Coils of Bahamut... and its inconsistent challenge level.

[bswpayton]

You're generalizing by saying that everyone considers unsynced to be "easy mode." You're generalizing by saying that new people like running content :

Like I said its a good thing that the story is separated from alex savage than alex normal , that way this same problem will not continue that people seem to be having with binding coil. Just judging from the post here there seems to be a problem that people or having and Im just always on the side of the little guy when it comes to this game. And in my experience since I dont and wont to do coil (despite wanting to see the story and gettin the song anwers ),everything unsync is face roll and sense I will not be doing any alex unsync as well then the trend will continue for me personally.

I just hope that if the problem persist through hw that the devs will hear those who are new or that stayed out of the way so that people wouldnt get on their case for not being good enough at the time content was current, that content will be made in a way unsync so that they can to get whatever fulfillment they get out of doing said content. Im not hearing from any one that isnt sayin that they arent a good player and that they are skilled at the game some people just arent and sometimes certain things in game can give them a problem so who am I to tell them that even in unsync you still shouldn't be able to clear the content. Im not gona do that, but everyone is entitled to their opinion and their reaction to certain things. You will never and I repeat hear me calling for a nerf to sync or current content, I am pretty good at acceptance even if for some reason I cant get past a hurdle Id rather accept that I cant do it than ask for a nerf on that content.

But if someone waits or is late and their only method to do something is to run it unsync then they should have the right wit that feature to be able to get past any hurdle in the game, because once something goes usync at that point it no longer matters anymore and people have moved on to something new and up to date. As far as mentor goes I dont even do mentor roulette , but Im the type of person that if I did I wouldnt abandon a duty or anything like that and as it stands its not to much content I havent cleared that would be in the mentor roulette if I did do it outside of (titan which not even gona get on that instance). So I will have no issue with teaching any content as a side note, I just simply am of two minds you work when it counts and unsync just simply doesnt count in my book its a trash feature but its a means to an end and has its purpose. But if the feature isnt leading to automatic clears for everyone then it has a very limited purpose , and should be reevaluated , like I said if people wont to fail they can do something sync , unsync should be automatic clear regardless of skil level to give everyone their chance of clearing content that no longer has any value

[Settiesama]

Like I said its a good thing that the story is separated from alex savage than alex normal , that way this same problem will not continue that people seem to be having with binding coil. Just judging from the post here there seems to be a problem that people or having and Im just always on the side of the Lazy people when it comes to this game. And in my experience since I dont and wont to do coil (despite wanting to see the story and gettin the song anwers ),everything unsync is face roll and sense I will not be doing any alex unsync as well then the trend will continue for me personally.

Fixed for ya, and weren't you just complaining that Coils should be a face roll Unsynced, now saying it is a faceroll? Hmm.. I think you should just lay down and rest now.

But if someone waits or is late and their only method to do something is to run it unsync then they should have the right wit that feature to be able to get past any hurdle in the game, because once something goes usync at that point it no longer matters anymore and people have moved on to something new and up to date.

And just like OP, you have ignored every bloody reply to you.

unsync

Because I never get old of this one, and you clearly missed the point.

unsync should be automatic clear regardless of skil level to give everyone their chance of clearing content that no longer has any value

So there is no value at all in glamour, story, music sheets? Helping new players through the content without waiting for a party to fill? Teaching them mechanics that WILL help them out in later content at a much easier pace for them? Letting them experience the fight at a much easier pace if they can't handle the stress of it being a full on challenge? Yeah, actually you're right, no value at all here, should just make it so Coils is a movie.

Edit: You also continue to say that you speak for a good margin of the populace... But where exactly is any support to that claim? You appear to be a one person army fighting for your own dream world in this one.

[bswpayton]

Fixed for ya, and weren't you just complaining that Coils should be a face roll Unsynced, now saying it is a faceroll? Hmm.. I think you should just lay down and rest now.

I haven't done coil Im pretty sure its face roll , I mention I wont do it because the majority of players wouldnt touch coil sync with a ten foot pole sync. And Ive stated several times in this thread that Im not takin rewards from content I never cleared sync because imo I dont deserve those rewards if the only way I cleared the content was unsync only.

