I'm calling it the Epidemic. (This is a rant, if you dont wanna hear it, don't click)

[ArrowAmethyst]

I dont know how it started, and it will likely never end, but over the weekend I leveled from 50-60BLM on another acct, and this morning started leveling DRK which I left off at 34. In three days, I have had 2 good parties. We're talking 12hrs of dungeon running every day for 3 days, partnered with a healer that was making Queue times around 5mins long.
I dont know how many runs we did, but I am 100% certain we only had 2 parties in 3 days where the whole party actually used their job effectively.

I'm calling this rash of TERRIBLE players, "the epidemic". You would think by level 50 folks would have somewhat of a grasp on how to play their jobs, but this clearly isnt the case. Here are just a few of the atrocities we saw this weekend:
-Ninja's not using 'Kiss of the Wasp/Viper' (That's a 20% DPS loss for those that don't play Ninja, and its a set it and forget it skill)
-Ninja's not using 'Huton' (or any other ninjutsu for that matter -- Huton makes you attack 15% faster. It's cast by using either: Jin►Chi►Ten, or Chi►Jin►Ten)
-Bard's who never sing songs (Foe Requiem reduces enemy magic resistance by 10% making mobs take more dmg from attacks spells, Army's Paeon Restores TP, Mage's Ballad restores MP)
-Bard's post lv.52, not using 'Wanderer's Minuet' at all ever
-healers healing in 'Cleric Stance' and wondering why folks kept dying
-Tanks that only focus on one mob in a pack of 3 or more (often during a party with a SMN casting aoe dots and me casting Flare)
-other BLM's who spammed exclusively Fire 3 or only used ice spells
-players in under level gear by 5 or more levels (there was even a tank wearing a level 1 ring in The Vault)

This is by no means a complete list of the atrocities we witnessed in 3 days. It is only the ones I could remember off the top of my head.
If you are doing any of the things listed above, you are part of the problem and are making dungeon runs twice as long and needlessly painful for the rest of the people who have the misfortune of being paired up with you in Duty Finder. If this sounds like you, please go back and read your tooltips and some guides on how to play your job decently. I'm not asking you to go out and be the best DPS that ever lived, but at least TRY.
Believe me when I say, this community isn't naturally toxic and aggressive. We get angry and irritable at these kinds of players because we are sick of putting up with less than mediocrity and we've given up trying to teach the masses who WON'T listen.
If you think I'm talking about you, then do something about it and TRY to be better.


(Feel free to flame me, just dont be surprised if I bite back. Im in a fiesty mood right now.)

[Vincent_Mateus]

What can you do? They don't care. We can't make them care. I know how it feels, if it helps, sorry to hear about your misfortune. I'd get a couple friends to run with. That's the only way it's tolerable for me any longer

[sarehptar]

Not saying there aren't plenty of sub-par players in this game, but... did you, at any point, try talking to these people in a polite and friendly way to get these problems solved?

If you notice an issue, you can reduce the likelihood of it happening to other people by (politely) sharing what you know and improving the community overall.

That will go a lot farther than a call-out post on forums populated in a vast majority by people who are already pretty passionate--and therefore at least slightly more likely--to be better players than your average DF teammate.

[ArrowAmethyst]

Not saying there aren't plenty of sub-par players in this game, but... did you, at any point, try talking to these people in a polite and friendly way to get these problems solved?

If you notice an issue, you can reduce the likelihood of it happening to other people by (politely) sharing what you know and improving the community overall.

That will go a lot farther than a call-out post on forums populated in a vast majority by people who are already pretty passionate--and therefore at least slightly more likely--to be better players than your average DF teammate.

Yes, a thousand times yes. Ive been playing since 1.0 beta (not that that matters - just showing how long Ive been around), and the amount of people I have mentored by now would likely astound even me, but to be honest, Im getting to the point where I JUST DONT CARE ANYMORE. Ive tried, a million times to train people (and yes politely) Some were more receptive than others, most just immediately get defensive and take it the wrong way regardless of how nice you try to be. At any rate, Im tired of it. 90% of the stupidity that goes on in dungeon runs can be solved by players READING THEIR TOOLTIPS. Or failing that "READING GUIDES" that other players have been super kind enough to create so others can maximize on their potential, or compare themselves to.
But in all seriousness, just taking 5-10 mins out of your day to learn what actions (and TRAITS) do and setting them on your tool bar can do wonders!!

[sarehptar]

90% of the stupidity that goes on in dungeon runs can be solved by players READING THEIR TOOLTIPS. Or failing that "READING GUIDES"

While I agree, there's nothing you can do to force other people to read tooltips or guides. Some people simply aren't considerate enough of others or aren't aware enough mentally to care about how their "play style" affects the rest of their team, and that's the grab bag you pull from when you use duty finder. Meeting bad players is basically the hallmark of playing online. I definitely get the need to rant sometimes, but posting here on the forums probably isn't going to reach the right group of people to make any difference.

I feel like you could improve the thread by suggesting ways that Square could provide better training for players instead? For example, maybe Hall of the Novice should be extended to include lessons on how to properly gear your class, where gear can be acquired, what stats are important for which jobs, etc.

