Consolidated White Mage 4.0 Feedback Thread

[miraidensetsu]

I am aware that heavy nerfs will come this week, but I'd like to suggest some skills:

- Shell: Yes, Shell. Why not let WHM have an magic damage barrier in the form of Shell? On FF series, it was always the White Mage's responsibility to put up Protect and Shell.

- Quicken: That's a Time Magic that could level WHM with the cleric classes on other MMORPGs. The effect could grant Haste, reduction to all attack times and increased movement speed for a given time.

- Bravery/Valor: This is a White Magic that first appeared on Final Fantasy IV. It increases the physical damage or the buffed character's stength.

- Dispel: It could cancel every buff that is in effect on the target. It is a White Magic that first appeared on the first Final Fantasy.

- Slow: A Time Magic to slow down the target.

And I hope that Break can actually turn the enemy into a stone?

[Nyghtmarerobu]

- Shell: Yes, Shell. Why not let WHM have an magic damage barrier in the form of Shell? On FF series, it was always the White Mage's responsibility to put up Protect and Shell.

Was Merged into protect a long time ago, back when ARR first launched. Not a fan of this, and really just an extra button..

- Quicken: That's a Time Magic that could level WHM with the cleric classes on other MMORPGs. The effect could grant Haste, reduction to all attack times and increased movement speed for a given time.

Could be good if balanced correctly. Take off the movement speed tho, not really needed, and just call it Haste, for ease of purpose.

- Bravery/Valor: This is a White Magic that first appeared on Final Fantasy IV. It increases the physical damage or the buffed character's stength.

I'm on the fence here. It would need a reasonably long CD to be balanced. The actual Balance card is pretty rng, and this as a spell or ability would dwarf it pretty harshly if the CD was to short.

- Dispel: It could cancel every buff that is in effect on the target. It is a White Magic that first appeared on the first Final Fantasy.

This could actually be really useful, but the draw back to this is that when debuffs come down, its usually only 1 debuff. Maybe making it an AoE cleanse would be better?

- Slow: A Time Magic to slow down the target.

NOPE!! Satus effects only work in niche situations and adding this would just be another button to add to the "I don't even need this on my bar.".

[Aurou]

- Shell: Yes, Shell. Why not let WHM have an magic damage barrier in the form of Shell? On FF series, it was always the White Mage's responsibility to put up Protect and Shell.

You already have shell as WHM as it is part of "Protect".

[Ceasaria]

People are not stupid, of course.
We can analyze jobs changes without playing, but the best feedback we can give to Yoshi is when we could play the job in every content, many times.

[Elamys]

I dunno, plenty of people would probably prefer to take an experienced WHM over an FOTM AST reroller.

Also, there are a million reasons to choose WHM over CNJ, so why even bring that up? Just because one very good farm group managed to do it all as classes with Echo off doesn't mean suddenly everyone should start doing stuff as classes.

[Exiled_Tonberry]

I dunno, plenty of people would probably prefer to take an experienced WHM over an FOTM AST reroller.

How about you do a fair comparison and see who wants to take a equally skilled WHM vs an equally skilled AST.

[Elamys]

How about you do a fair comparison and see who wants to take a equally skilled WHM vs an equally skilled AST.

There are a lot of reasons why a leader would take one class over another, it could even come down to just attitude. Maybe the group could do one WHM with the other healer just being there to DPS, or even another DPS entirely (depends on how rough the damage is vs. how good WHM's healing is but if they're supposed to have the strongest healing, it could presumably be the case). Or maybe the group just needs some extra healing. Maybe WHM's personal DPS ends up being really good and makes the loss of Balance or Chain Stratagem not so bad.

There are a lot of people that want to act like they are very hardcore raiders when they are not. The bleeding edge is not something even worth discussing here because the amount of people that do that is ridiculously tiny, and bleeding edge raiders will always do things that aren't really necessary for everyone else to get those clears. It's really frustrating. Moreover, every healer has their day in the sun. WHM might not be top at SB release, maybe it becomes so later. The fact remains that there is nothing preventing you from playing WHM in any stage of content but because it is not THE BEST you act as though it might as well not exist. How is that even logical?

Look, I'm not saying WHM is perfect, I would in fact like to see some original utility, but the sky is falling rhetoric is extremely tiresome. I love WHM, it was my original healer, and I don't see anything so gamebreaking that I'm not going to play it anymore.

