Summoner and the upcoming changes

[ShaolinMike]

I've seen an imgur page with tooltips but it looked to be incomplete.

[Psycofang]

People keep saying summoners dot damage got hurt by 30% because of 1 missing dot but thats not entirely correct at all.

Bio 40 pot 18s 1 tick of damager per 3s

18÷3 is 6 40x 6 ticks is 240total potency

Miasma is 35 potency and 24s. 24÷3 is 8

35 *8 = 280 potency

Bio 2 is 40p for 30s so 40*10s = 400

240+280+400= 920

New 2 dots total to 800 potency total which is 86.9 or 87% of the total potency of old dots. Its a 13% loss which is HEAVILY combatted by :

Tri disasters ruin buff

DTs damage buff

Bahamuts double enkindles

Pet actions reduce enkindle by -10s recast per said action

Ruin 3 can upgrade to ruin 4 through pet actions.

Your aoe got nerfed to a degree which im positive is a mis trans and its probably capping at 40% DR.


TL;DR- you do equivalent if not MORE damage now.

[ShaolinMike]

People keep saying summoners dot damage got hurt by 30% because of 1 missing dot but thats not entirely correct at all.

Bio 40 pot 18s 1 tick of damager per 3s

18÷3 is 6 40x 6 ticks is 240total potency

Miasma is 35 potency and 24s. 24÷3 is 8

35 *8 = 280 potency

Bio 2 is 40p for 30s so 40*10s = 400

240+280+400= 920

New 2 dots total to 800 potency total which is 86.9 or 87% of the total potency of old dots. Its a 13% loss which is HEAVILY combatted by :

Tri disasters ruin buff

DTs damage buff

Bahamuts double enkindles

Pet actions reduce enkindle by -10s recast per said action

Ruin 3 can upgrade to ruin 4 through pet actions.

Your aoe got nerfed to a degree which im positive is a mis trans and its probably capping at 40% DR.


TL;DR- you do equivalent if not MORE damage now.

Been trying to say this but didn't want to take the time to do the math. Thanks for this.

[Kaurie]

People keep saying summoners dot damage got hurt by 30% because of 1 missing dot but thats not entirely correct at all.

Bio 40 pot 18s 1 tick of damager per 3s

18÷3 is 6 40x 6 ticks is 240total potency

Miasma is 35 potency and 24s. 24÷3 is 8

35 *8 = 280 potency

Bio 2 is 40p for 30s so 40*10s = 400

240+280+400= 920

New 2 dots total to 800 potency total which is 86.9 or 87% of the total potency of old dots. Its a 13% loss which is HEAVILY combatted by :

Tri disasters ruin buff

DTs damage buff

Bahamuts double enkindles

Pet actions reduce enkindle by -10s recast per said action

Ruin 3 can upgrade to ruin 4 through pet actions.

Your aoe got nerfed to a degree which im positive is a mis trans and its probably capping at 40% DR.


TL;DR- you do equivalent if not MORE damage now.

I get that total potencies are higher, and that is important to see, but the per tick potency is also important to look at. It's 80 per tick vs 110 per tick. We'll get more GCD's due to the higher DoT uptime, fewer DoTs cast and instant cast shadowflare. We'll see if it balances out soon (I doubt it, but we'll see).

There are aspects to consider such as a loss of Raging Strikes for a 20% buff on your dots. There's also the loss of contagion (extending RS + DWT + Balance + Foe's dots).

For example, before you had 920 potency and now you have 800, but before you could RS it to 1104 and then extend that 1104 by 15s for a total potency of 1764. This was doable every 3 minutes (and really there was more than just RS buffing, but I just went with RS for simple maths as we are keeping the other buffs).

For another example, let's say it's just DWT buffed. You tri-d in DWT for 1012 before, or 880 now once per minute. You can then extend the 1012 for 15s previously to get 1617 potency. It's now looking a lot better than the 880.

[Nerisu]

I'm honestly more worried about how reactive the pets will be because I'd like Contagion to line up perfectly with DWT for a buffed up Tri-disaster.

[ShaolinMike]

I'm honestly more worried about how reactive the pets will be because I'd like Contagion to line up perfectly with DWT for a buffed up Tri-disaster.

The DoTs are now both 30s, and Contagion doesn't extend DoTs anymore. Also, Tri-Disaster gets reset each time you go into DWT. They've tried to take the focus away from DoT management to a fairly significant extent.