And yea they put maybe the first three legs of coil in wt , but that doesnt change the fact that the majority of people will just get one or two people go in unsync and get in and get out just like they do with the arr primals. I dont waste my time with wt not about that rng life , but no Im not defending lazy people this is not the only post regarding to some players having issues with coil. There have been others and sense everything else unsync is faceroll then I see no reason to not make coil the same sense it is old and nobody is runnin it anyway so it shouldnt matter to anyone. And some of the things people have said makes sense ,but alot of it not so much Id be right there arguing with others about nerfing current content that people still play and do.

I was the first post on the nerf potd boss to disagree, I dont put myself in a box , I dont support watering down the game when its content that people actually do on a regular basis sync content. But coil is not its something that very few people that play the game do and when they do it , its unsync so in the unsync format I dont see what the big deal about it being super easy is , everything else unsync is super easy so coil unsync shouldnt have anyone coming to the forums complaining about having issues because unsync content should be very easy (because after all its unsync).

@Vidu

I would tell that person and that if all they care about is story only then they dont have to have a time farm on when they are gettin to where they want to go. They dont have to be caught up with everyone else because once the story ends then the way they play they have nothing left to do anyway. And the thing about what your sayin regarding coils is Im very aware they would have to change it the thing is that whos running it sync very few people so in this case it wouldnt actually matter.

With raids once the new raids come out they die harder than primals, simply probably because raids cant be done in the same amount of time. Raids may take weeks or even months to clear where as a primal may take far less time if you do it repeatably so raids die faster. So once they go to the grave yard then it doesnt matter what they do to the content cause whos setting up statics to do binding coil, whos gona be settin up statics to do alex savage when omega comes out nobody. P

eople will do the primals sync but thats still rare , but they are much more easy to do in a few sessions as opposed to a raid. With the number being so low already of people who even raid anyway then I see no reason that once the tier has pasted that it becomes easy enough for those all players to do them or new players. You guys would have it that even after nobody is dong the raid nobody cares nobody wants to even touch it , its outdated new stuff is here that even still then you want to make clearing them exclusive. Like the stranglehold people want on content is just crazy to me , who cares about a raid once a new one is here so who cares if they nerf it in a way that anybody can clear them?

[Settiesama]

I haven't done coil Im pretty sure its face roll , I mention I wont do it because the majority of players wouldnt touch coil sync with a ten foot pole sync.

And people have stated, time and time again, that Coil synced parties are actually fairly common. Hell, make one and see for yourself at prime time. You are only limiting yourself with this very closed mind. You are making yourself believe what isn't true, same with the meaning of 'Unsync'.

[Vidu]

@Vidu

I would tell that person and that if all they care about is story only then they dont have to have a time farm on when they are gettin to where they want to go. They dont have to be caught up with everyone else because once the story ends then the way they play they have nothing left to do anyway. And the thing about what your sayin regarding coils is Im very aware they would have to change it the thing is that whos running it sync very few people so in this case it wouldnt actually matter.
With raids once the new raids come out they die harder than primals, simply probably because raids cant be done in the same amount of time. Raids may take weeks or even months to clear where as a primal may take far less time if you do it repeatably so raids die faster. So once they go to the grave yard then it doesnt matter what they do to the content cause whos setting up statics to do binding coil, whos gona be settin up statics to do alex savage when omega comes out nobody. P

eople will do the primals sync but thats still rare , but they are much more easy to do in a few sessions as opposed to a raid. With the number being so low already of people who even raid anyway then I see no reason that once the tier has pasted that it becomes easy enough for those all players to do them or new players. You guys would have it that even after nobody is dong the raid nobody cares nobody wants to even touch it , its outdated new stuff is here that even still then you want to make clearing them exclusive. Like the stranglehold people want on content is just crazy to me , who cares about a raid once a new one is here so who cares if they nerf it in a way that anybody can clear them?

At this point I have to be so rude to ask: Do you even read what you're posting and do you even think about it? Because you're contradicting yourself the whole time and it gets really annoying to argue with a person who seem unable to follow a clear line of thought.
To those "few people" who want to have a challenge in the game it freaking matters. You are very gracious to take away things from them, and give it to people you dont even know if they exists and if they want it this way.

