We're all DDs now >.>

[FallenWings]

I'd rather be a Dark Knight instead of a Tank or a White Mage instead of a Healer or a Ninja instead of a DD.

[BorisDaBlade]

I think once we reach level 65 with our i270 gear the instances will probably hinder the healer/tank dps meta just a bit. I remember the first couple of pulls in sohm al as being fairly hard hitting on the tank if the pulled the whole room in i130 gear.

[Gemina]

There is nothing wrong with expecting a healer and/or tank to go into their offensive stances. However, there is something wrong if they are kicked for not doing it. I can accept the "difference in playstyle" copout that devs use to prevent having to intervene with these quarrels, but I'll never accept it as proper etiquette.

It is counter productive to kick a healer or tank who is still doing the basics of their roles. You add time to the run by booting them, and for no good reason. It's still a crap shoot, and the in-progress joining player may very well be worse than the person you just kicked.

I have never felt the flow of a dungeon disturbed when tanks and healers don't DPS. This only happens when they don't perform the very basics of their role, and/or lack attention to what is going on in the battlefield. Anyone who has experienced a heavy minded DPS tank or healer who don't hold agro or heal should know how big of a difference these players are from the ones who only do the bare minimum. The former are far more detrimental to DF runs without question.

[Aramina]

There is nothing wrong with expecting a healer and/or tank to go into their offensive stances. However, there is something wrong if they are kicked for not doing it. I can accept the "difference in playstyle" copout that devs use to prevent having to intervene with these quarrels, but I'll never accept it as proper etiquette.

Well said. That is where I fall as well. I want all party mates (healers or otherwise) to contribute all they are able to, but I would never initiate a kick for non-dps healers any more than I would for low DPS or tanks that struggle a bit on aggro (unless one of the latter 2 will prevent the party from completing our objective). The only things I have ever initiated a kick for are long afk/dc/being overtly rude(this one has only happened once that I can recall).

edit: I am not going to criticize anyone who does choose to kick because that's their cross to bear.

[Natashio]

This topic for the past 3 years.


Perhaps if players would just stop being so "meta", these topics would end.

[Dyvid]

This ol' debate again huh? Well I'll just post this ol' response:



As a SMN I wonder if I can get away with "I don't want to raise people, I'm DPS" after both healers die....

[KisaiTenshi]

This ol' debate again huh? Well I'll just post this ol' response:

(image taken out of context)

As a SMN I wonder if I can get away with "I don't want to raise people, I'm DPS" after both healers die....

Are you regularly playing content so poorly that you need to use Physick or Resurrection? That's the same toolbox argument taken out of context.

If you queued as DPS, you offer extremely low healing capability as summoner or Arcanist, do you feel compelled to help healer with your low-healing capacity? The reason you can heal at all is for solo play, just like the WHM/CNJ's ability to DPS is for solo play.

Those tools exist and aren't locked away because your role should be obvious. They allow those other tools to be used during dungeon play because it doesn't make sense to disable some tools only in the dungeon, and there will be cases where emergent play can happen, because it's no PvP content. PvP content they disable some tools that are unfair, and you can't use them out side of PvP because it sends mixed messages about which skills should be used during dungeon play.

Here's a better analogy. Your pipes are leaking to your shower. Do you

A) Call a plumber, and have them rip apart your wall to fix the pipes, but fixes the pipes correctly, leaving a hole in the wall.
or
B) Call your handyman uncle bob, who rips apart the wall and lacks the tools to actually fix anything , so he duct tapes the leak and duct tapes over the hole in the wall.

Note that A, the plumber only does his job and leaves, leaving either you to solve the problem or call another person to fix the wall. For B, while something of an exaggeration, this comes from experience. For legal reasons the Plumber may not be allowed to fix anything BUT the pipes because their insurance won't cover them if they screw up anything else and you turn around and sue them. For B, Uncle bob doesn't have insurance, and if he screws up you will be paying more to fix the problem correctly.

When you force someone to "do everything", they are not good at everything. Hence the term "A Jack of all trades, Master of none", everyone has something they are good at, but they become miserable when they are forced to.

As for that Sylphie image, that is taken out of context because Sylphie was using her own life force to heal instead of using the natural forces. It has nothing to do with DPS.

[Kazrah]

Are you regularly playing content so poorly that you need to use Physick or Resurrection? That's the same toolbox argument taken out of context.

Love how he mentioned Resurrection and you went on a tirade about using Physick.

Also, to be fair, Uncle Bob did at least fix the hole in the wall....

When you force someone to "do everything", they are not good at everything.

Um, you do realize this is about non-DPS being forced to DPS, right?

[RhaegarFFXIFenrir]

Here's a novel concept: if DPSfrom everyone is maximized, monsters die quicker. Faster mob death means the Tank has to do less work to maintain enmity and healers have to do less work to heal.

No one is asking tanks to be in DPS stance full time or healers to be in cleric stance full time. However, if the tank is using their defensive cooldowns and self cures (yes, tanks ARE supposed to heal themselves...this is the whole purpose behind tanks having self cures in the first place!), and healer's are tossing a regen or two on the tank (or just a shield and fairy for SCH) then there is plenty of time for you to Cleric Stance, bust out a few DoTs or AOEs, and take Cleric Stance off LONG before the tank or any DPSneeds a cure.

It's not stressful, but healer DPSdoes rely on the tank knowing what he's doing and the DPS dodging aoe's. If you've got a Tank and DPS observing those mechanics, then realistically as a healer there's very little damage coming in, and you SHOULD be pounding out the deeps. Effort and team work: those are the building blocks of party play in a MMO. Those people in the "I only heal" camp don't understand either of these concepts, and often have larger issues as players than just their lack of dps.

[BlackironTarkus]

This game is no more "DPS focused" than any of the other MMO's I've played where healers are capable of dealing damage. Every game I've played as healer, the healer's maximum healing output is vastly above most content.

In some of those games, the healers also have what would be the bards and machinist's jobs in XIV. Utility and fun little gimmick spells that can make a party progress faster if used correctly. In XIV, they have damaging abilities and often those abilities hit hard enough to not scoff at.

It just comes down to that point where you're not pressing any buttons at all, kind of sitting around waiting for something to happen, and I find it lazy.

If DPS and Tanks are expected to be constantly pressing buttons then I expect the same out of my healers, and for it to help in some way - just as you'd boot a DPS for spamming AOE on single target or a tank for not holding enmity.