Coils of Bahamut... and its inconsistent challenge level.

[HyoMinPark]

If the OP thinks regular Coil is hard, I'd suggest they not even touch SCoB Savage.

In all seriousness though: people in this game need to stop asking for nerfs.

Ozma? People wanting Edda's fight nerfed (lol seriously)? I'm sure there were plenty of "Please nerf [content] in Dun Scaith" threads when it first came out (though I was on break and not checking the forums regularly at that time). And now Coil?

OP, no one queues for Coil these days because 1. It's old content (just like people rarely directly queue for ARR Ex primals unless they are new players and actually level 50), and 2. Because people know they can just toss up a PF and run it unsynced. Perhaps even 3. Don't even know about its existence (I didn't know anything about Coil or even Crystal Tower when I started playing).

I think this game needs more challenging content, which is what Coil was back in its Prime (wish I had started playing back in 2.x to experience it as such, but didn't have extra money to spare for a sub between bills and other things that required adulting). I'm tired of how easy things are nowadays. And I know we have to cater to the more "casual" playerbase, but does that really mean making things so easy that I could do them with my eyes closed? It shouldn't.

People still run Coil today (albeit unsynced) for Wonderous Tails, or for glamour (for a long time, the High Allagan Body Aetherstones and Neo-aetherstones ran for 500k or more on my server; sometimes the High Allagan ones can still fetch a pretty penny, and some of the faded Orchestrion copies sell for a lot too). Some people run it with newbies for the sweet Poetics bonus (minus T3). And some people use it for tank mounts/achievements (T4 can easily be duo'd by two confident/competent tanks; perhaps even solo'd by a WAR). Sometimes I go in with a friend to see how far we can make it just us two (we cleared T13 with WAR/AST/BRD before, and really want to clear T13 just WAR/AST or WAR/SCH, and we cleared T5 with DRK/SCH; we actually went in wanting to make it to enrage and just heal through it--that was actually really fun).

If you want to run sync'd Coil, toss up a PF. Make it minimum ilvl for even more fun. I saw a sync'd T9 run in PF a few weeks ago, and would have joined if they'd had a DPS spot open (I'd rather clear it on BRD since I know that job the best out of all my 60s). But if you think it's hard unsynced at 60, it will be even harder sync'd down to 50. Which is a good thing. It's supposed to be hard. A lot of the "insta-death" mechanics are still in current/Heavensward Ex primals (like Wall Sempai, except they nerfed him too where he only ticks for 9,999 damage instead of instantly killing you). You're working your way through the Coil series to fight Bahamut (or a representation of him). Bahamut, who obliterated parts of Hydaelyn, and permantently changed other parts. Why would anyone want something that epic to be faceroll easy?

Just follow mechanics. It's really not that hard to do. Makes fights a little easier if you understand how to do the mechanics, and some of the Coil ones can be cheesed, yet still followed (Twintania's divebombs, the last phase of T9 is basically zerg'd through now, and if you have a semi-decent healer the tank can just eat Bahamut's Ahk Morns solo).

Leave Coil as it is. There's no reason to nerf it more than they have (you get like 20% or 30% echo instantly now, I mean come on). There's no reason to change anything about it, and the developers aren't going to spend time reworking and nerfing 2.x content when they need to work on developing good 4.x content.

[Awful]

What surprises me is that no one is seeing the irony in this... or why its happening...

I honestly would love to do this one for real...

But that's never going to happen if you can't get anyone to queue for it or do it...

You can't have both... you need it to be appropriate for level 50... or update it to level 60...

Walk in the middle of the road like that and you only get squished...

Or you can Sync it to minimum ilvl and then see how the challenge is, there's a reason people run this old content glamours/music, i'd rather it retain some challenge and at least require a heart beat rather then sitting there and 1 shot it. It's a waste of time to update it to 60, look at WoW they brought back Molten Core an old 40 MAN RAID for level 100 and guess what? It was a boring slog fest with nothing to redeem itself other then the mount and minion after the 3-4 hours of this ungodly place was finished.

[DaikiKiyoshi]

What surprises me is that no one is seeing the irony in this... or why its happening...

I honestly would love to do this one for real...

But that's never going to happen if you can't get anyone to queue for it or do it...

