[QOL IDEA] Multijob Queue

[Niraye]

original version of this game had people being able to que as - lancer / dragoon = tank, arcanist = healer. it was VERY annoying because those classes cannot do ether at all very well. Also you shouldn't just expect EVERY game to be like the other. I for one like the game for its uniqueness in that retrospec. If it turned into WOW, RIFT or WILDSTAR I would quit in a heartbeat because what attracted me to the game would be gone. I absolutly hate it when people are like : oh it should be like this game or else, blah blah blah. If you really want that specific thing then why don't you go play those games?

[Derio]

Queue up for certain content as 1 role yes. Ex: dun scaith as drk, void ark as drg, and weeping city as whm.

But when you queue as whm, drk, and drg for 1 duty then that's where the system has a problem

[Naunet]

But when you queue as whm, drk, and drg for 1 duty then that's where the system has a problem

It's literally not a problem in any other MMO. Thus the argument that SE needs to get their crap together.

[kattzkitti]

It's absolutely incredible that people would actually argue against game improvement, no matter what their reasons may be.

[Laerune]

I like what they did with Diadem, everyone can change their class there. I have had groups where the tank would leave the dungeon without saying a word and as everyone already knows waiting for a new tank might take some time. If we had the option to change our classes in the dungeon, then this would reduce the downtime while the group is waiting for a replacement.

[LineageRazor]

And we're back to the point I've made several times on this thread already. This isn't some insanely innovative idea that's never been heard of before. If FFXIV's systems can't handle the complexity of this, they're sub-optimal and should be improved. The developers should be polishing their resumes if they can't achieve something here that already exists in other games, including some with smaller budgets. I mean, imagine if I was a major company's customer service manager and tried to tell my boss that I couldn't meet customer expectations because updating our process would be too complex--meanwhile, our customers see three of our competitors already doing the thing I'm saying is too complex. It wouldn't fly. I would get fired.

You're making an awful lot of assumptions about the situation here that are pretty unwarranted. I seriously doubt it's an issue of the devs not being able to implement a system like this or the hardware not being up to the task. They undoubtedly knew their competitors had it, and made the decision that while it was a nice feature it wasn't worth the extra effort (particularly given the amazing time crunch they were under to completely rebuild the game from 1.0). The system that is in place may not be great, but it's simple and it works.

Now that the current system is in place, the question is no longer "can the devs do it?", but "is it worth the time and money to completely rebuild the party queuing system, once again?" And, to be honest, as nice as such a system would be, I really don't see players clamoring for it like they do a lot of other features. This one is the only thread I've seen in more than a year on the topic. (It HAS been suggested before, but it's been a while.) Honestly, I foresee an overhaul of the Glamour system coming long before a change like this one. There's like a half dozen threads per month whining about class restrictions, gender restrictions, forced sharing of glamours for tanks, healers, and mages, and so on.

It is good that these threads exist, as they DO show the devs that we're interested in improvements like this, but don't assume too much about how easy it will be, or what kind of extra time the devs have to devote to it. SE DOES want to please their customers - it's the best way to retain customers, and build up a good reputation - but there's limits to what they're willing to shell out for.

[sarehptar]

You're making an awful lot of assumptions about the situation here that are pretty unwarranted.

Why take my post out of context? I was literally responding to someone who claimed doing an update like this would be too hard. That's why my post is all about how this issue really shouldn't be too hard for Square's devs...

The system that is in place may not be great, but it's simple and it works.

As has been asked multiple times on this forum, why defend a system you yourself note is "not great"? FFXIV is one of the few remaining major MMOs with both a subscription fee and a cash shop and a (relatively) large consistent subscription base, and yet just because the current system "works," we shouldn't question whether there's some serious back-end issues with the game that are preventing it from adopting a quality of life feature that many other major MMOs already have? :/

I absolutely agree that there should be an overhaul to the glamour system. The fact that it ever came out as cumbersome and limited as it did--when again, other MMOs have handled it far better--is further proof of sub-par infrastructure in this game's design, not less, don't you think?

As for threads on this... I think you are very mistaken? There are so, so, so many threads about irritation with long duty finder queue times (the exact issue this idea was supposed to address) that I can only think it's willful blindness to say you haven't seen players clamoring for something to be done about queueing.

SE DOES want to please their customers - it's the best way to retain customers, and build up a good reputation - but there's limits to what they're willing to shell out for.

SE wants to do what all companies do: make the maximum amount of profit for the minimum amount of investment. That's a basic in business. Not making badly needed changes to their duty finder queueing, taking multiple years to even upgrade the inventory system, the dismal situation with housing--these are all perfect examples of a company who knows that there are customers out there who will support a game that just "works," even if it's "not great." If that's what you're willing to settle for, okay I guess? Have fun? Meanwhile, I'll continue to point out that sub-par systems are sub-par systems and really shouldn't be defended.