People who want to set up statics for old raids, will do excatly that - if you want to do that: Go and set up a static right now. It takes time, but guess what: It takes time to set up static for current raids aswell. I've been a replacement tank in a friends static for a month, because they couldnt find a tank. People are setting up statics for Omega NOW because it takes time. You might have a smaller pool of people for Coil, but you also have less competition because there arent 20 other statics looking for a bard.

This game has a lot to offer for the casual player (it even has pure storyquests for people who only want a story), but it has little to offer for someone who wants to challenge themself. Casual people really dont need to get more content on the backs of raiding people. Let them learn, let them improve themself! Stop treating them like spoiled toddlers who are already overwhelmed when they have to do so much as pressing a second button. You're extremly disrespectful towards people who enjoy a challenge - new and old. You're saying about yourself that you'd like to do this content synched for a challenge but with your proposal you're taking away the change of having challenges and epic fights to go along with epic cutscenes from every new player who might share that desire. And I truely hope that the majority of people who play this game will be able to put some effort into it or leave it for those who enjoy it the way it is.

I'm just grateful at this moment for everyone who does not want a striking dummy in Coil - and for the devs that are part of this.

And now I will try my best to stop responding to this disrespectful, ill informed and hypocritig person. I cant take it anymore. I hope I've made my points clear and well understandable - you cant convince them all and well, we dont have to. The devs are already annoyed by our "nerf cries" and I hope they wont listen to them any further. If you find yourself to bad for content: Learn it, goddamit. If you just want something for your ego... dunno where you should go, but go elsewhere.

[Vidu]

like I said if people wont to fail they can do something sync , unsync should be automatic clear regardless of skil level to give everyone their chance of clearing content that no longer has any value

Heres the thing: if you're doing content unsyched or syched affects only you, not the content - the content is the same both times. You cant remove mechanics from the "unsyched-version", but keep them synched because the "unyched-version" does not exists. Same content. If you remove mechanics they're gone. For everyone. If you nerf the content, its also nerfed and has changed for the person who wants a challenge, because its the same duty, the same content. Thats why I cant possibly agree with you because you show again and again that you lack an understanding about the things you're talking about.

To keep the challenge sychend, the content has to stay tha way it is now (or be restored to old versions... a girl can dream, right?). If unsyched should supposed to be faceroll, 100% kill, boss drops dead at the start of the duty, it would require the dev-team to programm a second duty. That is excatly what has happend with Alexander - Storymode version for everyone, challenge for raiders. But even the storymode easy version still has mechanics. So, should those be removed for people who just want to watch a movie see the story aswell?
Just an hour ago I was reading this thread (http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...tting-annoying.) in which someone complains that they're having to do duties at all because they just want to progress through the story and dont have time for a 20 minuten dungeon. Whats your answer to them? Shall we remove all dungeons from the game because someone cant bring themself to do them?
My answer is: No, we should not. Its part of this games "gameplay" and concept that dungeons are a part of it - and if someone, for whatever reason, cant or dont want to that, they should really be looking for a different game.

You are also again being very patronising and arguing for a group fo people no one should argue for: Those who are to lazy, to but the slightest amount of effort into anything. If you want auto-clears: Go and buy one or look for someone who carries you.
You are not aware what you're asking for - and you're not arguing for the sake of yourself but for people you assume exists. People who you describe as so lazy or stupid that they cant handle mechanics at all - which raises the question: How did a person who cant handle mechanics at all even reach Coil?

I haven't done coil Im pretty sure its face roll ,

Thank you for confirming that you dont even know what you're talking about. You're basically saying here "Please remove mechanics that I havent seen, so I dont even know if they're difficult or not".
Can we all agree on ignoring this person now since they cant possibly evaluate wether or not content that they've never done needs adjustments?

I assure you: T11 does not need it, just because mechanics cant be ignored - you mention the PotD-discussion. Mechanics on Edda cant be ignored either, but they're easy enough to handle (turn away for the eye, dont stand in AoEs). I'll do you the courtesy to list relevant T11-mechanics when this content is done synched or unsyched - and you think long and hard about wether or not thats to much to ask, okay?

