LTW skill help please

[Roth_Trailfinder]

Well if he wasn't using standard touch or advance touch and has no access to hasty touch then inner quiet is a waste without landing 6 or more basic touches. I don't see him landing more than 6 basic touches no way....

For those confused. Inner quiet grants 20% bonus in control AFTER a successful touch which means at a cost of 18cp to activate you'd need 6 successful basic touches JUST to break EVEN on quality as if you hit 7 basics touches (no iq). Since no BB...he would not be plus until he hit that 7th basic touch while under the effect of IQ (total of 144 cp)

You have the right idea, but are coming at it all wrong. Look at "real world" numbers, and you will find that IQ's value is greater than you think - but is also dependent upon stats. At low levels, IQ may not be worth the 18 CP compared to another successful Touch. At higher levels, it most definitely is, just in terms of Quality alone, completely setting aside the two BB's, or Rumination.

I could illustrate that by pointing out that at level 11 with 16 Control IQ starts bumping 40 Quality Touches by one point per stack, and that at level 60 the 4th Touch on an Amphiptere Leather with 965 Control the cumulative difference between IQ and no IQ was already greater than one Basic Touch with no IQ.

[Caimie_Tsukino]

Well if he wasn't using standard touch or advance touch and has no access to hasty touch then inner quiet is a waste without landing 6 or more basic touches. I don't see him landing more than 6 basic touches no way....

For those confused. Inner quiet grants 20% bonus in control AFTER a successful touch which means at a cost of 18cp to activate you'd need 6 successful basic touches JUST to break EVEN on quality as if you hit 7 basics touches (no iq). Since no BB...he would not be plus until he hit that 7th basic touch while under the effect of IQ (total of 144 cp)

Not necessarily even if you're at lower levels. For instance, even if you're at sitting on only IQ4, and durab is the limiting factor (you have 30 durab left, and you need 20 durab for progress to complete the item), but you have a lot of CP to spare (50 CP), then you could go Great Strides + Basic Touch. If the Basic Touch lands on a Good, then suddenly the last touch's bonus quality will be doubled by Great Strides and then 1.5x by the Good... The effect would be wayyy wayyy greater than your 20% per touch calculation.

Note: another perk of IQ even though you don't have hasty touch or BB is it saves on durability!! I just realize you're 53 so you have precise touch which is basically an OP proc (arguably the single best skill added since heavens. But it only benefits with IQ)

Yep! Good call here.

[Caimie_Tsukino]

All of this is correct. Question is how do I take full advantage of these abilities? CP is only at 305 at the moment and wasting it is horrible. Just last nite though I figured that when a recipe fails you don't really lose the items, just the recipe fails.

Please check out Chapter 12A and 12B. I have 5 to 6 examples in there demonstrating how to craft with less than 300 CP, yet still capable of reaching Inner Quiet 7 to 10.
Hope it helps!

[Hasrat]

All of this is correct. Question is how do I take full advantage of these abilities? CP is only at 305 at the moment and wasting it is horrible. Just last nite though I figured that when a recipe fails you don't really lose the items, just the recipe fails.

Sometimes you still lose the items. I've heard it said that the higher your HQ%, the greater the chances of getting your items back.

For CP, though the guide has already been pointed out, many players (or at least myself, personal experience) settle into a method that conserves CP for durability management, to keep a craft going long enough to pull off enough Hasty Touches (cross class skill, no CP cost) to get to a high HQ%.

On the Inner Quiet debate, let's not forget how Rumination can offer a partial (or better) return on CP investment (even without considering Byregot's contribution).

[javid]

I did the math wrong; but the real world stats is still 20% bonus per successful touch; I'll adjust the post

[Renius]

I am not able to grasp how to HQ an item. So I use IQ and then use a touch rather than a synthesis skill but it seems that I would need a lot of CP to get to the end. Not sure what a good rotation would be. I am currently trying to make a HQ Wyvernskin workboots but I think I lack some cross class skills to be able to HQ them.

