Please remove the weekly lock out of stuff

[Bourne_Endeavor]

It's really not possible to have a productive conversation on this topic if you want to keep conflating the specific issue of gear with the broader concept of having any reason whatsoever to do the content. Ponies are decidedly not gear related and are the perfect example of things that will keep people doing content even if you let them gear up quickly and easily. There are still pony farm groups, actual pony farms, not birds, even to this day. The gear is worthless, but the cosmetic reward never loses value so long as there are people who don't have it and want it. Gear is a very temporary incentive even at the best of times.

So what, you're going to put mounts in every piece content in the entire game? That inherently devalues them. Your idea of a "productive conversation" seems to hinge on "weekly lock outs suck and need to be abandoned" with no willingness to accept the inevitably consequences such a decision renders. If people can have everything at all one time, they have no reason to continuously play. It's why nearly every mutli-player game builds micro-translation around avoiding an exceedingly long grind. There always has to be some hurdle, be it tediously grinds, weekly lockouts or RNG. Gear being a temporary incentive is why it works. People want power not just cosmetics. There is no sense of progression if you can literally get everything from the word go. All you accomplish is wearing your playerbase out. Right now, people farm mounts as a side activity. What you're purposing is it becomes the literal selling feature of the game since everything else is unlocked. That has diminishing returns, more so than gear ever will.

[Arkune]

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Again, also Raiders want Gear Progression thats why Ilevel worthing so much in todays MMORPGs. It is also not healthy for the Game to Keep Raiders on the tight leash in a way of Gear Progression, which this game does.
In my opinion Raiders are allowed to be "entitled gits" (taking your wording here), if its healthy for the community or not is another Story.

It is by far not "GOOD" to drive away the Raidersgroup from this Game because we have to Focus on the non-raiders here. If SE thinks that Cosmetics/Mounts and Titels are enough to Keep the Raiding Players in this Game then SE will be totally wrong on the Long road. Do i Need to mention the Ilevel 280 Diadem Weapons threads here?

At the end, its in SEs Hand to decide how to Build their Game.

While i get some of your Points, you basicly not seems to see my Points or want it to understand my Point of view. Thats why this discussion Ends for me here.

[Centershock]

All you accomplish is wearing your playerbase out.

It's possible that the gear lockouts themselves are wearing the playerbase out at this stage of the game. Are hardcore raiders even raiding anymore since we're quite close to SB?

I believe that at this point, the OP is only asking for everything to not have a lockout because we are so late into HW and that there is literally no more point now.

We've had 26-27 weeks since the release of Alex Creator Savage and the implementation of Scrip tomes. (Patch 3.4 in general) While it's all and good that the lockout has been removed out of Alex Creator Savage, I believe they could have done better at this stage with raising the cap for Scrip tomes. They should let us just collect at the 2000 cap and be done with it. That way, we have all our classes/alts geared up and ready once SB hits.

[Nicodemus_Mercy]

So what, you're going to put mounts in every piece content in the entire game? That inherently devalues them. Your idea of a "productive conversation" seems to hinge on "weekly lock outs suck and need to be abandoned" with no willingness to accept the inevitably consequences such a decision renders. If people can have everything at all one time, they have no reason to continuously play. It's why nearly every mutli-player game builds micro-translation around avoiding an exceedingly long grind. There always has to be some hurdle, be it tediously grinds, weekly lockouts or RNG. Gear being a temporary incentive is why it works. People want power not just cosmetics. There is no sense of progression if you can literally get everything from the word go. All you accomplish is wearing your playerbase out. Right now, people farm mounts as a side activity. What you're purposing is it becomes the literal selling feature of the game since everything else is unlocked. That has diminishing returns, more so than gear ever will.

I have to agree here. There are certain benefits to daily/weekly lockouts, though it is possible to overuse them.

There's something to be said, however, about having at least some content that can be done ad nauseum if desired. Once upon a time, WoW had the wintersaber mount grind. You could have this lovely looking wintersaber mount if you sold your soul for days/weeks doing the same repeatable quests over and over to finally max your rep and get the mount. Down the road they changed it into a daily quest thing I think. No more putting in as much or as little time as you choose, but rather the choice is made for you. You do this thing once a day till you qualify for the mount. While for some it was a positive change, for others it was not.