T11

- Barofield: Dont stand directly under Kalia. You can see the white field on the ground. All you have to do is not stand in it. Thats okay, right?
- Tankswitch/debuff: synched you need to provoke here, but unsyched it doesnt matter - just tank here. Like, stand still and tank here. Okay?
- Seeds of sea/land: Synched you need to stack and spread for those - unsyched it doesnt matter, just heal through the damage. You can cast a medica II or so, right?
- Add-phase. Okay, bit tricky! Move along the room while tanking two adds (one add can now be tanked by any class) and make sure they dont come to close to each other. Am I asking to much of you already?
- Add-phase: Stand close to the add you wish to attack because you wont deal damage otherwise. You can do that, can you?
- Add-phase: If you get the lightning debuff, move out of the group or everyone close to you will get paralysis. You know where you need to do that too? Ozma in Mhach. There its bleed, but basically: if you get targeted with that: move out of the group. You can pay a little attention to that, yes?
- Theters: Just have blue stand toegther and green stand together. No need to dodge Kalias AoEs when doing this unsyched, so just agree on having blue marks on one side and green ones on the other side and stand there, til the colours change (and you might have to move to the other side) or Kalia drops dead because you're just burning her at this point.

[Istaru]

But if the feature isnt leading to automatic clears for everyone then it has a very limited purpose , and should be reevaluated , like I said if people wont to fail they can do something sync , unsync should be automatic clear regardless of skil level to give everyone their chance of clearing content that no longer has any value

My head hurts...

It would be awesome if you could just like stop. Please?

It is called "Undersized Party". That is the intent to that mode.

I'm going to repeat myself, please say it with me, "Undersized Party".

Ok, good? Sigh

It's intent was to allow smaller groups to attemp to clear older content for people who missed it.

It is not "Game made EZ". It is also not "Faceroll to Victory".

You also stated "has no value". If it has no value whatsoever, why is anyone doing it? The answer is simple, it does have value. It may not have the value it once did, but it still has value nonetheless. Those are things such as a title, a minion, Wondrous Tails, glamour, crafting items, orchestrion scrolls, gear for level 50 jobs. There are many things to value. Just because they aren't level 60 endgame things does not mean they are without value.

Since you followed my premise, I'll follow yours.

Oh, you didn't? Not shocked, but I will work with what you stated anyway.

At the release of 5.0, all 4.x content becomes face roll easy from that mode since mechanics and effort are hard. Basically all the content becomes a piñata, you smack it around a little bit with your "gimme loot" button and loot comes flying out of it all of the place. So much loot you are still picking it up a week later.

If that is the intent, why bother to play 4.0 at all? Seriously. If I can complete everything from 4.0 in an hour and get all the rewards in a day or two, why spend 2 years doing the same thing??? The answer is that beyond friends and a desire for what would now become artificially challenging content, there isn't one.

To go a step further, what if everyone or most people came to this same conclusion and cancelled their subscription for an entire expansion as there was no longer any reason to learn anything while it was relevant? I'm fairly certain the answer would be, death of the game as we know it. The loss of revenue would cause them to drop the funding of the game due to lack of revenue generated.

That is at least partly why it is not gimme loot mode. I agree that old content should get easier over time. I disagree that it should go from a challenge to "rolling for loot while watching Netflix" just because an expansion happened.

[Settiesama]

Why am I still responding?

Because you secretly enjoy torturing yourself.

[bswpayton]

My head hurts..

But aside from rng what is not give me loot about the current arr primals when you run them unsync?

Ramuh beat him to the ground ignored just about every mechanic, but the adds done in less than five minutes.

Garuda beat her to the ground ignore the two adds ignore every mechanic but maybe spiny but she might be dead unsync before he even comes out less than 3 mins.

Levitan hold dps beat him to the ground dodge which even unsync can still cause some issues I guess but still done in less than 5 mins.

Shiva kill adds tank and spank kill her ignore all meahanics even if your friend gets stuck in the ice just burn the boss done less than five minutes.