[Nerisu]

The DoTs are now both 30s, and Contagion doesn't extend DoTs anymore. Also, Tri-Disaster gets reset each time you go into DWT. They've tried to take the focus away from DoT management to a fairly significant extent.

I'm talking about Contagion's new mini foe's req debuff. In 3.0 it's okay to have Contagion come after Tri-disaster to extends the DoTs but with the coming changes it's preferable to have it activated before Tri-disaster so that DoTs will snapshot the magic defense debuff.

The way we might have to do it in 4.0 is like this: DWT+Contagion(or might have to hit this earlier because of the pet delay) > Tri-Disaster(so the Ruin III/IV spam will have the Ruination + Contagion debuff ) > Ruin III/IV spam > Deathflare. If it's lined perfectly Deathflare will have the effect of Contagion too.

[Silverquick]

People keep saying summoners dot damage got hurt by 30% because of 1 missing dot but thats not entirely correct at all.

Bio 40 pot 18s 1 tick of damager per 3s
18÷3 is 6 40x 6 ticks is 240total potency

Miasma is 35 potency and 24s. 24÷3 is 8

35 *8 = 280 potency

Bio 2 is 40p for 30s so 40*10s = 400

240+280+400= 920

New 2 dots total to 800 potency total which is 86.9 or 87% of the total potency of old dots. Its a 13% loss which is HEAVILY combatted by :

Tri disasters ruin buff

DTs damage buff

Bahamuts double enkindles

Pet actions reduce enkindle by -10s recast per said action

Ruin 3 can upgrade to ruin 4 through pet actions.

Your aoe got nerfed to a degree which im positive is a mis trans and its probably capping at 40% DR.


TL;DR- you do equivalent if not MORE damage now.

Actually thats totally incorrect...

Prior we'd be able to stack all of those DoTs... the nerf means we only stack 2 of them. That's a 30% hit in DPS... more if we assume they could be stacked with Bio3 and the new Miasma upgrade... BUT we DO know how much it will hurt us currently...

240 + 280 + 400 = 920 Current
280 + 400 = 680 Post Nerf

For the record its actually

110 per tick currently (non nerfed)
70 per tick post nerf

SO about a 30% or more DPS hit...

YOU were comparing Bio 3 and Miasma 3 to Bio 2 and Miasma ONLY... without including a 3rd stacked DoT. Under the current system we'd be able to stack them all

Tri-Disaster's Ruin buff is unknown, but assumed only 10%....

But Ruin 3 just got mega nerfed... so we're at 150 potency... 165 under Ruination going by that... when it USED to be 200 potency. That's a 25% DPS hit no matter how you look at it...

Pet Actions Reducing Enkindle by -10 seconds? You do realize Enkindle is a 3 minute recast timer right? Do you have any idea how many pet actions would be needed for that to make any real difference?.... and more importantly what do they define as a "Pet Action"?

Ruin 3 is now at 150 Potency... so we're NERFed until we even GET Ruin 4... then once we do get it... according to the information there's only a 15% chance it will proc...

To make up for the damage loss in Ruin 3 ALONE it would have to proc at least 80% of the time... No way in hell it does that. So basically we're stuck back at NERFED level 54 Summoner damage... with only a 15% chance to even get to level 70 Summoner damage.

No this is definitely a major nerf.

There's no positives in here...

We got locked at level 60... with the only exception being Bahamut... which is only usable for 20 seconds... after 3 rounds of Aetherflow at 1 minute a pop.

You can spin it all you want... but this is a major nerf... 30% or more single target dps hit... and a good 60% or more AoE hit.

You better hope these tooltips are MAJOR errors or we're hosed.

[ScorpiusO-Ra-E]

A post of all the changes I found for summoner so far if anyone hasn't looked yet or is still confused.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...it?usp=sharing

Feedback is welcome.

[Psycofang]

Of course all classes took a few potency nerfs across the board, youre not the only ones.

Yes we lost RS but you have a foe equivalent, a ruin booster, ruin 4, DF, DT, 2 enkindles and so on. The loss of passivity is traded for more agression thats generally less punished especially with DT resetting Tris cool downs on activation and locking people out of aetherflow to cause you to spam DT more.

Im.quite positive it got moved around instead of lost entirely.