Thread: Consolidated White Mage 4.0 Feedback Thread

Originally Posted by javid

exaggeration. a 20% reduction on assize account for a 25% dps increase, no i'm not saying spam unnecessary GCDs to get that 20% recast reduction, but if the mech of the fight demand the amount of cures that can guarantee 3 lilies b4 assize; those 25% dps increase will add up.... far from useless.

I said it's a weaker and more restricted Spear card. You call it an exaggeration. Let's take a look at the stats:

Spear: Reduces target's action recast time (non-GCD) by 20%. Duration: 20s
Lily System: Reduces recast time by 20% at 3 Lilies. No duration, works for only one cast, and as you said is only applicable in rare rights that demand many Cures. Also requires you never use Divine Benison, which also uses Lilies.

So Spear can be enhanced up to 30%, and works for multiple casts throughout the duration. Lilies give us 20% off recast of ONE skill once we've accumulated three Lilies on rare occasions.
Where is the exaggeration again? Lilies are a more restricted Spear. And no one likes Spear.

Is anyone going to accept that CDR makes WHMs OGCD more reliably available at any point here? Where SCHs and ASTs get all that mitigation and offense utilities WHMs get emergency healing options. The simplicity of WHM comes from its lack of required multitasks, its pretty heal or dps. PLD is the same way, I need more defense for this, I have a button for it, and this button can pretty much be used whenever I need it. I'm pretty sure every AST has sat on AOE Balance for 45-90s or more just to be sure its up for that burst phase in some fights, or went phishing during all the trash to make sure it was up. Pretty soon SCHs will get to enjoy sitting on that juicy CD for the same reason.

Lilies vs Spear for the god knows how manyth time... A lily procs, you need to use a CD you get to use it, a Spear is drawn, you need to use a CD but oh know, Royal Road AOE is up, Redraw hope for something I wont be shamed for using, op got Spire, click off over reapply over royal road for 0 gain, wait 30s to try again. When you get a button to throw away lilies for 100% no gain aside from starting the CD again for potentially no gain again, well talk. For all that is righteous and decent stop making it seem like we always have the card we want and can use it on the spot. Hell we got a new button to LITERALLY throw away the current card, wouldve killed to get Royal Road to lose its overwrite ability and gain an opt to use 2nd click. After that, yep you could almost argue the reliability of cards. Also lilies doesn't have a 31-62s internal CD to really put it on the same field ad AST cards, or the 1/6-1/3 type you can actually use atm.

Also, I think you'll be hard pressed to find an AST here whos countering your attacks that believes we'll ever play with Earthly Star as it was shown in the Media Event. Its potency will probably go down, its cooldown will almost definitely start AFTER it blows up, and that just the obvious stuff. I also read the pure range on it was rediculous, heard something like 30y somewhere if that was true, that size likely getting halved. But still I think were excited for star bombing things, just smaller bombs, but still pretty explosions.

Originally Posted by Cupcakesu

I said it's a weaker and more restricted Spear card. You call it an exaggeration. Let's take a look at the stats:

snip

No one likes spear because only abilities used under the effects of spear have shortened cool-downs and it is a nightmare to coordinate. Otherwise situationally spear could very powerful. The lily mechanic's effect is stronger than spear as it allows the whm the ability to dictate when used. It will also provided reliable cooldown reduction through an entire fight if nothing changes further. The ability for cure 2 to proc a lily 100% has helped see to that. This of course is not a statement on efficiency of casting cure 2 or whether the mechanic is interesting.

For what it's worth, it seems like WHM has undergone quite a few changes compared to the version shown at the media tour. While it is a baseless speculation on my end, I think the job trailer released two weeks ago holds more information on the final version of WHM.

After reading the new skills tooltips, I thought that the fact that each healing spell granted a lily was a form of dev debug mode to showcase the new gauge system, but the recent comment from Yoshi P prompted me to check that trailer again and I noticed some interesting things.

- The WHM starts with one lily and uses a self buff, I'd assume thin air.

- She then proceeds to cast a cure spell (cure II? not sure if it is even cure II, the animation looks a bit different to me) and it gives a second lily. The interesting part is that getting a second lily triggers a buff on the whm (refresh effect?, spell speed bonus?) that is not listed in the tooltip description.

- Dps spells (pretty straightforward) and an AOE which I think is plenary indulgence.

- Then she uses that watery effect self buff which doesn't seem to match any of the tooltip released so far. And then more heals, the interesting part is that when she casts cure III it seems to have an effect on the mob (splash damage in the form of overheal? debuff of some sort)

- Finally, she uses what I think is divine benison, which consumes the lilies and has this shield looking aspect, and the same effect affecting the mob (that blue aspect)

Anyway, just wanted to share my observations, I realize this is purely speculation, but it gave me hope that there is more depth to the WHM 4.0 than we think.

Originally Posted by Feidam

No one likes spear because only abilities used under the effects of spear have shortened cool-downs and it is a nightmare to coordinate. Otherwise situationally spear could very powerful. The lily mechanic's effect is stronger than spear as it allows the whm the ability to dictate when used. It will also provided reliable cooldown reduction through an entire fight if nothing changes further. The ability for cure 2 to proc a lily 100% has helped see to that. This of course is not a statement on efficiency of casting cure 2 or whether the mechanic is interesting.

Except it doesn't really allow the WHM the ability to dictate when used, because it requires you use none of your oGCD skills if you want to accumulate Lilies. Every cast of a skill that can be reduced will immediately consume all Lilies in your possession. This is true also for the new shield spell. They both have the same fundamental design issue in that you can't plan around it because they're too limiting if you try to. Further, oGCDs will often have set times you want to use them. Reducing their CD isn't going to help most of the time, making CD Reduction overall an undesirable or useless mechanic in many cases.

CD Reduction could make for a reasonable supplementary addition, but the Lily system really needs something else to make it stand out and useful. As it is now, it hits the same issues that make Spear fodder.

Originally Posted by Medeah

For what it's worth, it seems like WHM has undergone quite a few changes compared to the version shown at the media tour. While it is a baseless speculation on my end, I think the job trailer released two weeks ago holds more information on the final version of WHM.

After reading the new skills tooltips, I thought that the fact that each healing spell granted a lily was a form of dev debug mode to showcase the new gauge system, but the recent comment from Yoshi P prompted me to check that trailer again and I noticed some interesting things.

- The WHM starts with one lily and uses a self buff, I'd assume thin air.

- She then proceeds to cast a cure spell (cure II? not sure if it is even cure II, the animation looks a bit different to me) and it gives a second lily. The interesting part is that getting a second lily triggers a buff on the whm (refresh effect?, spell speed bonus?) that is not listed in the tooltip description.

- Dps spells (pretty straightforward) and an AOE which I think is plenary indulgence.

- Then she uses that watery effect self buff which doesn't seem to match any of the tooltip released so far. And then more heals, the interesting part is that when she casts cure III it seems to have an effect on the mob (splash damage in the form of overheal? debuff of some sort)

- Finally, she uses what I think is divine benison, which consumes the lilies and has this shield looking aspect, and the same effect affecting the mob (that blue aspect)

Anyway, just wanted to share my observations, I realize this is purely speculation, but it gave me hope that there is more depth to the WHM 4.0 than we think.

The animation that occurs on the striking dummy when the character uses divine benison is the animation for Aero wearing off. It occurs twice because they used Aero 3 and Aero 2 in the video.

We don't actually see the current Cure animation (1 or 2), so I think it has been updated.