Problem with "Optional" Items in the Cash Shop

[Bacent]

I'm gonna drag this thread down I think:

so by this line of reasoning, if they opted to keep a Trial fight behind Mogstation, we wouldn't have any right to complain because it's completely optional and doesn't impact the game/make it pay to win?

Keeping things that could be in the game out of it does in fact change the game, we're losing out on the game that could have been, see?

So you're comparing items, that are PURELY AESTHETIC, with something that you HAVE to do with other people that usually has some bit of story about the game its self, while the items are just for glamour?

[Burningskull]

well. think about if they had put the Odin Trial behind a paywall? and what if it didn't drop any glamour gear? what if they put glamour gear behind a paywall 2 or 3 months later? what if start putting the orchestrean rolls from the primal fights in the cash shop cause they are Optional and not needed to complete the game? wouldn't people complain then?

[Aramina]

well. think about if they had put the Odin Trial behind a paywall? and what if it didn't drop any glamour gear? what if they put glamour gear behind a paywall 2 or 3 months later? what if start putting the orchestrean rolls from the primal fights in the cash shop cause they are Optional and not needed to complete the game? wouldn't people complain then?

What if they charge rl money to teleport?
What if they charge rl money to turn in side-quests?
What if they charge rl money to use chat?

amidoinitrite?

[Yallaid]

So you're comparing items, that are PURELY AESTHETIC, with something that you HAVE to do with other people that usually has some bit of story about the game its self, while the items are just for glamour?

that is indeed what I'm doing, but there's one little subtlety to this: Players already acknowledge the Purely Aesthetic value of cosmetics/items in-game because they are desirable rewards to otherwise dead content. Think of bird/pony farming. So there is some conceivable in-game purpose for any/all unique Mogstation items, they've just made the choice to limit them to real money purchases.

The problem with buying cosmetic rewards directly for cash is that it short-circuits one of the reward pathways in the game. They get around the glaring problem with this because they (correctly) avoid selling anything in the Mogstation that is also available in game. But my problem is I can't be sure how many of the cool Mogstation rewards could have been tied to like, sightseeing logs or ochestrion roll completion or triple triad or the Gold Saucer games no one plays, etc.

I'm not really upset with SE because I understand their position, but I'm not going to stop voicing my point of view.

[RaijinSupreme]

I'm gonna drag this thread down I think:

so by this line of reasoning, if they opted to keep a Trial fight behind Mogstation, we wouldn't have any right to complain because it's completely optional and doesn't impact the game/make it pay to win?

Keeping things that could be in the game out of it does in fact change the game, we're losing out on the game that could have been, see?

All of the trials we have had so far dropped weapons that increased our iLevel. The only way they would put a trial fight on the mogstation is if they took out the weapons, or had the weapons not have an ilevel.

I see no reason why that would happen.

[Yallaid]

All of the trials we have had so far dropped weapons that increased our iLevel. The only way they would put a trial fight on the mogstation is if they took out the weapons, or had the weapons not have an ilevel.

I see no reason why that would happen.

iirc the 2.x Hildebrand trials didn't drop anything besides the rewards tied to the Quest chains themselves, right?

I don't really disagree with you, they'd almost certainly never do this, but with the kinds of defenses people have for the Mogstation there doesn't seem to be any reason they couldn't and people apparently wouldn't get that upset.

[RaijinSupreme]

iirc the 2.x Hildebrand trials didn't drop anything besides the rewards tied to the Quest chains themselves, right?

I don't really disagree with you, they'd almost certainly never do this, but with the kinds of defenses people have for the Mogstation there doesn't seem to be any reason they couldn't and people apparently wouldn't get that upset.

Understandable, I just refuse to live in fear of what they could do when there has been no indication that they would. There's a ton of things that they could do to potentially ruin this game. If i stayed that paranoid, I'd probably just stop playing altogether

So far the mogstation has been purely cosmetic, and iirc it was the main reason why the EU was able to get their own servers. As long as things stay that way, then im cool. IF however they do decide to lock ACTUAL content (not dress up items and such, but fights, and anything with a cutscene) behind that paywall, then I'd get upset.

[Felis]

iirc the 2.x Hildebrand trials didn't drop anything besides the rewards tied to the Quest chains themselves, right?

Explain to the devs why a extreme version of the Hildibrand trials would be a good idea and then there will be weapons in it.

[Hasrat]

All of the trials we have had so far dropped weapons that increased our iLevel. The only way they would put a trial fight on the mogstation is if they took out the weapons, or had the weapons not have an ilevel.

I see no reason why that would happen.

Old reply, but, worth considering, if fight grants exp, or any rewards at all, it's separated from the usual optional content. If this hypothetical pay-raid gave even any exp at all, it's experience available only for pay, giving paying players an advantage. And since the fight would at minimum probably increase spiritbond, there's almost no way to remove rewards from such an idea. Somehow come up with an idea to remove even that? You'd have to remove Player Commendations, too, or they'd have an extra means of completing a Challenge Log entry.

The whole point of the "optional" is that it grants no advantage over non-paying players, I should think.

[Claviusnex]

so by this line of reasoning, if they opted to keep a Trial fight behind Mogstation, we wouldn't have any right to complain because it's completely optional and doesn't impact the game/make it pay to win?

I think you made quite a leap. However a trial is playable content so putting it behind the mogstation would be going P2P in my mind. I believe this even if the trial wasn't part of any quest line. That is a far cry though from glamour, emotes or mounts. There are plenty of those available in the game so I see no reason to complain.

This is not a specific reply just my general opinion. At times I get the feeling that the main complaint with the cash shop is sour grapes. I can't afford it or refuse to use it so nobody else should be able to either. I say who cares. The point if the game is the playable content and the rest is just window dressing.