This is just appalling

[ToasterMan]

You guys should've seen TF2.

Valve sells virtual hats for 13.00 US dollars.

[Atlas-04]

You guys should've seen TF2.

Valve sells virtual hats for 13.00 US dollars.

SE is defiantly not the only company cashing in on stuff like this. Fighting game dlc costumes are also getting absurd.

[Belhi]

Non-seasonal cash shop items production isn't financed by sub fees but by cash shop sales. No cash shop sales, no items. Pretty simple.

Our subs pay for server rental, maintenance, customer service and core development including patch and event content. We get a patch every 3 and a half months, usually with multiple new glamour options for all Jobs as well as emotes, housing items and of course the content itself.

FF14 will have a set budget based off FF14's revenue. The Cash shop only increases this revenue and thus allows for an increase to the base budget.

We will almost certainly get Asian style glamour in the expansion, which hasn't launched yet, so its a bit premature to be complaining that we haven't gotten any Asian style glamour as part of the expansion. They have as yet never failed to deliver on providing abundant options with the base content.

This is an attempt to increase SE's revenue, which could be called greedy, however its not being paid for with sub money. Your not getting any less content than you would get if the Cash shop didn't exist. Demanding these items in addition to what we actually currently pay for with our sub is also greedy. We are demanding they give us more and get less profit for it.

People are upset because it is something they want and they cant get it without spending more money. Its a Glamour I really wanted too. However I am pretty sure SE isn't ripping anyone off here. They are just producing additional items, at additional cost, to increase revenue. If we want them to spend more on the game the revenue has to grow too.

[NolLacnala]

The Cash shop only increases this revenue and thus allows for an increase to the base budget.

False. Yoshi himself said that cash shop income goes directly back into cash shop development and SE's pockets, to do with what they want. He also stated that the EU and NA server moves were the first times their team had been given access to those funds. And the NA server move was a critical fail for several reasons, even for Californians. By buying cash shop items, east coaster players inadvertently shot themselves in the foot.

[Belhi]

False. Yoshi himself said that cash shop income goes directly back into cash shop development and SE's pockets, to do with what they want. He also stated that the EU and NA server moves were the first times their team had been given access to those funds. And the NA server move was a critical fail for several reasons, even for Californians. By buying cash shop items, east coaster players inadvertently shot themselves in the foot.

Actually he also said before that the EU datacentre was funded with cash shop funds. My point is as part of the revenue FF14 generates it helps justify the expense of costly upgrades as the likelihood of a return on investment is greater. Regardless, subscriptions aren't paying for them which is the core issue.

As for east coast players I guess in that case it was a lose/lose situation since without the move the servers couldn't be upgraded.

As far as I can tell people are upset there is something they want but that their sub doesn't give them and part of that is the mistaken belief that there sub actually payed for the development of the item in question. In short, we get what we are paying for but some people are upset that others who are willing to pay more have more things they can buy. Removing the Cash shop would get those who aren't buying anything, anything extra. All it would achieve is lower the revenue SE is making and make it harder to justify major investments into the game.

That's not how a business works I'm afraid. The business functions as a whole, profit is profit regardless of the source. The income from ALL sources fund the development of these glamour pieces. You don't pay in advance for your mogstation items now do you?

Our subs pay the wages of SE, and everything else, and what's left is profit. You seem to think that SE isn't making any money from monthly subs and it simply covers running costs.

It is how many businesses work. Revenue streams are tracked by their source as well as the expenses those sources. Thus you can determine if a particular venture or item is turning a profit and help identify why. That is a big part of what accountants do when developing income reports. It helps a business plan and adapt. The cash shop determines if a potential item design will turn a profit off the cost of development. This will be forecasted and then used as a measure by the executive wether to go forward with development. This is the case with Cash shop items. They are made if their earnings pay for the cost of development in the first place. They literally pay for themselves.

Now of course SE makes a profit from subs. However the revenue from those subs and expansion sales is used to determine the budget for the development of the core game (ie. expansions, patches, events, etc) and to determine if large investments into infrastructure will end up being a good return on investment. That is what our subs pay for. While Cash shop utilises the game as a platform for sales, it's revenue is self generated because the items developed are planned for the cash shop from inception and only approved of if the company believes they will profit as a result.

Basically by your logic our game is being payed for by players of every other SE game out there which would mean we are getting more than our sub pays for. Your basis for saying the majority of SE's profits are due to our monthly subs is baseless without proof and frankly unlikely due to the substancial costs to producing and running a company, ignoring the massive cost FF14 incurred with its failed original launch and the very profitable performance of a number of their other titles.

All revenues will end up in the same basic pot but the revenue streams and their expenses are tracked individually and managed on an individual basis. That is how business's work.

