're the one paying your sub so you should do what you want, which is a pretty shitty behavior too tbh.
You're gonna end up with the skillcap being lowered every expension.

That's the scenario most game are gonna run into.
Now, there's been some echo of some hard content to fill the difficulty the raiding community actually wants.
All we can do is wait and see if our expectation are filled and if SE is capable of something most games arent, put a limit to what the casual should get for only investing money.
It is also a statement that can evolve with the community being less selfish and becoming aware that even if it's a "game" it is online and you gotta deal with other peoples just like in real life.
(Not expecting this tbh)

tl;dr: most of the shitty behavior from communities over the internet is the result of a human being evolving in a place where the "real life rules" they're used to doesn't apply as much as they'd do in the actual real life.
I mean, it's only a game, being a total jerk to everyone and being selfish wont get you into trouble, you just gotta log off.

**Yorumi** · 06-05-2017 10:52 PM

This seems to be a common complain across almost all classes. They've made them brain dead now. Lets face it jobs were already pretty simple to begin with, the fact they felt people couldn't manage to press a couple buttons and read their damn tooltips says a lot. It's one of my biggest fears for the expansion, you're going to go into dungeons, press the "i win" button and get your shiny reward which will be wholly unsatisfying and boring as all hell.

**Vaiolette** · 06-06-2017 01:23 AM

I agree~! Thank you so much for responding to my topic! I think whilst it is commendable to attempt to help those who are at a novice level reach an acceptable plain of performance, the mastery aspect of the job should not be reduced to such a great degree as it will make various jobs quite dull quite quickly!

I agree the current Dragoon is quite a simple job, but skilled players can alter various tiny aspects of the Draconic empowerment and these tiny changes add up to an appreciable difference in performance~! Whilst the concept is simple, using it to its full effect requires precision and knowledge of upcoming events. It is amazing how a single aspect of the job which is simple in theory can create many nuances! For example, sometimes you can extend the duration of the draconic empowerment by several seconds by using it after the violet petal attack and still retain your empowerment extending attacks~! The new Dragoon, as well as many other jobs which I enjoyed for their depth, seem quite unappealing to me now as they often appear to go down a single path without alteration~

Certainly the new skills look quite appealing, but I think they are superficial at best, and lack the depth that currently exists since we have little to no control over them. The uniqueness of Dragoon which drew me and I imagine many others to it is gone to be replaced by, dare I say, monotony~!

I hope they can reconsider some of their changes so that the novice players can be accommodated but the job's identity is not destroyed and mastery is retained~!

**Nerva3xO** · 06-07-2017 10:19 AM

I have similar fears for DRG, and all jobs really. But, another part of me wants to say its a little bit of over reacting, and fear of change. Like most issues in life its probably a mixture of both. You can not deny the jobs have been stripped of some actions, its obviously a fact. With out setting down and playing the 4.0 DRG, and just basing my opinions on theory, speculation and the info we have, I feel the rotation breaks down to a similar complexity level as before. And you have to keep in mind attacking a dummy is boring. The complexity of even the current rotations really comes in during raid encounters imo.

I think Geirskogul being changed to not eat time off BoTD is a mistake, it did imo add something to the class, knowing when to hold off on using it because of a transition or whatever. That being said I feel we will still have similar situations with the Life of The Dragon. Other things like when to use Blood for Blood like before

**Nerva3xO** · 06-07-2017 10:19 AM

The OP mentioned our Jumps, you still will use your jumps and backflip in the same manner at least on the surface, as before(imo). You still have your escape and or style points for evading with you backflip, and instant jump back in with a Jump, or SSD. Power surge being taken out will reduce some off gcd weaving (that will be missed along with leg sweep, and may make the rotation less intense, I have not played it yet so I am not sure). But, you used your 3 jumps on CD 99% of the time anyway. The 1% will still be relevant in raids imo. Those decisions came about when mobility or saving your burst meant more than putting out an extra bit of dps at that moment.

My point is I still see room for skill in a raid setting with the new set up, even though I can agree with the up front reaction of "they took our jobs" (lol).

**Engelium** · 06-14-2017 05:49 AM

I see a lot of people calling others whiners and I understand there is a lot of that going on but the OP posted a well thought out comment.

As players we should be able to comment, with civility, on our opinions without having to be attacked and called names just because of it...

Having said that I agree with the opinions of the OP, the dragoon class, along with monk, Blm and others are being made too easy. As many of you have said they were already simple enough, this is a video game after all not brain surgery. I will hold out a healthy skepticism until I am able to play the game but I believe it is quite clear from dev statements and what we have seen that a simplification of all (or most) classes has taken place. Only time will tell if this is a case of over correction or if it will turn out alright.

Until then let's not call each other names and let's permit others to express their opinions freely without having to suffer judgement.

**Inuk9** · 06-06-2017 01:46 AM

They said all jobs will be simplified because they want to add more complicated mechanics in raid fights.

I think its a fair trade.

But please, STOP COMPLAINING ABOUT EVERYTHING IN SB. Can we at least play it first?

**bswpayton** · 06-06-2017 02:14 AM

Originally Posted by Inuk9

They said all jobs will be simplified because they want to add more complicated mechanics in raid fights.

I think its a fair trade.

But please, STOP COMPLAINING ABOUT EVERYTHING IN SB. Can we at least play it first?

I really dont think so I th ink content will largely stay the same as it is now

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