You can't have both... you need it to be appropriate for level 50... or update it to level 60...

Walk in the middle of the road like that and you only get squished...

^

have you consider people cleared it at lvl 50 with ilvl 90 - 110 before heavenward and PRE- nerf?

Git gud.

[Vidu]

But that's never going to happen if you can't get anyone to queue for it or do it...

This argument is always puzzeling me, kinda - because the obvious solution is: You have to do what raiders did back then - form a static of like minded people to run this content with. This isnt content that the DF can and should handle, as you've observed: the mechanics are to complexe for that and it cant be facerolled. But its in place for the people who actually want that sort of content - and those dont pop out of the DF, you have to actually look for them.

[Ririta]

I don't see what's so bad about nerfing optional content that's from two years ago.

Tbh it baffles me that Nael is still unnerfed. She's the biggest wall for unsynced runs from my experience, and even back then she blocked a lot of people from the much easier FCoB.

[ErryK]

I don't see what's so bad about nerfing optional content that's from two years ago.

OP is practically asking to make all coil fights basically striking dummy fights, that's what the 24-mans are for.

[Silverquick]

This argument is always puzzeling me, kinda - because the obvious solution is: You have to do what raiders did back then - form a static of like minded people to run this content with. This isnt content that the DF can and should handle, as you've observed: the mechanics are to complexe for that and it cant be facerolled. But its in place for the people who actually want that sort of content - and those dont pop out of the DF, you have to actually look for them.

And why is that exactly...

Look I realize to the old crew.... level 50.... WAS like level 60... and stuff... but dude... like back in the day it may have been a dollar but in this day and age... really... its only a quarter now...

... its umm... just level 50...

So while I can que for Alexander, Void Ark, Mhach, Dun Scaith and shockingly Crystal Tower... and run it any given time... even at the level appropriate...

Bahamet is the only exception... ergo.. there's a problem here... the challenge level does not fit the current level its assigned to...

[DaikiKiyoshi]

I don't see what's so bad about nerfing optional content that's from two years ago.

Tbh it baffles me that Nael is still unnerfed. She's the biggest wall for unsynced runs from my experience, and even back then she blocked a lot of people from the much easier FCoB.

It doesn't matter if the content is current or from 2 years ago. And if you wanna argue content is optional that could apply to literally any content in the game. Guess we should just nerf everything right?

And as an aside, it also kinda annoys me when people say content is no longer relevant. Content may not be relevant to me but there are always new players coming up from the bottom that the "old" content is still relevant to. I would argue content is always relevant as long as identical rewards are not placed in easier content and even then people don't always run it for the rewards.

Bahamut* is the only exception... ergo.. there's a problem here... the challenge level does not fit the current level its assigned to...

Yes...it does. If you can't clear it at level 60 it just means you need to learn the fight or you are, to be blunt, bad.

[Silverquick]

Yes...it does. If you can't clear it at level 60 it just means you need to learn the fight or you are, to be blunt, bad.

So in other words..

When it goes off and jams up and makes everything invulnerable because it cant kill me anymore... with a supposed insta death mechanic...

And I'm sitting in the middle of the instance unable to do anything or clear it because its not strong enough to kill me at 60th level unsynced... its like... my fault and stuff...

Gotcha...

[aleph_null]

Personally rather than "nerfing" instant wipe mechanics in coil floors I want the devs to go back and adjust some of the lv 50 trials where too much dps would result in a wipe (ifrit, leviathan, ramuh for example). Having to hold back dps just feels counterintuitive in a vertical progression game, where you get more powerful gear every new patch (not even talking about unsynced lv 60). But it doesn't seem like that'll happen lol.

Instant wipe mechanics also exist in current lv 60 raids, and I can't see them adjusting these mechanics when we get the next expansion. Though some of the instant death mechanics may become survivable with higher hp/def at lv 70.

So in other words..

When it goes off and jams up and makes everything invulnerable because it cant kill me anymore... with a supposed insta death mechanic...

And I'm sitting in the middle of the instance unable to do anything or clear it because its not strong enough to kill me at 60th level unsynced... its like... my fault and stuff...

Gotcha...

Which floor are you talking about? I don't remember any weird phase skip like that in coil.