[BroodingFicus]

There are a lot of reasons why a leader would take one class over another, it could even come down to just attitude. Maybe the group could do one WHM with the other healer just being there to DPS, or even another DPS entirely (depends on how rough the damage is vs. how good WHM's healing is but if they're supposed to have the strongest healing, it could presumably be the case). Or maybe the group just needs some extra healing. Maybe WHM's personal DPS ends up being really good and makes the loss of Balance or Chain Stratagem not so bad.

There are a lot of people that want to act like they are very hardcore raiders when they are not. The bleeding edge is not something even worth discussing here because the amount of people that do that is ridiculously tiny, and bleeding edge raiders will always do things that aren't really necessary for everyone else to get those clears. It's really frustrating. Moreover, every healer has their day in the sun. WHM might not be top at SB release, maybe it becomes so later. The fact remains that there is nothing preventing you from playing WHM in any stage of content but because it is not THE BEST you act as though it might as well not exist. How is that even logical?

Look, I'm not saying WHM is perfect, I would in fact like to see some original utility, but the sky is falling rhetoric is extremely tiresome. I love WHM, it was my original healer, and I don't see anything so gamebreaking that I'm not going to play it anymore.

Speaking as someone who is not a hard core, 'bleeding edge' anything, and mostly lingers safely in the 24 man raid, sometimes an extreme primal, section of the player base, my biggest problems with WHM are not wanting it be the best or fear that I can't complete content. I will say that if they want to stick to the pure healer fantasy that Yoshi seems fixated on, it probably should be the best in just pure, unmitigated numbers when it comes to restoring hp as a trade off for having no utility but I also hold to the idea that it's an undesirable direction to go in for all parties involved and they should have given that up long ago.

Frankly, most of my fears and concerns come from the fact that the job really just didn't get anything that seems fun or interesting added in Stormblood. Lily system, even if it procs 100% of the time off cures, isn't really logical to plan your off global cool downs around because a good deal of them are not some consistent, planned part of your rotation, but used re-actively as the situation demands. If it offered a constant buff and you had to plan when to spend them to either strengthen the effect or launch certain moves, it would seem less like a tacked on reason to have a new graphic on screen. The shield ability that consumes lilies feels like them just giving us some sort of stone skin remake and not a new action. Thin air, similarly, seems like pay back for taking and nerfing Divine Seal as well as making Shroud of Saints part of the job actions because there was fear we might have MP issues. It feels more like it should have been put in /place/ of divine seal as a job quest reward and something else added at higher levels. Stone is...another stone with a slightly different graphic. Nothing feels exciting, new, or engaging and personally the look of the new abilities in comparison to what I've seen of other classes is just lack luster which seems to be a running theme with WHM. I haven't actually been excited about how one of our moves looks since back when I got Holy in ARR.

The issue is compounded by the fact that many WHMs voiced similar concerns when HW dropped and nothing was ever addressed since it seemed Square was focused on reworking AST. So SB was, obviously, where most of our hopes were placed for a rework that would give us some identity and hopefully engaging, new actions so that we didn't feel like the kid who got socks for Christmas and then watched all the neighbors get ponies. Do I feel I'll struggle to do the levels of content I did in HW? Not at all. I do feel like they have added nothing of substance to our kit. Rather most of it is filling in holes they made when they stripped us for parts to make the new job move system. I have no issue not being 'the best' by numbers so long as the job is interesting and engaging to play. Nothing I have seen or heard thus far says WHM will be either of those things.

[Yuyuka3]

snip

Know what the problem with this is? People are already looking for AST/SCH combos exclusively, nobody even considers WHM anymore if you look at the FFXIVRECRUITMENT reddit (or party finder, for that matter...). And I'm not talking about 'bleeding-edge' raids. I'm talking about sHC, MC, SC groups. The class isn't even considered for raids anymore at the moment, and I don't really know why that should suddenly change when SB rolls in, unless WHM got something truely OP between that presentation and now. Which I frankly don't believe. Yoshi telling people to calm down yesterday also just poored oil into the fire. That's not how you handle fans being dissatisfied with something. Not at all. It really wouldn't have hurt them to release some more information that could have calmed things down. But now, all we got was a 'calm down'. Awful...

Also, you are wrong. There is something that prevents someone from playing WHM in any stage of content: feeling like a burden because you know, and get outright told, that the group would be faster with AST/SCH instead of you as WHM in it. And no, that wasn't a 'bleeding-edge' raid group, either.

It's an awful feeling to feel like a burden because the devs are too incompetent to properly balance classes.

[shawnaus17]

Had they given us arise or raise II I feel like that would have worked or haste