Likewise, if you're noticing that players aren't using their skills correctly, that might be more of a sign of the game's failure to make it clear to all players how those skills should be utilized. Yes, anyone with two brain cells should be able to figure out how to read a tooltip, but for the masses who for some reason can't, perhaps the job quests could do a better job of forcing players to utilize their new skills in the way they are intended? I mean, giving you a new skill after you complete a quest doesn't help--if players got the move before the quest duty began, the quest duty could be constructed in a way that encouraged them to immediately utilize that skill in a practical setting.

tl;dr: You can't make crap players better via a rant post on forums populated by people who already care about as much for this game as it is possible to care. Making suggestions for in-game solutions would be more effective.

[ArrowAmethyst]

tl;dr: You can't make crap players better via a rant post on forums populated by people who already care about as much for this game as it is possible to care. Making suggestions for in-game solutions would be more effective.

The solution I would start with is for SE to start capping leveling dungeons with gear level requirements similar to other dungeons.
Another would be for them to add NQ accessories of all levels to gear vendors for a price that newer players can actually afford.
They could also have some kind of barrier quests to defeat at certain intervals (ie: 30, 40, 50, 55, etc) before you'd be allowed to progress any further. (The optional level 15 tutorial they added was a step in the right direction, add more of that per role)
There are billions of ideas that have been tossed around that SE could try. That's for SE to decide.

At any rate, I dont care if the bad players ever see this thread, but now that you've mentioned it, I'll just post this in Party chat and leave DF every time I get a mediocre player doing stupid things. Maybe they'll be "aware" enough to actually go read it.

[Kosmos992k]

The solution I would start with is for SE to start capping leveling dungeons with gear level requirements similar to other dungeons.
Another would be for them to add NQ accessories of all levels to gear vendors for a price that newer players can actually afford.
They could also have some kind of barrier quests to defeat at certain intervals (ie: 30, 40, 50, 55, etc) before you'd be allowed to progress any further. (The optional level 15 tutorial they added was a step in the right direction, add more of that per role)
There are billions of ideas that have been tossed around that SE could try. That's for SE to decide.

At any rate, I dont care if the bad players ever see this thread, but now that you've mentioned it, I'll just post this in Party chat and leave DF every time I get a mediocre player doing stupid things. Maybe they'll be "aware" enough to actually go read it.

Given that the game showers you with gil at the lower levels onwards, the existing accessories from vendors that are NQ are eminently affordable. Not to mention the fact that about 2 hours of mining and goldsmithing will enable you to make accessories for the first 25-30 levels.

There already are barrier quests in the forms of trials and instances like Steps of faith. Dungeons are level sync'd up until 50 and are actually harder than the ones that follow because of that. Rant and rail all you like, it will do you no good. A more relaxed outlook on life might help you though.

[Just-Communication]

This reminds me of how MMOs are like a microcosm of society, when you think about it. An environment governed by individuals far removed from its constituents. Performing your predefined role under conditions you have little to no control over, despite paying your taxes monthly. Raging against the seeming apathy and disinterest of the masses towards improving their livelihoods. Just look outside your window; not exactly utopia out there, filled with CEOs, doctors or lawyers. Most likely your targeted audience also do not care for players ranting at each other anymore. No one is fighting for their survival here and your satisfaction is probably the least of their worries.

In the end, just focus on what makes you happy. If trying hard makes you happy, do it. Because I bet setting the example is more like to teach people than straight up criticism. That's also why it's a plus that the game lets you play all classes/jobs. When you play as DPS, you can, over time, kind of watch and pick up what the tanks and healers are doing. And vice versa. If a player doesn't feel like budging there's not a lot you can do about it. Maybe they should try implementing a spectator mode, kinda like shadowing someone, where you can see what actions they are using in an instance while watching it unfold.

No point getting frustrated.

[LalaRu]

READING THEIR TOOLTIPS

Agree 100%. There is no excuse to don't even look at what a skill does. It implies tooltip informations are correct, ofc.

READING GUIDES

Agree less. One of the things I like playing in a game is being able to figure out myself the mechanics. More I am good at it, more I feel progressing as a player. 1st world/server clear happens when guides still doesn't exists, and happens because the players that done the kill are skilled at figure out mechanics. if you don't even try do it, you'll never learn it. Guides are a good thing anyway, if I just don't want take too much time on doing something, or the content so old that all and everyone knows it by memory, them comes handy.

[marcmy]

Not saying there aren't plenty of sub-par players in this game, but... did you, at any point, try talking to these people in a polite and friendly way to get these problems solved?

If you notice an issue, you can reduce the likelihood of it happening to other people by (politely) sharing what you know and improving the community overall.

That will go a lot farther than a call-out post on forums populated in a vast majority by people who are already pretty passionate--and therefore at least slightly more likely--to be better players than your average DF teammate.

I have tried this many times, unfortunately most ppl ignore it, some even get offended. I've only had a handful of ppl actually listen, and even then, there wasn't a significant difference. You can't really teach someone how to play their class in 2 or 3 lines in the middle of a dungeon. It's a good gesture, but it fails a lot more than it works.