Anyone else wish RDM was a PURE support class?

[Lambdafish]

I don't know. That clip of a Red Mage didn't really show much as far as Elements go beyond some Fire at the end. There was a distinctly White-Mage looking spell like a Mini-Holy (Dia perhaps?) in there though. I think Red Magic being derived from White and Black Magic means exactly that; its from White and Black Magic. Not from Thaumaturgy and Conjury.

You are correct. The way "white magic" works is that they draw aether from the earth to use their spells, and "black magic" is when aether is drawn from the body. RDM isn't utilising the teachings of both Thaumaturgy and Conjury, rather they use the crystal medium to draw aether from both themselves and the earth, mix it together like a cookpot, and use this mix of aether to perform "Red Magic", which draws from all 6 elements.

[Vexander]

You are correct. The way "white magic" works is that they draw aether from the earth to use their spells, and "black magic" is when aether is drawn from the body. RDM isn't utilising the teachings of both Thaumaturgy and Conjury, rather they use the crystal medium to draw aether from both themselves and the earth, mix it together like a cookpot, and use this mix of aether to perform "Red Magic", which draws from all 6 elements.

I may be wrong but I don't think that is correct either. Both White and Black Magic drew aether from the world around the mage performing the magic. In this the two arts were similar, and were draining the aether in the world. Only when that drain became dangerous during the War of the Magi did it spark a Calamity.

Conjurers gain their power from the Elementals in part, as well as themselves, while Thaumaturges draw aether strictly from within, using Umbral and Astral attunements to rapidly replenish, and empower, their spells.

What Red Mages do as far as a source for their power, we don't know yet sadly.

[Lambdafish]

I may be wrong but I don't think that is correct either. Both White and Black Magic drew aether from the world around the mage performing the magic. In this the two arts were similar, and were draining the aether in the world. Only when that drain became dangerous during the War of the Magi did it spark a Calamity.

Conjurers gain their power from the Elementals in part, as well as themselves, while Thaumaturges draw aether strictly from within, using Umbral and Astral attunements to rapidly replenish, and empower, their spells.

What Red Mages do as far as a source for their power, we don't know yet sadly.

Having reread my lore book, you seem to be right that my theory is wrong. It states a few things that we can use to hypothesize how RDM works though:

A few things to note:
- RDM channels aether through the magicked crystal medium
- All elements are astrally or umbrally aspected, and WHM and BLM have the potential to tap into all elements (a WHM could use umbral fire, and it would make sense).
- Both draw aether from the land (explained in an entry about the War of the Magi, saying that both parties began to kill the planet from drawing too much aether from the land)
- RDM is unlikely to be tied to the elementals in any way

My theory is that RDM works more like SCH, and is a sharlayan job which is formed from intense study of aether, using the crystal medium as a way to channel aether, and concetrate it, allowing for massive control over the elements, and their aspects.

[Vexander]

A few things to note:
- RDM channels aether through the magicked crystal medium.

We don't know this for sure or not yet. All we know is that the Magicked Crystal Medium is there. Its function is yet to be determined. While I don't doubt your speculation to be correct, there could be any number of functions it serves from drawing minute amounts of aether from the world and mixing it with the Red Mage's aether, to just being the part of the weapon that enables spellcasting. Old lore from 1.0 stated Conjurers needed tools made from living wood to work their magic (wands/staves) and Thaumaturges needed enchanted stones bound to their weapons to work their magic (gems in rods and staves).

My theory is that RDM works more like SCH, and is a Sharlayan job which is formed from intense study of aether, using the crystal medium as a way to channel aether, and concentrate it, allowing for massive control over the elements, and their aspects.

I'm inclined to agree that Red Mage is a Sharlayan job given the overall aesthetic and the presence of Sharlayan in the narrative as the defacto Mage Nation of the modern age. There have been theories that Sharlayan was formed by dissident White and Black Mages during the War of the Magi, who fled Eorzea to study in peace. The Red Mage would've been the love child of this union, a combination of White and Black Magic. There have also been other theories that the Sharlayans recently uncovered enough information about Mhach and Amdapor and their arts and were able to create a new kind of magic from that knowledge; Red Magic.

Theories and speculation are fun, but I'm rather eager to learn what Red Mage's actual Lore will be.

[LineageRazor]

Theories and speculation are fun, but I'm rather eager to learn what Red Mage's actual Lore will be.

We have some new lore, from the updated Stormblood page!

On the eastern edge of Abalathia's Spine lies the mountainous region of Gyr Abania.

It is in these elevated lands that people took shelter, when a burning star guided them away from the Sixth Umbral Calamity's treacherous floodwaters. The survivors gathered from near and far, and amongst them were refugees of the sorcerous cities of Mhach and Amdapor.

These sworn enemies buried their history for the sake of the future, and cast aside their vestments of black and white. Upon the remnants of their arts a new discipline was built, and the first red mages stepped forward with rapiers in hand to fight back against the rising tides of destruction.

So, it seems that RDM are not Sharlayan in origin, but from an alliance of Mhachi and Amdapoori refugees. Its origins lie with White and Black magic.

[ADVSS]

We have some new lore, from the updated Stormblood page!



So, it seems that RDM are not Sharlayan in origin, but from an alliance of Mhachi and Amdapoori refugees. Its origins lie with White and Black magic.

Wow almost totally nailed it, though i thought theyd be more like van hellsings or witch hunters after the calamity due to the calamity

[Dualgunner]

Wow almost totally nailed it, though i thought theyd be more like van hellsings or witch hunters after the calamity due to the calamity

Oh hell if Red Mage were a witch hunter type job I'd never not be a RDM I love that concept.

Still though, I like the concept :3

[jameseoakes]

We have some new lore, from the updated Stormblood page!



So, it seems that RDM are not Sharlayan in origin, but from an alliance of Mhachi and Amdapoori refugees. Its origins lie with White and Black magic.

Not sure I like that lore as it seems kinda strange that given the crack down on magic after the horrors of the Magi War stuff a bunch of Super mages would crop up and for reason not abuse there massive power given they would be the only real power after the end of the 6th Umberal Era

[Vexander]

We have some new lore, from the updated Stormblood page!

So, it seems that RDM are not Sharlayan in origin, but from an alliance of Mhachi and Amdapoori refugees. Its origins lie with White and Black magic.

Thanks for sharing!

Guess I like the Sharlayan theory a lot more to be honest, but either way. We still need more lore before a lot of questions can be answered.

Are Red Mages Ala Mhigans?
If yes, why weren't they displaced by the Occupation of Ala Mhigo?
If no, how have they remained hidden for so long?
How did Red Mages ever form after the Floods when the lore makes it seem like there were constant witch hunts against all forms of magic?

So many more questions now...

[Dualgunner]

You are correct. The way "white magic" works is that they draw aether from the earth to use their spells, and "black magic" is when aether is drawn from the body. RDM isn't utilising the teachings of both Thaumaturgy and Conjury, rather they use the crystal medium to draw aether from both themselves and the earth, mix it together like a cookpot, and use this mix of aether to perform "Red Magic", which draws from all 6 elements.

I recall from the Conjurer questline that the girl was actually drawing upon her own aether to use conjury. It was extremely bad and killing her, I remember that as well, but I do wonder if the source of the magic is the only difference really?

Note: I'm interested in learning so if you do know and can just blow that out of the water go ahead x3