Ifrit kill nails ignore tank swap ignore nails igore room wide aoe hold dps on on second set of nails done in less than 5 mins.

King moogle tank and spank less than five mins, Titan extreme Ill admit with him falling off the platform can still happen whatever level you are but he still can be tanked and spanked.

So did people skip the 103 quest to hw because unsync allowed them to do it nope I dont think so, if anything the community has modified my attitude on these instances. I was the type that you know viewed this whole game as you know a whole entire game but its not tho, this game is what every patch that we are currently on. So once stormblood hits dont tell me that 75 percent of the game will aside from leveling be ran unsync on the regular because 50 percent of it now sure is. Like Im not in some fantasy land I know what I see on the party finder unsync snowcloak just need for anima, usnync pony farms quick burns this is what people think of old content.

Just because you or I prefer sync method doesnt mean thats what the playerbase wants SE gave this feature and the playerbase took it and run with it. If the intent wasnt to make things faceroll thats role then it sure was a consiquence to the feature. And Ive already been debatin this already I think it will effect the game greatly no point to make a post about it but I think the feature is going to really effect the game in a negative way but its what the players want.

So image a player already has all the horses however they got them usync or whatever how long did it take them to get those horses Id say that the rng could of taken them a good bit of time. Well guess what with the hw primals you dont even have to worry about rng preventing you from your months just zerg the boss 99 times you can buy it gona cut down on lots of bird farming.

And unlike coil alexanders story isnt even in the savage version so its no need to even bother doing that as well, so basicly two major changes coming along the way. But people want it easy so Im just like **** it might as well make it as easy as possible so that people can get what they want. So what your saying is basicly whats already happened and will develop even more as time goes on. So I guess all I can say is I hope all new content is actually worth it and holds people over because with unsync everything is zerg the boss whether you like it or not.

@Vidu

Again Im not being unrealistic I am being real and being observant of the player base at least those on my server and what I see in the party finder. What you are talkin about is a niche group of a niche group I have stated I like challenge and want challenge. But I cant tell you how many times before I actually got to current content I was told and directed to you know catch up with everyone else. Ive stated before this isnt a game you can just simply do what you want to do this is a game thats very dependent on what the community is willing to do and the community aside from the small amount of people on this thread could give two craps about doing stuff once its old the proper way.

Ive made many post about tryin to do things sync and tryin to get a challenge from these things but every time I was met with get up to where we are now that stuffs old. Dont worry about level 50 stuff your rotations different now, I dont wana do old stuff cause I dont have all my moves is what people would say. Actually people on this forums even went as far to ask me to unlock my lodestone so they could see when I cleared primals oh because I cleared them when they wernt current I was some kind of horrible player. Are how people will even say now oh you cleared alex with echo , you didnt really clear it then should of done it current this is what elitist say. Like maybe its different on different servers, but even with pf I know what I see and I check any primal that isnt hw is ran unsync aside from the very rare person that goes against the grain. I just started in hw , and this game has shown me unsync old stuff it doesnt matter do the new stuff for birds, and keep up with each new challenge in the current patch.

All people care about is progression they dont care about the fact that this is a whole game, so no Im not disrespecting you but just being real and honest . Even the ones that said that oh its some sync coil runs in pf if we did the math on any given month what percentage would that be im willing to say not even one percent. So you want people to focus on something that less than 1 % of the player base wants I want it myself but I know im outnumbered but guess what as the saying goes the majority rules. Im just not in this delusional realm that people actually care about doing this content, because Ive clearly seen that they arent because like I said this game is about whats current and whats current only and that I guess is the nature of an mmo and its something I had to learn myself and maybe others in this thread should as well.

[Settiesama]

because with unsync everything is zerg the boss whether you like it or not.

Yet in the exact same post you commented how the Primals still require mechanics :x (Yes, adds are mechanics)

But aside from rng what is not give me loot about the current arr primals when you run them unsync?

Also my head hurts now trying to understand that.

Edit: Get the 'Undersized Party' statement that Itsaru and others have been trying to inform you drilled into your head. It's not there to make things instantly cleared, it's for HELPING and doing things without the need of a full party. Syncing is still an option and many still do it as such.