Combo Consolidation: How long before we see it in PVE?

[Ashua]

Lets not even go there. If they want to create a job with more simplified gameplay that is fine but leave intricate and complicated jobs that reward high end mastery for those who enjoy that style as well. I do not see why they cannot have both. If they automate use of abilities like they are in pvp to the rest of the game I might not enjoy the game I do now.

Now if they can add some complexity without needless tedium that is different. I have no qualms with combos shrinking to 1 button if they add more abilities to keep it about the same it has been for certain jobs.

[Mindiori]

So you're asking for automated gameplay because learning a pattern is too hard. Got it.

You're entirely correct of course, despite their laughable attempts to play with words and imply a different meaning.

Certainly, in comparison to the mmo's of old, the imput and player skill requirement in this game is negligible. If not almost zero. As they themselves state, not all people share the same opinions and I walk the line in this game, having been a competitive mmo gamer for many years (during their golden era, if such a thing even existed). Although I love the theme, core design and polish, I find the gameplay increasingly over simplified an mundane across the board. Any further reduction in required management and imput, regardless of whether its 'streamlined' or not; would bore me to tears. In eventuality, I'd likely quit. And I doubt I'll be alone.

Being able to manage entire tiers of skills, is at least some sort of interaction. Something to master using to a degree. How I miss the days of 30+ keybinds and the requirement for instant reaction speeds. This genre truly is, ruined by the casual.

[QooEr]

why do people hate accessibility? good and bad dps arent always about being able to execute combos, but knowing when to use what.
if combos were consolidated on ninja youd still have to know what order to use your buffs and ogcds, youd still need to know your mudras, youd still have to do your positionals, youd still have to refresh dancing edge and huton, etc

changing spinning->gust->aeolian from 1->2->3 to 1->1->1 isnt going to magically give people knowledge of when to use what
the only thing combo consolidation would do is reduce hotbar bloating. if people honestly think this would make the game braindead the hardest content they do is probably sastasha

[LunarEmerald]

Maybe 5.0 to continue to prune ability bloat.

[Sonatia]

So you're asking for automated gameplay because learning a pattern is too hard. Got it.

Snide remark while missing the point. Check. How was World of Warcraft : Legion when you last logged on?

I'm afraid you're confusing "simplification" or "consolidation" with "automation". Maybe English isn't your first language, so I apologize in advance. But there is a significant difference between the former and the latter.

[Shurrikhan]

So you're asking for automated gameplay because learning a pattern is too hard. Got it.

When the goal is simply to walk 8 feet in a given direction, hopscotching the distance is not an actual requirement, even if you might have already gotten used to it.

Current combos descend from 1.2's false promise to increase tacticality, wherein a few spammed skills and a handful of situationals were replaced with 2 alternating skill chains. (Their length varied, since weaponskills past the opener had cooldowns back then, but the strategy was already the same.) At the time, he couldn't very well make it *obvious* that he had done the opposite of his alleged intentions by dumbing down the combat further into 1-2-1-1-2-1-1-2-1-2, so the skills remained as numerous in appearance as they could. ARR's combo finisher's additional effects now lend considerably more strategic potential and the lack of weaponskill cooldowns allow for player choice, but the combos themselves still work identically. One cannot use a part 2 without a part 1, and past an initial junction, no combo chain can backtrack or swap to a parallel chain. Each is a single decision. It is alike to being asked to walk the 8 feet, from A1 to A2 to A3 to A4 (FT-F&C), on a tightrope. Now, you can hopscotch that distance if you like. But why? The weaponskills themselves aren't going to be any more interesting for having done so. And you now have abilities, your oGCDs, that actually do have at least a bit of tacticality and nuance to them, which you could otherwise bind more easily by keeping a simple, constricted task simple.

Again, this is at most 10% a skill issue, 10% a latency's_a_real_bastard_sometimes issue, and 80% a skill bloat issue.

[Shurrikhan]

Can't edit on mobile. Ninja and monk are bad examples of the consolidation idea because of the sort of branching choices they have with things.

Funny thought:

With Dancing Edge removed and its effect moved into Shadow Fang, Ninja would have been a perfect candidate for 2 dynamic slots.

Spinning Edge
Mutilate

Gust Blade
Shadow Fang

Aeolian Edge
Armor Crush

And yet instead they move it to tier 3, rather than taking further advantage of the fact that NIN can apply vuln faster than a Warrior (the only reason to forgo being early DoTs into a WAR-supported Dual-Aeolian).

Warrior would actually make perfect use of a 2-slot setup just fine as well if it could just get a 2nd ability from Skull. Paladin would need an open DoT and a second Savage Blade (now that Royal comes from Riot).

Heavy Swing
Fracture

Maim
Skull Sunder

Storm's Eye
Storm's Path

Butcher's Block
Reaver's Crash

[RaquelleAvarosa]

Loving the idea. I really do hope it ends up being in PvE. I don't get why people like having so many buttons. I'd rather have much simpler and cleaner looking hotbar. This also frees up so much space for upcoming new skills in the future.

But really though, "the more buttons you're pressing, the better you are at the job". What the eff are you playing? Cytus? Deemo? Some music game? Lmfao.
You're not wrong, you just sound super duper mega dumb.

Edit:
My initial reply is really b-tchy but that's my first reaction so I'm gonna keep it there.

Let's just take Paladin for example,
1-2-3 leads to Rage of Halone for enmity building. So why not just have 3-3-3 for RoH?
1-2-5 leads to Royal Authority for DPS. So why not just have 5-5-5 for RA?
1-4-6 leads to Goring Blade. So why not just have 6-6-6 for GB?
This frees up buttons 1,2,4 for other skills. Pressing just one button wouldn't automatically unleash the entire combo chain on it's own, you still have to press it the same number of times so you still have to wait for GCD. When an AoE comes, you still have to move around to dodge stuff before hitting the combo button the 2nd/3rd time for the skill in that chain to land. In fact, I believe this would help players who are having difficulty dodging attacks because they're so engrossed in hitting the right buttons for the combo.

Changing the skills buttons to a dynamic button doesn't mean that players would suddenly become good at the game. It helps them but doesn't magically make them one over night. They're still gonna have to learn to weave in their buffs. (Please don't judge my Dragoon rotation T_T)
6 (Impulse Drive) - Internal Release - 7 (Disembowel) - Blood for Blood - 8 (Chaos Thrust) - Fang&Claw or Wheeling Thrust - Phlebotomize
8 (Impulse Drive) - Internal Release - 8 (Disembowel) - Blood for Blood - 8 (Chaos Thrust) - Fang&Claw or Wheeling Thrust - Phlebotomize

Players still have to learn the mechanics of the fight, how to coordinate with the rest of their party members. I really feel player skills shouldn't be determined by how many buttons you can smash, rather it should be determined by how you react to what is thrown at you in the fight, the correct decisions to make when in a tight situation.

On the side note, having dynamic buttons really help us girls with SMALL HANDS. I honestly can't play the game properly without my Naga.

[FaileExperiment]

Instead of button consolidation (which in many cases would actually still be a good thing) what about simply restricting the opportunity to make the wrong choice? I think it would be very useful to restrict which ones you can activate. For example, with Dragoons basic thrust combos, there's literally never a reason to use full thrust out of order. So instead simply make it so that you can't do it at all: Full thrust only becomes activated after using the first two combos in the right order. I sometimes accidentally hit full thrust when I meant to press vorpal... this would prevent mistakes like that and would be quite helpful. This would still work even with combos that branch, without meaningfully restricting player choice.