Are tanks a scapegoat for performance issues?

[ToasterMan]

This is so true. Unless of course there's a significant DPS check, but we can't have those in casual content now can we because that'd be mean.

You don't really see them in casual content because DPS jobs are significantly harder to play mechanically than a Healer or a Tank. Sure it's more visible when a Healer or Tank fails but MECHANICALLY, their jobs aren't that difficult to preform. Healers and Tanks don't have to deal with mechanics like Enochian and Wanderers Minute. It was already a nightmare going into Neverreap as a BLM. Imagine if they put strict DPS checks on top of it.

[Jpec07]

A tank's job is ultimately to control and focus the enemies' damage output to the best of their ability. Usually a wipe can be attributed to enemy damage getting out of control (e.g. Tank loses a mob that slaps the healer, tank overpulls, tank doesn't handle mechanics and eats a deadly tankbuster, healer is making a sandwich and doesn't help the tank recover enough, there is some mechanic that deals damage that they cannot control). In most cases, a wipe can be directly attributed to some inability of the tank to control the incoming damage. There are some other cases where a wipe is due to something else (a BLM refusing to use Enochian paired with a SMN who won't use Dreadwyrm Trance against the adds of the first boss in Baelsar's Wall and failing the DPS check, for example), but it usually is the tank's fault. A good tank learns from a wipe and adjusts. A bad tank just keeps doing it the same way.

[Awful]

It's mostly a community issue not wanting or adapting to how they've played the game this whole time it leads to:

If you can't pull the whole first room of Baelsar's Wall, you're bad.
If you can't heal giant pulls and DPS as a healer you're bad.
If you haven't figured out your DPS rotation yet and you're level 60 you're bad.

You mix that in with over half the playerbase not knowing how to: Cycle CDs as a tank/Proper CD pairings, how to stance dance as a healer, how to effectively DPS as a DPS with all the skills you have, then yeah that's what we're left with today in common DF.

Hell I was in Baelsar's Wall yesterday, and we couldn't do the first big pull because the healer didn't know how to Esuna, use Asylum, Tetra, Benediction, etc, and the DPS was a BRD and SMN, BRD didn't use Foes and 2 CDs (BfB, IR), and the SMN didn't use Shadowflare or Dreadwyrm Trance. Did we succeed? No. I cycled my CDs, and used LD but the healer died before me and we wiped 3 times before we finally had 6 adds left.

I honestly wish people would learn how to at least play their class instead of coming into DF demanding big pulls and -15 minute clears when they can't even handle it back when Gordias was a thing. So from my perspective I don't blame the tanks/healers/DPS just whoever isn't playing optimally as this has been an ongoing issue since whenever and it hasn't gotten any better, so no I don't think tanks are scapegoats just the bad players who play those roles stick out more.

[Inosaska]

snip

That's why they're making the game easier by reviewing the abilities. They plan on closing the gap for dps to be fairly close. I would have to guess the same thing will be done with tanks and healers.

[Lyth]

Although this is a cooperative game, the average player treats combat as if it's single player. Instead of learning and understanding the fights as a whole, they learn it only as it relates to their specific job. If you ask someone what a particular mechanic does, they probably won't know it unless it directly relates to them. For that matter, players often don't know what their own abilities are for if they don't directly benefit their own gameplay (What's Shadewalker?) Most interpersonal conflicts between players during raiding happen when the fight didn't play out exactly the way that they expected it to in their head, forcing them to adapt and respond on the fly.

One of the reasons why dps roles are so popular is because you can get away with this type of mindset. There's just you and the target dummy, with the game throwing set mechanics that you've been trained to either respond to or ignore. You can treat healing like this as well, as the core of your role revolves around responding to a pattern of timed attacks. When someone takes avoidable damage or dies, however, you suddenly get yanked out of single player mode and are forced to respond. Healers don't get frustrated by having to heal expected damage. They get frustrated by having to heal unexpected damage. Granted, skilled healers have situational awareness and are good team players, but your garden-variety healer is capable of tunnelling on their whack-a-mole mini-game just as hard as any dps can.

Tanking is fundamentally different. Because the mobs are linked to your position, and everyone else's position is linked to the mobs, you are either directly or indirectly responsible for every event that happens on the battlefield. Your goal is to set up the fight so that it happens exactly the way the other seven players are expecting it to happen (irrespective of whether those expectations are incompatible with each other). In order to do this, you need to understand what every mechanic does, to have situational awareness of what every player is trying to do, to try and facilitate their gameplay, and to tie everything together as best as you can. Your job is to take seven independent single player games and wrangle it into one cooperative game.

[Jim_Berry]

Although this is a cooperative game, the average player treats combat as if it's single player. Instead of learning and understanding the fights as a whole, they learn it only as it relates to their specific job. If you ask someone what a particular mechanic does, they probably won't know it unless it directly relates to them. For that matter, players often don't know what their own abilities are for if they don't directly benefit their own gameplay (What's Shadewalker?) Most interpersonal conflicts between players during raiding happen when the fight didn't play out exactly the way that they expected it to in their head, forcing them to adapt and respond on the fly.

*SNIP*

Not to mention being told to have some knowledge by watching a video. I joined an A11S learning party a while back and watch a video about 3 times before the group filled. We go in, and the video I watched did not matched the way the group wanted to run mechanics.

People also need to discuss "new" strats BEFORE entering, because in most PUGs, players know the "known" way to handle the fight.

[ChloeGrace]

The DPS meta has forced the community to adopt this attitude, and the devs have done nothing to discourage it. In fact, quite the opposite.

Healers get told they are being carried when their dps is below expectations.
Tanks are ridiculed for being able to match (or exceed) pure DPS jobs' output while still maintaining full enmity control.
That's the way the game was (really poorly) designed and built.

[dragonseth07]

The DPS meta has forced the community to adopt this attitude, and the devs have done nothing to discourage it. In fact, quite the opposite.

Healers get told they are being carried when their dps is below expectations.
Tanks are ridiculed for being able to match (or exceed) pure DPS jobs' output while still maintaining full enmity control.
That's the way the game was (really poorly) designed and built.

If the community develops a higher standard for expected play, that is a GOOD thing. Increasing the skill level of the playerbase should be a goal.

[ChloeGrace]

If the community develops a higher standard for expected play, that is a GOOD thing. Increasing the skill level of the playerbase should be a goal.

Except that it's not increasing "skill level", it's only maximizing dps during downtime when you aren't actively playing your role (i.e. enmity control or healing). That's not skill.
When an encounter is adjusted to require players to use their abilities to perform their roles 100% of the time in order to clear, then it develops player skill.

[dragonseth07]

Except that it's not increasing "skill level", it's only maximizing dps during downtime when you aren't actively playing your role (i.e. enmity control or healing). That's not skill.
When an encounter is adjusted to require players to use their abilities to perform their roles 100% of the time in order to clear, then it develops player skill.

A proper rotation is beyond the skill level of most players in this game. I would say asking for better dummy DPS is still a skill improvement.