Ideally I think having at least a few bits of content "open ended" in how much or little you can engage it to chase a desirable and unique reward isn't necessarily a bad thing. You just don't want it to be the standard. Many players are wont to burn themselves out chasing specific rewards so lockouts serve to pace both acquisition and player investment.

I will say however, that as close as we are to SB, it probably wouldn't do much harm to remove some of the lockouts now.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

It's possible that the gear lockouts themselves are wearing the playerbase out at this stage of the game. Are hardcore raiders even raiding anymore since we're quite close to SB?

I believe that at this point, the OP is only asking for everything to not have a lockout because we are so late into HW and that there is literally no more point now.

We've had 26-27 weeks since the release of Alex Creator Savage and the implementation of Scrip tomes. (Patch 3.4 in general) While it's all and good that the lockout has been removed out of Alex Creator Savage, I believe they could have done better at this stage with raising the cap for Scrip tomes. They should let us just collect at the 2000 cap and be done with it. That way, we have all our classes/alts geared up and ready once SB hits.

Oh, no. That I do find a silly. We still can't farm Shire weapons but can get better Alex ones? Nevertheless, this thread is asking for weekly lockouts to be removed completely. Or that has been the argument of those I've responded to. So 3.4 would release and you could farm all the scripture your heart desires. Some even wish to extent that wholesale. Basically, what we have currently with groups being able to jump into Savage and get everything they want for one job in a day being possible at release-- when it's brand new. That is what I have argued would disincentive players in the long term. What you're asking for though will happen in the coming weeks. They did this back with ARR; bumping the tomestone cap up to 900, then unlocking it before Heavensward dropped. My best guess is we'll see that update sometime in last April to early May.

I have to agree here. There are certain benefits to daily/weekly lockouts, though it is possible to overuse them.

There's something to be said, however, about having at least some content that can be done ad nauseum if desired. Once upon a time, WoW had the wintersaber mount grind. You could have this lovely looking wintersaber mount if you sold your soul for days/weeks doing the same repeatable quests over and over to finally max your rep and get the mount. Down the road they changed it into a daily quest thing I think. No more putting in as much or as little time as you choose, but rather the choice is made for you. You do this thing once a day till you qualify for the mount. While for some it was a positive change, for others it was not.

Ideally I think having at least a few bits of content "open ended" in how much or little you can engage it to chase a desirable and unique reward isn't necessarily a bad thing. You just don't want it to be the standard. Many players are wont to burn themselves out chasing specific rewards so lockouts serve to pace both acquisition and player investment.

I will say however, that as close as we are to SB, it probably wouldn't do much harm to remove some of the lockouts now.

I honestly would if they might go that route with the relic. It's no secret people hated how it was handled throughout Heavenward. Making it something you could theoretically work on from the expansion's launch onward is... interesting. WoW did so with Legion. I've heard mixed opinions though due to the rather tedious grind. Anywho, I agree. They should just unlock everything now. My guess is they're hoping people jump into PF to farm godcoats, twines and pages will help looking for a first clear. Can't say it'll work but the devs do like trying to push it.

[Nicodemus_Mercy]

Again, also Raiders want Gear Progression thats why Ilevel worthing so much in todays MMORPGs. It is also not healthy for the Game to Keep Raiders on the tight leash in a way of Gear Progression, which this game does.
In my opinion Raiders are allowed to be "entitled gits" (taking your wording here), if its healthy for the community or not is another Story.

It is by far not "GOOD" to drive away the Raidersgroup from this Game because we have to Focus on the non-raiders here. If SE thinks that Cosmetics/Mounts and Titels are enough to Keep the Raiding Players in this Game then SE will be totally wrong on the Long road. Do i Need to mention the Ilevel 280 Diadem Weapons threads here?

At the end, its in SEs Hand to decide how to Build their Game.

While i get some of your Points, you basicly not seems to see my Points or want it to understand my Point of view. Thats why this discussion Ends for me here.

Encouraging people to be "entitled gits" is never good for the game. And raiders aren't the only ones who want gear progression. That's kinda what I have been saying. EVERYONE wants gear progression... but not everyone wants to raid. Having ALTERNATIVE ways to get similar gear progression is GOOD for the game. Keeping gear progression locked behind only one type of content is definitively NOT GOOD for the game.