[Valinis]

You cannot foresee whether an item in the cash shop is going to turn a profit or not. The cost of creating these items, without a doubt, is funded by the revenue from other sources. Employees don't work for free on the hopes that their item will sell enough for them to get a paycheck from it.

However I'm sure there's no doubt at all that an item like this will profit, because there are people out there willing to pay absurd prices for exclusivity.

Basically by your logic our game is being payed for by players of every other SE game out there which would mean we are getting more than our sub pays for.

You are perfectly correct. How do you think FFXIV 2.0 even got funded? The money certainly didn't come from 1.0. I fail to see your logic in that we are "getting more than we pay for" when we literally pay hundreds of dollars to play this game long term.

[Valinis]

Do you have any idea how much income is generated by monthly subs alone?

Let's do some simple maths with hypothetical numbers:
$15 per month
100,000 subs
That's $1.5m per month

Based on census websites there are over 400,000 active subs in 2017. Pretty easy to see that they are making a lot of money from subs alone.

[Belhi]

You cannot foresee whether an item in the cash shop is going to turn a profit or not. The cost of creating these items, without a doubt, is funded by the revenue from other sources. Employees don't work for free on the hopes that their item will sell enough for them to get a paycheck from it.

However I'm sure there's no doubt at all that an item like this will profit, because there are people out there willing to pay absurd prices for exclusivity.

You are perfectly correct. How do you think FFXIV 2.0 even got funded? The money certainly didn't come from 1.0. I fail to see your logic in that we are "getting more than we pay for" when we literally pay hundreds of dollars to play this game long term.

Not always. Development can be funded by credit/loans. A lot of business is, particularly in sectors like the construction industry.

Sales forecasting is definitely a major part of any development of a product. You think they make stuff at random and hope it will sell? They look at the sales performance of other items and the perceived demand and do an assessment comparing the item to the projected likely sales to the development cost to decide if the item is developed. If the sales forecasts don't show a good chance of acceptable profit vs risk they won't develop the item. Yoshi P literally said this is the model SE uses for developing Mogstation items and it is the reason the Krile outfit hasn't been developed yet. The technical costs of the development for sale of the Krile outfit are high enough that there is a question of it would be profitable. It would have to sell well to be worth it.

Accounting is about balancing books. Revenue is balanced against expense. If the Revenue earned by a sales item exceeds the expense of its development, it is effectively paying for itself.

Do you have any idea how much income is generated by monthly subs alone?

Let's do some simple maths with hypothetical numbers:
$15 per month
100,000 subs
That's $1.5m per month

Based on census websites there are over 400,000 active subs in 2017. Pretty easy to see that they are making a lot of money from subs alone.

MMOs are by far among the most cost intensive entertainment software items to develop. Take a look at Blizzard's earning reports. Yeah WoW makes them a lot of money but it is hugely successful, on a scale much bigger than FF14, and Blizzard's other franchises like Hearthstone and Overwatch are highly competitive. WoW has been in decline but blizzard's earnings are up.

That is because the MMO market is quite a small portion of the gaming market and MMOs are expensive to make and maintain. Hearthstone comparatively was made with a tiny development team (like 20 people) and is now one of Blizzard's big earners. Small investment, huge earnings. The Mobile market in particular is huge. MMOs have been in decline for a while. There aren't many major western companies developing new ones in the current market. That is because the profitability verses cost investment of MMOs has been in the decline in the recent past.

SE has a lot of games it develops for a number of markets. Last Financial quarter SE reported its yearly revenue was around 2 billion dollars (Note this is revenue, not profit). Even with 1 million subs FF14 would be a $180 million of that, less than 10%.

[Valinis]

Non-seasonal cash shop items production isn't financed by sub fees but by cash shop sales. No cash shop sales, no items. Pretty simple.

That's not how a business works I'm afraid. The business functions as a whole, profit is profit regardless of the source. The income from ALL sources fund the development of these glamour pieces. You don't pay in advance for your mogstation items now do you?

Our subs pay for server rental, maintenance, customer service and core development including patch and event content.

Our subs pay the wages of SE, and everything else, and what's left is profit. You seem to think that SE isn't making any money from monthly subs and it simply covers running costs. I can guarantee you that the majority of SE's profit is coming from monthly subs, and not the cash shop as you seem to claim.

[Elkanah]

*Snip*

According to data mine, just like how we confirmed RDM and SAM being a part of FFXIV come expansion, there's been data mines on the outfit coming to a summer event. So it's most likely possibly we'll be seeing the outfit come a summer event very shortly soon. The pineapple hair style was data mined and theory'd to come in the future, which it did in this new "Make it rain" gold saucer event. I wouldn't worry about it too much honestly.