[LineageRazor]

As for threads on this... I think you are very mistaken? There are so, so, so many threads about irritation with long duty finder queue times (the exact issue this idea was supposed to address) that I can only think it's willful blindness to say you haven't seen players clamoring for something to be done about queueing.

I apologize if I took your post out of context. It looked to me as though you were suggesting that the SE devs should be fired for creating the system as it exists, and I was trying to point out that they had good reasons for doing so originally (rush job, corners had to be cut), and good reasons for leaving it the way it is now (the benefits of the change do not outweigh the costs). Doing what you're told to do by management doesn't sound like grounds for termination to me!

In regards to "threads like this", I'm NOT including DPS queue threads in that tally because, as is stated in the very first post in this thread, allowing players to queue on multiple roles will NOT affect the queue times. Not to any significant degree, at any rate. There is absolutely nothing stopping a DPS now from getting a fast queue. All they have to do is queue up as tank or healer. Why don't they? Because they want to DPS. If a DPS who wants to DPS is given the option to sign up as tank and healer as well, they won't use it - because if they get pulled in on tank or healer, then they won't be on DPS!

You are correct that "DPS queues are too long!" complaint threads are nigh ubiquitous in the General Forums - but what is being proposed by the OP is not a solution to that problem, and he's very aware of it.

[Paladinleeds]

As for threads on this... I think you are very mistaken? There are so, so, so many threads about irritation with long duty finder queue times (the exact issue this idea was supposed to address) that I can only think it's willful blindness to say you haven't seen players clamoring for something to be done about queueing.

You are correct that "DPS queues are too long!" complaint threads are nigh ubiquitous in the General Forums - but what is being proposed by the OP is not a solution to that problem, and he's very aware of it.

Lineage is correct, most of the people making the DPS queues are too long threads are wanting DPS queues reduced. This won't significantly affect DPS queues as the players that play purely DPS are extremely likely to... keep playing DPS exclusively even with this QoL update. This is only likely to affect the existing tank and healer playerbase as usually if you're tanking and healing, you're far more likely to be willing to fill in a role since these 2 roles are more in demand. Given the huge discrepency in queue times most of the DPS players willing to fill in for other roles will have already swapped to a healer or tank to do just that. Here's proof from the OP:

Those who want to DPS, just queue as DPS anyway and are likely to use this to just queue as different DPS. But for those who are happy to do any role to fill a group, would now have the option.

Now, it's possible the quicker queues from the filler-inners filling in any role will have some positive impact on DPS queues because of this, as a knock-on effect to the filler-inners filling more groups faster, but it won't revolutionise DPS queues and make them as quick as healer and tank (or if this is implemented, also filler-inner) queues

[sarehptar]

This won't significantly affect DPS queues as the players that play purely DPS are extremely likely to... keep playing DPS exclusively even with this QoL update.

Definitely don't mean to contradict on your own thread, and I'm sure you understand your idea better than I do, but I think the only group that would see a significant change in queue times from this would be DPS?

I guess I'm thinking of it like this, if we take the example of people queuing solo for a 4-man duty:

A person who mains tank now queues as tank/healer/DPS.
90% of the time, their queue time wouldn't change because they already queued as the fastest thing (tank). Maybe, on the rare occasion, something else is needed, but for the most part, they wouldn't see a significant change from this.

A person who mains healer now queues as healer/tank/DPS.
They will see an decrease in queue time because they will often end up playing tank. However, since they were already getting relatively speedy queue times, this won't be a massive change for them.

A person who mains DPS now queues as DPS/tank, DPS/healer, or DPS/tank/healer.
This is the only group liable to see a significant shortening in queue times because they previously went from being only in the longest queue to now being the shortest and second shortest queues. The number of people who are liable to queue like this is small but not non-existent, and that's the big deal. Anything that can be done to reduce the number of DPS queuing as DPS only will have an impact on the overall queue for everyone.

As for the people who play DPS only and will never queue as tank or healer--they still do get a bonus from any of the above scenarios. Right now, the worst shortage is tanks. In expert roulette, when I queue as heals, I currently get thrown into a waiting list typically between 15-20 other healers. If even five of those healers marked tank too, that's five more parties that go through the DF--which means five more groups of DPS that also got in faster. If even 5 DPS mark tank or healer, that's another five parties moving up the queue. It will improve the queue times for DPS overall. It's not a miracle cure for sure, but it would be a step in the right direction.

Not to mention the example I gave earlier about pre-made groups. Allowing flexibility in the roles for a partial pre-made would significant speed up queue times for DPS, particularly in older content, by making it easier to find matches for partial pre-made groups. A group that could only fit one DPS before might suddenly be able to fit three if people were allowed to queue flexibly. It would help.

I feel like you shouldn't sell your own idea short! XD