That's why FFXIV does as well as it does. Those who don't wish to engage in raid content can still progress their gear nearly as high as those that do raid. And its a fact that non-raiders outnumber raiders by far. I get your point of view... but its a "selfish" point of view. I say selfish because it comes from the perspective of a single segment of players (raiders) who want exclusivity. They don't want anyone who doesn't do what they do to have anywhere near the player power/gear progression they do. And that's just not healthy for the game overall because as I said in multiple posts, raider or not, EVERYONE is motivated by gear progression. That's why the small gear gap we currently have in FFXIV is a good thing. Fostering a sense of second-class citizenry does NOTHING GOOD for the game. Treating the vast majority of the player base (non-raiders) as "less than" just to make a much smaller number of players feel better about themselves is not only bad for the game, its stupid.

No one is "driving raiders from the game". Outside of being close to a new xpac and people taking breaks, I don't see raiders leaving in droves due to how gearing works in FFXIV. They have a small ilvl edge, unique glamours, unique mounts, unique titles, and bragging rights in regards to clearing the hard content. They are adequately rewarded already. I don't agree that engaging in difficult content is a free pass to being an entitled git and it certainly is NOT HEALTHY for the game in any case. I am curious though, why you think its not healthy to keep raiders "on a tight leash" as far as gear progression goes? That leash applies to pretty much everyone, not just raiders. Again, EVERYONE wants gear progression, not just raiders, and again it comes down to raiders feeling like they deserve oh so much more than they get even though they already DO get more than everyone else already.

If you've got an 8 inch dick and the other guy has a 7.8 inch dick, you're already bigger than the other guy. So why do you feel like you need a 9 inch dick?

[Vaer]

It's possible that the gear lockouts themselves are wearing the playerbase out at this stage of the game. Are hardcore raiders even raiding anymore since we're quite close to SB?

They're trying to stretch what they have like crazy. They are trying to funnel people into Alexander Savage, Diadem, keeping the relic still a good weapon so people still spend time making it (By capping the alexander gear for i260 and still no i270 dip without going into Savage) and Zurvan weapons relevant. Unlocking the scripture cap would devalue Dun Scaith drops as well.

They could have unlocked scripture and dun scaith gear, but leave the weekly upgrade items locked for now since you aren't going to get above 260 without those and unlock those some time down the line to keep Savage worth doing.

People are still farming Savage at least on Primal so it is somewhat working. I've noticed queue times have gone up for roulettes so I think people are taking breaks and playing other games like Persona 5 now.

They didn't remove the weekly cap on poetics until HW came out so there is that too.

[Arkune]

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Nice Bait.
To be honest, noone said that non-raiders shouldnt have Gear Progression, but in my opinion you are pretty new to MMORPGs. If you had experience over Years in the raiding Scene, otherwise you could answer the question in your last sentence by your own.

Why does People always wants to earn more Money? Because you never can have enough Money. Same goes for your kinky example about dicks. It is called Human nature. People always want MORE. Thats the reason why MMORPGs turned this way we have it now. Non-Raiders and Casual Gamers found this genre and enjoyed it, but they didnt wanted to spend so much time in a "Game" but they also payed their Monthly Subs. Sure every Company would do everything to earn Money. And all about losing Raiders and stuff is because of a break will remain as speculation by your side.

Themepark MMOs tend to have linear Gearprogression -> Ilevel over Ilevel over Ilevel, over and over and over. If it goes on Topic, i already said - Caps should be per Job and not Character. And with the "on the tight leash" i meant that 5ilevels are a joke for the time you have spend into the raid. All stays and falls with the rewards. Glamour/Mounts/Titels can be farmed later on, if the Content is old. Nerf happens, new max Level is added, etc.. etc..

Ill take another example for other situations: PvP, People did alot PvP to get their Rank up for the cool Looks, later on SE lifted the rank requirements for those PvP Sets, so everyone could buy that Items just for PvP Points w/o any ranks. Alot People flamed them for do so, same goes for the Anima Steps, reducing the Prices for the Anima weapons also isnt a healthy way for the Players they did the anima steps from the beginning.

So, i.e. i would absolutly follow your Point of View if the Mounts/Titel and Gear will be just obtainable aslong the Raid Content remains as relvant. Which means at the Moment when a new xpac Releases, there will be no rewards anymore for doin that raid, just an achievment for Clearing and the Storytelling.