[Driavna]

I am not able to grasp how to HQ an item. So I use IQ and then use a touch rather than a synthesis skill but it seems that I would need a lot of CP to get to the end. Not sure what a good rotation would be. I am currently trying to make a HQ Wyvernskin workboots but I think I lack some cross class skills to be able to HQ them.

You lack a lot of basic skills to HQ anything outside using all HQ mats and good RNG. My opinion? hold leveling leatherworking and level all important DoH to 50.

[Roth_Trailfinder]

You are missing some skills, indeed! CUL 37, ALC 15 (or better yet, 50), CRP to 50, WVR to 50 helps, as can BSM and later on, ARM.

There's a reason being an omnicrafter is so powerful, and its because of all of the cross class skills. Just taking CUL, ALC, and CRP up will give you some cross class skills that will make HQ'ing stuff so much easier. WVR will help actually Synthesizing the item, as will ARM, and BSM can make things just a little bit easier, albeit at a somewhat higher CP cost.

To get 5 Touches in, with just Basic Touch, costs 90 CP. Throw in a Steady Hand 2 (CUL 37 - and well worth getting) to bring it to 115 CP but eliminates any possibility of fails. Take advantage of the Hasty Touch that you got at 15 CUL, however, and the cost is only 25 CP - and maybe a failure or so. That's a savings of 90 CP, which can then be used elsewhere (say, Manipulation, Waste Not, or some other purpose). Take ALC to 15 and whenever you get a GOOD or EXCELLENT you can get 20 CP back, if you do not want to spend 18 CP on a Precise Touch that is. Byregot's Blessing - almost vital for crafting stuff over level 50, there's a reason every crafting class got a version of it in the early 50's, though that version is weak and too restrictive for my taste.

[javid]

Moral of the story........ become an Omni crafter if you want to reliably make HQ items.... lulz (a discussion for another thread). But yea like they said at MINIMUM you NEEED hasty touch absolutely neeeeed!! So level Cul to at least 15. All the other skills mention are OP in terms of up'ing your reliable HQ rates but you can actually still HQ without them.
If you have Hasty touch, you get a specialist version of every other skill that are necessary, although is heavily gated by RNG.

-you get satisfactions (SPC) instead of Trick of the trade(ALC) (trade is MUUUUUUCH better, but satisfaction is something )
you get By. Miracle (SPC) which is an OKAY skill compared to By. Blessing(CRP) (a difference of 100% potency at max IQ...very noticeable but again u could function)
Innovative touch (SPC) is actually better than Innovation(GSM), yes there is range involved which makes it less reliable but if it procs, it becomes more efficient usage of the buff and it has less cp required.
Trained Hand(SPC) is a very gimmicky skill and it doesnt really cover any omni skill directly but again its efficient if the stars align (read the tooltip for details)
Nym. Wheel(SPC) is actually the best POTENTIAL durability/cp managment skill but again its gated by RNG and you're already a LTW so you have the Waste not's
Whistle while you work helps with progression since u don't have Muscle memory (CUL) or Maker's Mark(GSM) or Piece by piece & Rapid synth (ARM)
You have no specialist skill that covers Careful syn. II (WVR 120% progression at 100% success rate for 0 cp.... is just really really an OP move)

And really this is all you need if you want to be able to make HQ SOMEWHAT reliably especially if you add in Delineations (more RNG and more work to get them but overall a plus in terms of hq rates).

Moral of the story.... if you want HQ become an Omni...... or if you want HQ and don't mind more RNG than omni's experience then just get Hasty touch from cul and use your specialist abilities, its do-able (I personally wouldn't say fun....but doable ).

[Renius]

Moral of the story.... if you want HQ become an Omni...... or if you want HQ and don't mind more RNG than omni's experience then just get Hasty touch from cul and use your specialist abilities, its do-able (I personally wouldn't say fun....but doable ).

Thanks for all the time you put on this post. I will definitely start lvling some more classes. It just becomes like eating popcorn once you start you can't stop.