And before you ask yourself, why do i see Things like this, for me it doesnt Count If i am the first one or last one who obtained Mount XYZ or Gear XYZ, aslong as These Items remain as "Rare" aslong as this Game exists.

[Nicodemus_Mercy]

Nice Bait.

Wasn't bait... and your "opinion" of my experience with mmo raiding is inaccurate. I've been playing MMO's for nigh on 2 decades and raided for most of them. Just because I don't subscribe to the paradigm you foster doesn't mean I don't have experience in raiding or a keen understanding of how mmo's work or how player psychology works.

Raiders weren't leaving FFXIV in droves before Stomrblood, they aren't going to magically start now. Any decline in raiding at this stage is a decline in people playing overall due to the lull between xpacs. This is not new nor unique to FFXIV. Considering you imply having experience with MMO's you should know that to be true. All mmo's have a lull between xpacs and all suffer a loss in subs during this time. That's not speculation, that's the time proven fact of the mmo life cycle. With 20 years of mmo experience, including some experience in mmo development, I have a fairly good grasp of the design process, the goals and the player psychology.

Reducing the anima steps was a GREAT design decision. Why? Because as time goes on, making more content accessible encourages players to engage in that content they otherwise wouldn't. If you think the periodic nerfing of anima steps over time is a bad thing they you really have a poor grasp of mmo design, mmo's as a business, and the player psychology that these decisions are intended to exploit. You seem to suffer from the same issue many gamers do... you care far too much about what other people have, or get, or how easily they get it. I finished the umbrite stage before the nerf. Was I sore over the umbrite nerf? Nope. Why? Because it doesn't matter that the guys who came after me had an easier time. They are late to the party and I've moved on to other things while they are still working on an anima I finished ages ago. If they have an easier time, I say good on them! I'm glad you'll get to enjoy the same thing I am enjoying. That you get to enjoy with less effort is irrelevant because my sense of self worth is not predicated on comparing myself to others. And that right there is your problem.

Your sense of achievement is tied to how it compares to others. You're not appreciating just doing what your doing and getting what you're getting for the sake of doing or getting it. Something doesn't have to be exclusive to have value. So what if people can go back to do old content to get a mount or title? That ship sailed ages ago. It doesn't diminish your accomplishment doing that content when it was current. And if it makes you feel like it does, then maybe you still have some maturing to do. You said your accomplishments "don't count" if other people can do it/get it easier than you did. Ask yourself why you feel that way and really explore the answer. When you stop basing your self worth by comparing your accomplishments to others, you might find yourself enjoying games.... hell LIFE... a lot more.

SE benefits from people going back to do old content on their over-leveled/over-geared characters because it increases the return on the initial investment they made to create that content. Creating content is expensive in both time and money. The more use that content gets the more value SE sees from that investment. Removing the incentives to do that content (the mounts etc), goes entirely against SE's interests. SE doesn't give a flying fart in space about our egos or special snowflake syndrome. They care about getting a good return on their investment and that means appealing to as many players as possible. Times change and the paradigms of old have gone the way of the dinosaur. It's the age of accessibility and its not going away until a new age and a new paradigm comes along. You either adapt with the changing times or you get left behind. It was a hard lesson for me to learn too, particularly since I'm at the age where I'm fairly set in my ways and am resistant to change. :P

[Nixxe]

So what, you're going to put mounts in every piece content in the entire game? That inherently devalues them. Your idea of a "productive conversation" seems to hinge on "weekly lock outs suck and need to be abandoned" with no willingness to accept the inevitably consequences such a decision renders. If people can have everything at all one time, they have no reason to continuously play. It's why nearly every mutli-player game builds micro-translation around avoiding an exceedingly long grind. There always has to be some hurdle, be it tediously grinds, weekly lockouts or RNG. Gear being a temporary incentive is why it works. People want power not just cosmetics. There is no sense of progression if you can literally get everything from the word go. All you accomplish is wearing your playerbase out. Right now, people farm mounts as a side activity. What you're purposing is it becomes the literal selling feature of the game since everything else is unlocked. That has diminishing returns, more so than gear ever will.

It's rather obvious that you're not taking the time to make sure you understand what I'm saying before rushing to swat it down.